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Did you forget someone this holiday? You know, the same one you forget everyday...

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posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 10:05 PM
a reply to: DontTreadOnMe

I tend to think modern life has broken families and I'm not sure how, as a society, we fix it. For every abandoned elderly person there is some grandparent raising their grandchild or families living in extended stay hotels or homeless shelters or kids flunking out of school or "retired" folks working odd jobs to supplement their social security because they don't have retirement funds.

edit on 12/28/2017 by kosmicjack because: (no reason given)

posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 10:21 PM
a reply to: kosmicjack

Sadly, I don't think we can fix it.
Especially with urban sprawl, and family sprawl.
And smaller families and split families.

posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 10:38 PM
all I can say is that when I`m old I want to die in my own home that I spent so many happy years in and not in some sterilized,sanitized industrial decored facility staffed by minimum wage workers.
quality of life is more important than quantity of life. I don`t want to exist in some facility just so my kids and grandkids can say "well at least he lived a few more years".

young people think they are doing a good deed by prolonging the life of an old person by a few years but being alive isn`t the same thing as living.
let old people die at home in familiar comfortable surroundings,what is the purpose of prolonging their existence by a few years by sending them to an industrial impersonal facility to spend the last years of their lives and to die?

I would rather die at home alone in familiar surroundings with all the memories that those surroundings bring,than in a "sterilized" facility full of strangers

edit on 28-12-2017 by bluechevytree because: (no reason given)

edit on 28-12-2017 by bluechevytree because: (no reason given)

posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 11:46 PM
a reply to: bluechevytree
Please make your wishes known to your family and friends. AND to your medical professionals.
Knowing your wishes will make it easier for your family to act appropriately.

I've just experienced a death at home, surrounded by family and friends. Everyone of us understood why my Beloved chose to discontinue treatment for the pneumonia that he knew would take his life. He was at peace with his decision and thus we who loved him are at peace as well.

I hope and pray to fall over dead in my garden.

Talk this over with your family before it becomes an issue. Please. They need to understand your feelings.

posted on Dec, 29 2017 @ 11:05 AM
Myself, my sister, her hubby and their kids all live with our mom so she'll never be in a facility. The only close family not living with us and helping are our 3 adult kids just getting started in life who have every intention of carrying on the tradition for us. Mom grew up with her grandparents(one direct from poland one from sweden) living in their family home.

The sad part is, Americans look at us like we are insane, while pretty much every other nationality looks at us like "So? that's how it should be. Multi-generational homes where each younger generation takes care of the Elders." What does that tell you? I hear "American Family Values" on the radio, news whatever, and I just laugh sadly.

Honestly this country has no clue for the most part what that means. Kids are raised by babysitters/daycare so people can own that million dollar home and 50k+ car when cheaper would work just as well.Whereas if they downsized(price wise), one parent could stay home. Or getting jobs where they are on opposite schedules so one parent is always there. Or having a freakin grandparent living with them to help both the grandparent and the kids, if they just can't give up their million dollar lifestyle.

I've never understood our(American) rush to basically say F you to family and ditch each other as fast as possible. No way is every family in America full of abusers or bad seeds etc. It's selfishness to me. Pack up your family and be the change for the person you should care for.

With 3 generations of family in the home it makes for fun times, and paying the bills is easier too, instead of she alone relying on her fixed income. Three households income combined means a better quality of life for everyone. Even if 4 adults and 4 kids, 8 dogs, 4 cats, 3 birds, 2 lizards and 4 fish in a 2100 sqft house is..... interesting lol

posted on Dec, 29 2017 @ 01:01 PM
a reply to: kosmicjack

I write this because it may provide you with some piece of mind. What I'm about to tell you may come as a bit of a surprise. It's most likely not what you think.

So, as you likely know, Mom passed away Sunday (Christmas Eve). She lived at a place where they had all the levels of elderly care from independent living, to assisted living, to nursing home...and hospice. It wasn't cheap, but once you were were "in".

Her and Dad originally picked this place so they wouldn't be a burden on the kids when they got older, which was a kind gesture on their part. They moved there in their mid-late 70's, and it was just like a nice apartment complex. They were both still driving and physically were both in excellent health. Not wanting to seem like they were picking a "favorite" child, they chose a location which was equidistant from all the kids (meaning it wasn't close to any of us, from my perspective).

