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Chess master refuses to wear required saudi clothes, forfeits title

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posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 12:12 AM
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originally posted by: Willtell
a reply to: Guardian10




Education was universal in Muslim Spain, while in Christian Europe, 99 percent of the population was illiterate, and even kings could neither read nor write. The Moors boasted a remarkably high literacy rate for a pre-modern society. During an era when Europe had only two universities, the Moors had seventeen. The founders of Oxford University were inspired to form the institution after visiting universities in Spain. According to the United Nations’ Education body, the oldest university operating in the world today, is the University of Al-Karaouine of Morocco founded during the height of the Moorish Empire in 859 A.D. by a Black woman named Fatima al-Fihri.



Islam is a religion...IT ENRICHED WHOLE CIVILIZATIONS!


LINK


Actually, it conquered whole civilizations.




posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 12:32 AM
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a reply to: Phage

Even if the Saudis gave her "other options" they still were restricting the right of this woman to decide how she should dress. Was she going to go to the chess match in bikini? I would think that she is smart enough to know not to wear something like that. However, the Saudis wanted her to cover her whole body.

Kudos to this woman. Not to mention the fact that she was protesting for the overall treatment of women in Saudi Arabia.

One has to remember that the Saudis gave citizenship status to a robot, "a dead thing" which will never replace or even be a human. Meanwhile the Saudis don't give such recognition to "real human women."



posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 12:39 AM
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originally posted by: Willtell

And what did the christian hordes of Europe do to Africa, Asia, China?

To the Jews, The Cathars, the first European genocide


OH, that did not happen


You look at history through a distorted lens and try to fit things in to your own prejudices


That's not a method to any kind of truth or reality



But you rather ignore that the Christian crusades were a response to the Islamic crusaders who were trying to conquer all of Europe by the sword...

Kind of ironic for you to be talking about "truth" yet you want to ignore the most obvious truth... The last order that Muhammed gave to Muslims was to conquer all lands at any cost.

Fortunately there are Muslims, mostly those who were born or really escaped the ME to live in peace and were educated in the west, who do not follow those orders. But quite a large percentage of them do follow those last orders of Muhammed throughout the world to this day.


edit on 28-12-2017 by ElectricUniverse because: correct excerpt.



posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 03:10 AM
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originally posted by: xenon129
Thanks for posting. I follow chess and was looking at the results early today and couldn't find her. I was wondering where she was. In previous tournaments in the middle east, she has worn the head dress. Good for her for taking a stance. Idk why the middle east hosts these tournaments. The devote muslims are against chess and view it as forbidden in islam for some reason.
I think chess is forbidden as it torments the mind



posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 04:31 AM
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Conflicted about this one - it is this woman's right to pull out of the tournament for whatever reason she wants, but it is also the right of the Saudi govt. (or tournament organisers) to enforce a dress code.

To be honest, I would have thought there are plenty of other reasons to boycott Saudi Arabian events (or business) than clothes.



posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 05:07 AM
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a reply to: Grambler

Oh them unfortunate Saudis with their legalized death by stoning or legalized marital rape, I am appalled by this sincere approach to address the abuse because of course the Shieks will be in the clear because crude oil.

When the dead fish fuel runs out, they will be screwed and they will be invaded for what's left so they are in no position to barter.




edit on 28-12-2017 by Thecakeisalie because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 05:45 AM
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a reply to: Guardian10

Yeah I know a lot of people from Perth as well. When you have something on topic feel free to share?

BTW I stand up for women and children when the occasion calls for it.



posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 07:23 AM
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a reply to: xenon129

Okay, so as a non-Muslim who actually "lived" in a Muslim country for several years, and a person who understands a good bit of their culture, I will weigh in here...

There's an old saying which goes, "Choose your battles carefully". With that in mind I offer the following:

1. Women's rights aside for a moment, the attire on the girl in the top picture would, at minimum, be considered highly offensive and rude (at a bare minimum) in most "Muslim" countries. I'm not talking about anything other than her attire in this thought, and I'm not expressing an opinion about it one way or the other. Like it or not, certain countries have customs which support their culture, and dress codes are among these.

2. If the rules were, you have to wear a monkey suit to compete in this country, then those are the rules, and a monkey suit you will wear...or, you have every option to abstain. You knew the rules in advance, you knew (or should have known) the customs. Again, you always have the option of not competing which she has chosen to do.

For the record, I actually applaud this girl's principles on the rights matter, but not necessarily in regard to the dress-code.

