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Abbas rules out US peace plan after Jerusalem decision

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posted on Dec, 23 2017 @ 09:51 PM
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a reply to: dragonridr

I haven’t said anything g about the treatment of the palistinians..


I said moving the embassy held no win for America..

It hurt our relationship with every other state in the region, and COULDNT have improved or relationship with isreal, since we are already joined at the hip and they are beholden to us for all the weapons and money we give them.. for free...


I’m an American.. I only have a cursory intrest in palistine or isreal.. I care about America..


Sun Tzu

“Never fight a battle with nothing to win.”


Well that is exactly what we just did..
edit on 23-12-2017 by JoshuaCox because: (no reason given)




posted on Dec, 23 2017 @ 10:28 PM
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originally posted by: JoshuaCox
Ia reply to: pavil

Tdo we have ANY hope for a peace deal now lol???

No...

There is no scenerio where this makes the palastinians no longer want their own state ...

There is no scenerio where there is ANY win in it for America..

Isreal already loves us..

This will encourage every other state I the region to hate us...

Do you think the bush’s Didn’t love isreal sufficiently?!??

Of course they did.. it was understood that it could only hurt America, but cannot help us.. .. at all..

No one can even imagaine a scenerio where it helps us..

But I guess the other presidents cared more about America than publicity..



BS...... if the Palestinians get offered the same thing Ehud did, they'd be idiots not to take it. They can play the disrespected card as much as they want but if push comes to shove and they get a good offer if they don't take it they're morons.

Hate to break it to the Palestinians but they're not in a position to dictate much of anything soon they'll be losing their Saudi backers.

Do the Palestinians actually think there's some type of Peace Arrangement that doesn't have the Israel or Israelis having Jerusalem as their Capital even if it's just west Jerusalem ?
edit on 23-12-2017 by pavil because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 24 2017 @ 12:29 AM
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originally posted by: Gothmog
The poor Palestinians. Given the boot from every ME country that ever let em in. Those Arab countries realized early on they were not as they thought. The Palestinians used the goodwill of these countries to launch hostile takeover attempts.Just like they still do.

Shame that some of the rest of the world cannot come to the same realization the Palestinian's own did. Especially the UN. I guess they have "collective selective amnesia" when it comes to certain historical facts.




ding ding.



posted on Dec, 24 2017 @ 01:15 AM
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a reply to: pavil

None of that matters..

What was the win for America in doing it????

Obviously, AT BEST we just pissed off every other country in the region, helping to open the door to more anti American demogoges to gain power and making it harder for local pro American leaders to get things we want past their population..


Plus we pissed off ALOT of our allies in Europe.. doublely so concerning trumps threat that was ignored and the “people who didn’t vote against us “ party.. again opening the door for more anti American politicians to take power..

So what did AMERICA GAIN in trade???


Hell, what did isreal gain????


ABSOLUTELY nothing..

That is what’s known as “the worst deal in history..”

Or we got screwed.....
edit on 24-12-2017 by JoshuaCox because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 24 2017 @ 01:20 AM
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a reply to: ufoorbhunter

I don’t think that 50% thing is true at all..

The ottomans allowed a bunch of Jewish settlements, but that was a few Jewish neighborhoods and a Jewish “China town”.. at least In Jerusalem.


Not a situation where half the population was Jewish..


I’ll have to reresearch it.



posted on Dec, 24 2017 @ 01:28 AM
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a reply to: nwtrucker

Mmmmm the UN borders are not what’s being debated..

It is the land they have expanded and taken.. which I don’t think included Jerusalem.



I think they took that in the 7 days war.. which gives them right by conquest.. the oldest form of justification... so nothing to scoff at, but..


None of that matters to me though..


WHAT DID AMERICA GET OUT OF THE DEAL???

A good deal requires the US to gain something for our loss of influence for possible off those who opposed it..

So what did we, as Americans gain???

Our relationship with isreal was already 10/10...

Without us they would be squashed in a second...


So what did we gain??



posted on Dec, 24 2017 @ 01:37 AM
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a reply to: dragonridr

Obviously we are losing..

FOR NOW we have already had it escalate to trump threatening people not to vote against us. Then them all voting against us..


This is fodder for anti American demagogues to take power..