About 3 years ago in March Dad also passed away. He ran the full gamut of care - independent, to assisted, to nursing and then hospice. Of course Mom was there to see the full transition. Mom was in excellent health both mentally and physically. Over time she had begun to slow down and physically her health began to slip away (gradually). We tried to do things to make her more capable (like get her a scooter for example). NO WAY!! Threatened to "disown" the first person who ever bought her one of those things!! "Once you get in one of those things, you never get out!", was what she would say. Unbeknownst to us (the kids) there were also other (probably minor at the time) health issues she wasn't telling anyone about. Those 'minor' health issues would eventually grow into more significant issues, and then all gang up on her at once, ending her life in less than a one week time frame. She never went to assisted care, or nursing home. She went straight from independent to hospice.

At the same time this was all going down, I spoke with a colleague at work who is in a similar situation with someone Mom's age. She's chosen a far different path, which I'll get to in a moment. ...

I've learned a lot of things in the short time since Mom's passing, things I wish I would have known or been more emphatic about while she was alive. I learned some things with Dad's passing, but more just a better understanding of the early signs and indicators of different health issues in hindsight. With Mom it was different. There were no signs (or very few). The most important thing I learned with Mom, very quickly, was she was 100% aware of all the death occurring around her...and she was afraid of it (even though she swore up and down she wasn't). Her mom, my Grandmother, lived to be 105 and lived completely on her own until 104. Mom was 93. Everyone on that side of the family (the women) have all lived to very old age. We all figured Mom was no different. She clearly (and secretly) felt that way too. What became obvious afterwards was, she was in a form of denial, not even being truthful with herself. One day she just didn't feel well and was having some "congestion". The next day she was in the ICU with a good prognosis. The next day, she had "six months". The day after that she had "60 days". Later that same afternoon she had a prognosis of "probably should get on an airplane right away if you want to see her alive again", in other words, hours. It was that fast. (pneumonia, congestive heart failure and kidney failure).

So, on to my colleague whom I referenced earlier, who is also the executor of an estate.

Note - I probably should start a part II of this post, as I must be nearing the word limit

posted on Dec, 29 2017 @ 01:23 PM
-------Part II-----

My colleague is also the executor of the estate, and in his case, his great aunt, said straight-up very early on "I will be in this house until the day I die. End of discussion!" There was no debate. So, for her they chose in-home care, which as it turns out is actually cheaper than the way Mom & Dad went. Now, his aunt, who is in worse health than Mom was (dementia among other things now) will probably have to leave at some point, but not before she's too out of it to care.

In retrospect, this might have been a better option, certainly for Mom. Her issue was, she got to watch the day to day grizzly side of Dad's death and it frightened her. She'd never admit it, but it did. She saw the suffering and the indignity of it all and just told herself she wouldn't do that. Then, when we went over to her place to start the cleanup effort it became quite obvious. She'd been shutting down for a while and just never told anyone...and because we were all far away, and she was alone, no one saw it.

In the beginning that whole 'never have to leave' type community seemed like a great idea. In the end, and in retrospect, I wish we'd have done it different. I wish we would have been more adamant about her being near at least one of us, but after you're "in", you're in forever, so that wasn't an option. Consequently, I see that solution as taking a lot of options off the table once one parent passes (which was the case here). Then the other parent just sits around waiting for the end...and crosses their fingers.

My next door neighbor and good friend probably did it the best way of all. When the quality of his life reached about 5%, he just went outside in the driveway, sat down and ate a bullet while his wife was at the store. Saved millions of dollars and a lot of tears and pain. I wouldn't advise anyone to take that option (though I might, who knows, when the time comes).

posted on Dec, 29 2017 @ 05:55 PM

originally posted by: Vector99
a reply to: kosmicjack

I would suggest finding an in-home care service. Find someone super friendly that the elderly relative will likely get along really well with. Start out with 1 day a week or every other week that the care giver comes by for 8 or so hours to help out and just spend time with them. Eventually the elderly relative will likely want the care person around more often, and it can become more full-time.

That way it doesn't seem life changing to your relative, and they don't lose their sense of personal worthiness. Ease into the situation with baby steps.

