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Nothing perfect about the pattern, truth be told its rather chaotic hence our inability to behold or understand the underlying principles behind reality.
Why would we need to be redeemed by what amounts to an absentee patent at best and a genocidal megalomaniac with a massive inferiority complex towards its supposed choice creation at worst?
Think its God that needs our redemption and or forgiveness if truth be told.
originally posted by: andy06shake
a reply to: Deetermined
I think you have no idea about chaos theory or the part it plays regarding the emergence of order.
Complicated does not even begin to address the totality of the cosmos nor the reality we seem to experience as a direct result of such.
"You sound like the one with the inferiority complex. God's only "absentee" to those who ignore and reject Him."
Well if he turns up like and wants a word in my shell i will certainly entertain the voices. LoL
How can i reject something im not sure exists?
And to be honest you don't know for sure any more than myself, else prove it!
originally posted by: andy06shake
Then again the Vatican kind of own the rights to Christianity, and by default Jesus, in a similar fashion to the way Walt Disney Studios own Mr Mouse.
...Thousands in Jerusalem responded and became believers. This, however, did not sit well with the Jewish authorities. Just as they had opposed Jesus, they now opposed his apostles and disciples. Why did the Jewish religious leaders so fiercely reject Jesus?
Rejected by Religious Leaders
By the time Jesus came to earth, Jewish religious thinking and practices had strayed far from what was taught in the inspired Scriptures. The religious leaders of the day—the Sadducees, Pharisees, and scribes—upheld man-made traditions, putting them ahead of God’s written Word. Time and again they accused Jesus of breaking the Law because he performed miraculous cures on the Sabbath. By forcefully refuting their unscriptural teachings, Jesus challenged both their authority and their claims of having an approved standing with God. By contrast, Jesus came from a humble background and lacked their formal religious education. No wonder it was so difficult for such proud men to acknowledge Jesus as the Messiah! Such confrontations so enraged them that they “took counsel against [Jesus] that they might destroy him.”—Matthew 12:1-8, 14; 15:1-9.
How, though, could the religious leaders explain away Jesus’ ability to perform miracles? They did not deny that the miracles occurred. Instead, they blasphemously tried to undermine faith in Jesus by attributing his power to Satan, saying: “This fellow does not expel the demons except by means of Beelzebub, the ruler of the demons.”—Matthew 12:24.
There was another deep-seated reason for their adamant refusal to acknowledge Jesus as the Messiah. After Jesus resurrected Lazarus, leaders of the various religious factions consulted together and said: “What are we to do, because this man performs many signs? If we let him alone this way, they will all put faith in him, and the Romans will come and take away both our place and our nation.” For fear of losing their power and position, the religious leaders conspired to kill both Jesus and Lazarus!—John 11:45-53; 12:9-11.
Community Prejudice and Persecution
The attitude of first-century Jewish religious leaders created a social climate that was hostile to anyone accepting Jesus as the Messiah. Taking pride in their prominent positions, they belittled anyone showing faith in Jesus, saying: “Not one of the rulers or of the Pharisees has put faith in him, has he?” (John 7:13, 48) Some Jewish leaders, such as Nicodemus and Joseph of Arimathea, did become disciples of Jesus, but they kept their faith secret out of fear. (John 3:1, 2; 12:42; 19:38, 39) The Jewish leaders had decreed that “if anyone confessed [Jesus] as Christ, he should get expelled from the synagogue.” (John 9:22) Such a person would be shunned and scorned as a social outcast.
Learn From Those Who Rejected Jesus
As we have seen, misconceptions, community pressure, and persecution prevented many in the first century from putting faith in Jesus. Today, erroneous ideas about Jesus and his teachings can have a similar effect. For example, many have been taught that God’s Kingdom is in their heart or will come about by human efforts. Others are persuaded to look to science or technology for solutions to mankind’s problems, thus doing away with the need to put faith in the Messiah. Many modern critics assert that the events of Jesus’ ministry recorded in the Bible are not historical facts; these men thus undermine faith in Jesus as the Messiah.
The result of such ideas and theories is that many have either been confused as to the role of the Messiah or see no need to consider the matter. However, for those who are willing to examine the evidence, there is actually more proof today that Jesus is the Messiah than there was in the first century. We have the entire Hebrew Scriptures containing numerous prophecies about what the Messiah would do and the record in the four Biblical Gospels of what Jesus did in fulfillment of those prophecies.*
There is really no lack of evidence by which each one of us can make an informed choice or decision in this matter.