Now when their politicians that try and support us (maybe because we own them.) their populations might not back them..

I don’t really care he did it, BUT DONT DO IT FOR FREE.....

Where is this “america is gonna get tired of winning???

I personally don’t care about immigrants. I don’t hate them, but I don’t like them, either..

Americans need those jobs, housing , exc...

I mean be smart about it and vet them all before deporting to snag any worth keeping.. don’t make stupid absolute laws like “they all go back..”

That’s just inefficient and stupid..

If you run across a little Latin Albert Einstein. You keep that little joker.



posted on Dec, 24 2017 @ 02:55 AM
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originally posted by: intrepid
This is surprising? It's obvious the US will not have the Palestinians best interests in mind. Trump basically giving Israel Jerusalem shows that. Do you think they would have said, "Great idea. What else do you have in mind?" It's the same ole. Screw them over then blame them for retaliating.


The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.

In the event negotiations among Israel, the Palestinians, U.S., and Middle East regional partners the ground work has to be laid. Before and during negotiations, the Palestinians and Israel will require bargaining chips they can throw away. Heck, both the Palestinians and Israel require 'cover' before any negotiations can even be contemplated. The location of Israel's capital may eventually prove to be some of the required 'cover'.

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.

edit on 24-12-2017 by xpert11 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 24 2017 @ 03:29 AM
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a reply to: UKTruth

The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.



Unfortunately, the population difference between Israel and the Palestinians can't be ignored. If your logic was correct than Ian Smith's government would won the Rhodesian Bush War. Two points are worth making at this point: Ian Smith's Rhodesia enjoyed no international support. This is why (excluding other off topic matters) by the end of the 1975-79 time period, the existing Rhodesian government had no bargaining chips left.

Comparatively, the Israeli- Palestinian conflict had spanned decades, thanks in part to support from the U.S. . If Israel doesn't reach a equitable deal with the Palestinians in the next 8-10 years, they may face the risk of running out of time. The sheer population imbalance favours the Palestinians to the point they would overwhelm Israel.

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.



edit on 24-12-2017 by xpert11 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 24 2017 @ 03:45 AM
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a reply to: wdkirk



A defeated people’s last gasp. There will be no peace. There never was any to begin with.

They are not a defeated people. There is a Palestinian nation that has a peace treaty with Israel, it's called Jordan.
Egypt is also in peace with Israel.
For people who are interested in a peace with Israel, it is very easily achievable.
For those who only want to see Israel destroyed, indeed, there was never any hope.



posted on Dec, 24 2017 @ 04:09 AM
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a reply to: Swills



What peace deal? There is no peace deal. Israel, namely Netanyhu, will not provide any peace deal.

You are correct that Bibi is not interested in a peace deal, same as Hamas and the PA, but it doesn't mean peace is impossible to reach. Peace is inevitable as there are no other solutions. It will take some time but eventually the people on both sides will get tired of war and elect leaders who will negotiate an agreement, like adults.



Meanwhile, Trump in his infinite stupidity decided Jerusalem will be Israel's capitol AND want to move the US embassy there.

This was not decided by Trump. Lookup the Jerusalem Embassy Act. It's a law passed by Congress back in 1995. Both Republicans and Democrats unanimously voted for this law - Senate (93–5), and the House (374–37).
Not to mention the fact that in reality this is just moving a building from one location to another. Jerusalem was the Israeli capital long before Trump or any decisions made by the US.



posted on Dec, 24 2017 @ 04:34 AM
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originally posted by: JoshuaCox
a reply to: UKTruth

They did what was best for America rather than making a BS political statement that means nothing and has zero functional value..


Because they didn’t want America to lose without something to win...


No, they already made the statement very clearly. The only difference is they didn't do what they believed in due to cowardice.

The only real BS statement that means nothing is the one from the UN.



posted on Dec, 24 2017 @ 04:44 AM
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originally posted by: JoshuaCox
a reply to: pavil

None of that matters..

What was the win for America in doing it????



America has been taken for granted by the world - used as a cash cow because both Bush and Obama were so weak (and/or complicit in handing over world control to a few globalists). Obama, especially, will go down as the weakest President in US history.