Excellent Idea!

My sister-in-law does this. She runs their errands for them, goes to the grocery store, does the house-cleaning etc.... Her clients really look forward to having her come and frequently request that she come more often.

edit on 29-12-2017 by Jusvistn because: (no reason given)

posted on Dec, 29 2017 @ 07:02 PM
Just a more practical note about the whole "turn-key" end of life solutions out there (and there are many).

Most have a very high entrance fee, my partent's was 3/4 of a million (not collateral, securities or!). Then, the monthly fees were $3-5k per month (but this included "dinner", the single most important thing to Mom...for some frustrating reason). The apartment they lived in was about 900 SF. They had larger, but 2x the size was 2x the cost...per month. In addition, you have to sign over all your assets, everything. When you run out of cash, they are entitled to your assets, return no other assets of relatives can be attached to your care. If you run completely out of money, the care is on them.

In reality, when the care gets to the really expensive levels (like $20,000 per month or more)...they don't live long. My mind is not made up on this. One could argue they speed the process along, damn the torpedoes. Another could argue it is the natural course of elderly expiration. I don't know.

I do know this best friend of all time was 1/2 Cherokee. When his dad passed away he had been sent to the Reservation for care, and he was cared for well. When his mom was too infirm to take care of herself, she too was sent to the Reservation, BUT, she wasn't Cherokee. My best friend, Stuart, said one day he and his wife went to visit his mom, and there was an old Cherokee woman chanting by her bed about how the white man had "burned her out" and wishing the same for his mom. Perhaps it was true for the mother of this woman, but not for her. She had been given six months to live.

They removed Stuart's mom from this place and took her to live with them over in Riverton, Wy. She lived quite happily for nearly 7 years, and died peacefully in her sleep one night.

That best friend, Stuart, probably the most talented guy I ever knew...died in a motorcycle crash 5 years ago.

Sometimes I wonder if I've said "good bye" more times than I've ever truly said "hello".

I wish you the best, KJ. I truly do. And, I trust you know, I know, what I'm speaking of.

God Bless.

posted on Dec, 29 2017 @ 07:59 PM
a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Thanks for so much great insight, particularly for taking the time so close to your own recent loss.

God Bless you as well.

Thanks to all who have replied, you've given us lots to consider and you have shown, once again, that this is still a great community.

posted on Dec, 30 2017 @ 12:58 AM
a reply to: kosmicjack

Is there maybe a relative who will want to move in with your elderly relative? That way the elderly relative can stay in their home.

posted on Dec, 30 2017 @ 09:39 AM
a reply to: DontTreadOnMe

Good question

posted on Dec, 30 2017 @ 04:21 PM
a reply to: kosmicjack

Just out of curiosity, how far from this person does the family live? Since the elderly person is no longer driving, can she(?) take care of his or herself? I know it's tough to talk about putting people in a home especially when they are set in their ways in a comfortable, familiar place, indeed sometimes it is best. Then again, as another member mentioned, perhaps in-home care is in order. If the elderly person is not suffering from dementia or alzheimer's and is physically able to get around, and can take care of his or herself, then I say let them stay where they are.

As far as being unappreciated, that reminds me of my grandmother. For all of her children and great grandchildren's birthdays she always sends a card/money. She rarely gets a thank you, even from the adult kids. I told her to no longer do that. For Christmas she buys everyone gifts, but she is rarely invited to their houses to give the gifts especially to the grandkids and greatgrandkids, which hurts her feelings, and sometimes when she does go (w/o explicit invitation) she doen't feel welcome. I told her she needs to let them come to her, then. Hell, two of her children live right next door, and one, at least, still rarely comes. This is the first year in a long time that the grandchildren have actually made it a point to come to her house to see her—for Christmas. She has a rather large house and quite a bit of acreage of land but she's well enough to take care of most things except the outdoors stuff.

So, yeah, for you it's #tty they use and neglect her. You said her staying here cold mean death. Insofar as what? Can they get around, need medical attention, or forgetful, etc?

I mean, if there is a very real potential for harm either through her own neglect or simply being physically unable, you need to have that talk with those who will not listen. Make them listen. Or tell them you'll take steps to do it yourself, for the safety of those involved.

So, I hope you get things worked out properly.

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