*: See the chart “Prophecies Regarding the Messiah” on page 200 of the book What Does the Bible Really Teach? published by Jehovah’s Witnesses.
originally posted by: JoshuaCox
They were expecting, One who would deliver them from bondage, and after jesus died. They were stil in bondage....
Why Did They Reject the Messiah?
WHEN Jesus was on earth, the crowds were enthralled by the things he said and amazed by the miracles he performed. As a result, many “put faith in him” and accepted him as the foretold Messiah, or Christ. They reasoned: “When the Christ arrives, he will not perform more signs than this man has performed, will he?”—John 7:31.
Despite the overwhelming evidence in support of Jesus’ identity as the Messiah, the majority of those who saw and heard Jesus did not become believers. Sadly, even some who initially believed turned away later. Why did so many reject Jesus as the Messiah in spite of the powerful evidence? Let us consider the reasons, and as we do, ask yourself, ‘Could I be in danger of making a similar mistake today?’
At the time of Jesus’ birth, many Jews were expecting the appearance of the Messiah. When Jesus was brought as an infant to the temple, he was met by those “waiting for Jerusalem’s deliverance” by the promised Messiah. (Luke 2:38) Later, many who observed the works of John the Baptizer wondered: “May he perhaps be the Christ?” (Luke 3:15) What, though, were the Jews in the first century expecting the Messiah to do?
The common belief among the Jews in those days was that the Messiah would come and liberate them from the oppressive Roman yoke and restore the earthly kingdom of Israel. Before Jesus began his ministry, a number of charismatic leaders arose and advocated violent resistance to the existing political rule. What these men did likely influenced the people’s expectations of the Messiah.
Jesus stood in stark contrast to such false Messiahs. He did not promote violence but taught his listeners to love their enemies and to be submissive to the authorities. (Matthew 5:41-44) He rejected the people’s efforts to make him a king. Instead, he taught that his kingdom was to be “no part of this world.” (John 6:15; 18:36) Still, preconceived ideas about the Messiah exerted a very strong influence on the people.
John the Baptizer personally saw and heard miraculous evidence establishing Jesus’ identity as God’s Son. Yet, when John was imprisoned, he sent his disciples to ask Jesus: “Are you the Coming One, or are we to expect a different one?” (Matthew 11:3) Perhaps John wondered if Jesus was indeed the promised Deliverer, who would fulfill the Jews’ expectations.
Jesus’ apostles found it difficult to understand that he would be killed and then resurrected. On one occasion when Jesus explained that it would be necessary for the Messiah to suffer and die, Peter “took him aside and started rebuking him.” (Mark 8:31, 32) Peter was not yet able to see how Jesus’ death could fit in with his role as the Messiah.
Upon entering Jerusalem shortly before Passover 33 C.E., Jesus was welcomed by enthusiastic crowds hailing him as King. (John 12:12, 13) How quickly the situation changed! Within the week, Jesus was arrested and executed. After Jesus’ death, two of his disciples lamented: “We were hoping that this man was the one destined to deliver Israel.” (Luke 24:21) Even when the resurrected Jesus appeared to his disciples, the idea that the Messiah would establish an earthly kingdom still lingered. They asked: “Lord, are you restoring the kingdom to Israel at this time?” Clearly, mistaken expectations about the Messiah were deeply entrenched in the hearts and minds of Jesus’ listeners.—Acts 1:6.
After Jesus’ ascension to heaven and the outpouring of the holy spirit, his disciples came to understand clearly that the Messiah would rule as a heavenly King. (Acts 2:1-4, 32-36) The apostles Peter and John boldly preached about Jesus’ resurrection and gave evidence of God’s backing by performing miracles themselves. (Acts 3:1-9, 13-15) Thousands in Jerusalem responded and became believers. This, however, did not sit well with the Jewish authorities. Just as they had opposed Jesus, they now opposed his apostles and disciples. Why did the Jewish religious leaders so fiercely reject Jesus?
As we have seen, misconceptions, community pressure, and persecution prevented many in the first century from putting faith in Jesus. Today, erroneous ideas about Jesus and his teachings can have a similar effect. For example, many have been taught that God’s Kingdom is in their heart or will come about by human efforts.
originally posted by: JoshuaCox
To them, the Bible says nothing about a “son of god” , ...