3. Here's where we start getting into 'choosing your battles carefully'. Chess, by it's nature, is a relatively aristocratic and academic game to begin with, which generally is surrounded by some pretty conservative folks (players, spectators, judges and organizers). I'm not sure it's the best venue to start duking it out on a women's rights platform, especially with a country like SA who doesn't have a strong Worldwide chess presence anyway. Sure, chess is where she could make her voice heard, but I'm not sure it's an arena which will effect much change (one way, or the other).

4. If SA just rolled over on her demands, and let her play wearing hot-pants, a thong and a skimpy halter top; if they allowed her to go anywhere un-escorted, drive a car, etc., etc. ...what victory would she have won, really? A victory for her, sure, but a victory for women's rights in SA?? Nope. She would have been the subject of endless snickering, mockery and whispers, her personally. It would have been a hollow victory, very hollow.

So, while I agree with her cause, and I agree with her principles (for the most part), this doesn't change the reality of the situation and that which is to be gained from making a stand.



posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 09:06 AM
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The "world championship" should be wholly invalidated if it is not held in a non-oppressive location where all are welcome. If the potential champion cannot attend without submitting to some form of denigration because of the mental deficiency of a nation's people then the competition would appear to me to have no integrity or validity.



posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 09:54 AM
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a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

It's one thing to have a dress code of everyone wearing a pair of black pants and white shirt much like you see in an orchestra, but in this case, it sounded like the Saudis were all in favor of imposing their much more religiously conservative cultural restrictions on top of the already conservative restrictions of the chess environment.

I think if a sport already has a dress code, then that code should stand and not be altered just because the participants aren't competing physically.



posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 10:29 AM
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a reply to: ketsuko

I agree...partially. I agree she should not be required to wear a head to toe Abaya, but I disagree it should be acceptable for her to wear the clothing she is pictured in on page 2. Big difference. And, I would doubt the clothing she is dressed in (in the picture) meets those conservative dress restrictions of the chess world. A man couldn't show up in shorts and a muscle shirt for example.

Note - and believe me, I am FAR from a prude!!!


I think if a sport already has a dress code, then that code should stand and not be altered just because the participants aren't competing physically.


I don't understand this statement. There isn't any debate about chess not being a physical competition, so why is this relevant?



posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 10:34 AM
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a reply to: 0001391

I would tend to agree with this (in principle) (i.e. that it should not be a 'sanctioned' event).

However, I disagree with the notion people should just be allowed to do whatever they want in someone else's country.

Hence, balance.



posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 10:39 AM
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a reply to: TheConstruKctionofLight

Wow...

Imagine that subtle imprecations against "international Jewry" on a conspiracy site, how original.



posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 10:44 AM
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a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Personally my feeling is if you're a guest you should be treated as such, and if you have emigrated you should at least pay lip service in public to assimilation...



posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 12:49 PM
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a reply to: Grambler

If her protest was for solidarity with Israel, then good on her, but over their cultural values and traditions? It's a silly thing to lose your hard earned title over. But I'll give her this, my sentiment is respect one's culture in whichever land you visit so long as you do not transgress against God, or don't visit the land. She opted to not visit. Surely she will get to compete for thw title in the future.



posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 12:54 PM
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a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

I added that bit because most times people think of the clothing for a sport based on the physical needs of the sport. You wear the swimming suit you wear because of the requirements of the pool or the clothing you wear on the track is because of what you need in order to move there.

In part, clothing for sports is dictated by the movement requirements of the activity.

Chess isn't like that being a mental sport, but I can see there being a dress code for it since uniforms are also part of sports. However, I think that should be up to the governing body of chess and not superseded by the cultural demands of whatever country the competition takes place in similar to competitive sports. If the country is unwilling to bow to that, then they should not host the competitions of the sport in question.



posted on Dec, 28 2017 @ 09:12 PM
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a reply to: Grambler

Good for her. She knows who the real women oppressors are...and it's not American men.



posted on Dec, 29 2017 @ 12:27 AM
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originally posted by: ElectricUniverse

originally posted by: Willtell

And what did the christian hordes of Europe do to Africa, Asia, China?

To the Jews, The Cathars, the first European genocide


OH, that did not happen


You look at history through a distorted lens and try to fit things in to your own prejudices


That's not a method to any kind of truth or reality



But you rather ignore that the Christian crusades were a response to the Islamic crusaders who were trying to conquer all of Europe by the sword...