What was won for America is the end of all that nonsense. It's been akin to the biggest toughest kid in the playground get bullied by a bunch of little wimps in a pack for the last decade or more. Those wimps finally got the punch in the face they so deserved - and now they are crying to mummy.
edit on 24/12/2017 by UKTruth because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 24 2017 @ 05:37 AM
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originally posted by: nwtrucker

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: nwtrucker

Blah Blah, tis a violation of International law to invade and occupy countries.

Things like Sovereignty, Autonomy and Self Determination become meaningless, except when applying double standards.


Blah, blah , blah. The land that was occupied by Syria, the land occupied by Jordan except when applying double standard.

Except when Erasing History, you mean. Don't you know its all bulls*** to mold your mind into worshipping the "Holy Dirt and Chosenites"?



posted on Dec, 24 2017 @ 05:40 AM
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originally posted by: intrptr

originally posted by: nwtrucker

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: nwtrucker

Blah Blah, tis a violation of International law to invade and occupy countries.

Things like Sovereignty, Autonomy and Self Determination become meaningless, except when applying double standards.


Blah, blah , blah. The land that was occupied by Syria, the land occupied by Jordan except when applying double standard.

Except when Erasing History, you mean. Don't you know its all bulls*** to mold your mind into worshipping the "Holy Dirt and Chosenites"?


Why don't you forget 'holy dirt' and 'chosenites' then?
The only important thing is how these two states live with each other now and into the future - or not, in which case the answer is actually war.



posted on Dec, 24 2017 @ 05:43 AM
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originally posted by: Hazardous1408

originally posted by: Wardaddy454

originally posted by: Hazardous1408

originally posted by: Wardaddy454

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: Grambler


And for some reason none of that mattered.

Yet the U.S. moving a building, that is a step too far.

Jerusalem is site of the (EDIT: Dome of the Rock), one of three Holy Sites in Islam. How did you expect them to react when it was made a Jewish Capital City?


The temple of Solomon predates the Dome.

"Palestinians" are just Jordanian refugees.


“Israelis” are just European refugees.


Difference being genocide.


Woooosh.

I was being facetious. Highlighting your irrelevant generalised statement, with an equally ridiculous narrative.



I get it though, the suffering of the holocaust justifies everything to some.
Wonder if people will ever tell the victims descendants to get over it like so many tell African Americans to do with slavery or Jim Crow?

That’ll go down well, I’m sure of it!


Alright, you got me. So very hard to tell these days who is being serious or not.

They are. Make peace and give land to those who've attacked you since the day you became a state in the 60's.



posted on Dec, 24 2017 @ 05:45 AM
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a reply to: UKTruth

Well yah, thats why they formed the UN after WWII in the wake of the NAzis, to prevent Empires from taking over the world, ever again.

Yah, that international law, the same one in the forgotten bill of rights that says the Law can't break into your house, arrest you and steal your stuff, too.

Of course all that stems from some notion of unwritten moral code that says I can't move into your house, lock you in the bathroom , abuse your wife and kids.

According to you though, 'might makes right', its all good...



posted on Dec, 24 2017 @ 05:47 AM
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a reply to: UKTruth


Why don't you forget 'holy dirt' and 'chosenites' then?

I already stated Israel was formed to establish a military base on the eastern seaboard of the Mediterranean to meddle in Middle Eastern Affairs.

Here we are , dingus.



posted on Dec, 24 2017 @ 05:50 AM
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originally posted by: pavil

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: Grambler


You admit that the Palestinians want to wipe out Israel.

Israel is wiping out Muslims in countries all over the middle East.


Can't wait to hear this one: where are they "wiping out" ie; the act or an instance of wiping out : complete or utter destruction of Muslims in the Middle East?


You mean the rain of bombs turning cities to rubble in the 'mIddle east' or the omission of that in the Main Scream?

Be honest, you call them Arabs when convenient, Terrorists when necessary.

Hows that war on terror working for you?



posted on Dec, 24 2017 @ 05:54 AM
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originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: UKTruth


Why don't you forget 'holy dirt' and 'chosenites' then?

I already stated Israel was formed to establish a military base on the eastern seaboard of the Mediterranean to meddle in Middle Eastern Affairs.

Here we are , dingus.



If so, how does that help the peace negotiations?
You sound like you are hung up on 'holy dirt' and 'chosenites' - just with an alterior motive.



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