Kind of ironic for you to be talking about "truth" yet you want to ignore the most obvious truth... The last order that Muhammed gave to Muslims was to conquer all lands at any cost.

Fortunately there are Muslims, mostly those who were born or really escaped the ME to live in peace and were educated in the west, who do not follow those orders. But quite a large percentage of them do follow those last orders of Muhammed throughout the world to this day.






But you rather ignore that the Christian crusades were a response to the Islamic crusaders who were trying to conquer all of Europe by the sword...


That’s an absolute lie

Do you even know who was the leaders in Islam when the Crusaders attacked Jerusalem and literally slaughtered the Jews, Muslims and everybody in the holy city. The dead were all over the place--woman children.




Kind of ironic for you to be talking about "truth" yet you want to ignore the most obvious truth... The last order that Muhammed gave to Muslims was to conquer all lands at any cost.


Muhammad didnt even leave a successor--let alone an edict to conquer the wold

Even if he did , it wouldn't have been much different from what the bible says the Jews did.

And certainly we know what the Catholics did to apostates to their dogma. From the murder of the Arian christians to the genocide of the Cathars in 1400

Here's an example of Muhammad's last sermon



All mankind is from Adam and Eve. An Arab has no superiority over a non-Arab, nor does a non-Arab have any superiority over an Arab; a white has no superiority over a black, nor does a black have any superiority over a white;



YOU NEVER EVER HEARD ANYTHING LIKE THAT FROM ANY EUROPEAN LEADER UNTIL THE MODERN TIMES


Here's another instance of a very rare act of a pre-modern leader doing good to people of another religion.



In 628 C.E. Prophet Muhammad (s) granted a Charter of Privileges to the monks of St. Catherine Monastery in Mt. Sinai. It consisted of several clauses covering all aspects of human rights including such topics as the protection of Christians, freedom of worship and movement, freedom to appoint their own judges and to own and maintain their property, exemption from military service, and the right to protection in war.


An English translation of that document is presented below.




This is a message from Muhammad ibn Abdullah, as a covenant to those who adopt Christianity, near and far, we are with them.
Verily I, the servants, the helpers, and my followers defend them, because Christians are my citizens; and by Allah! I hold out against anything that displeases them.
No compulsion is to be on them.
Neither are their judges to be removed from their jobs nor their monks from their monasteries.
No one is to destroy a house of their religion, to damage it, or to carry anything from it to the Muslims' houses.
Should anyone take any of these, he would spoil God's covenant and disobey His Prophet. Verily, they are my allies and have my secure charter against all that they hate.
No one is to force them to travel or to oblige them to fight.
The Muslims are to fight for them.
If a female Christian is married to a Muslim, it is not to take place without her approval. She is not to be prevented from visiting her church to pray.
Their churches are to be respected. They are neither to be prevented from repairing them nor the sacredness of their covenants.
No one of the nation (Muslims) is to disobey the covenant till the Last Day (end of the world).


LINK

Nobody in their right mind would defend all the crimes Muslims did but in comparison to others they did much more good overall to other than Muslims than Christians did at the same time.

In Spain, where Muslims ruled, Jews, and many other non-Muslims were safe and allowed to practice their religion in peace.

The Christians on the other hand reigned with by sheer terror, something called the inquisition. They expelled you or you converted, or in many cases tortured the non-Christians to death



posted on Dec, 29 2017 @ 12:37 AM
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a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Let me educate you further

LINK



During the European conquest of Jerusalem in 1099, the Crusaders slaughtered Muslims and Jews alike, including women and children. Eighty-eight years later, Saladin recaptured Jerusalem. The city’s Christians feared for their lives because they were certain that the Muslims would avenge the deaths of their people, and Saladin was in a position to do so.

Yet, Saladin did not shed the blood of Christians in Jerusalem. He freed the old, the widows, and the children to ensure that they were not condemned to a life of slavery. For forty days, he granted all Christians from foreign lands safe departure and allowed them to return to their respective countries with their property. He found the male guardians for Christian women to ensure that they were provided protection and shelter on their return journeys. He allowed the Eastern Christians to stay and reinstated the right of every Jew to visit and resettle in Jerusalem. He conquered Jerusalem on a Saturday and ordered that the Church be open on Sunday for services.




posted on Dec, 29 2017 @ 02:10 AM
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a reply to: roguetechie

Plenty of info of how New Yorkers pay a kosher tax blackmail if you care to look.







 
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