Our Debt Doesn't Exist

a reply to: Realtruth

You can't eat money, but you also can't live on bread alone...

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: bulwarkz
Dude, if you had to survive tomorrow on what you can provide for yourself, will you be able to buy a cup of coffee?

Huh? If I had to 'provide for myself' using your dopey analogy that means I would need to grow, harvest, roast and grind my own coffee. Who wants to waste their time doing that when I can buy a nice bag of Italian dark roast, brew that up and watch the 99% get crushed from the safety of my own home in crystal clear 4K definition. It's like being there with them but thankfully I'm not.

Your stupid questions dumb me down. What gives?

It's not my questions, it's you.

i see things different than you. I see us recapturing our communities through the storm. I see debt slavery ending from it. I see local trade flourishing. I see myself as the type that comes to your driveway and trades you a bag of fresh roasted coffee from the beans i traded for and stockpiled. Better than what you are drinking now. Roasting your own coffee is not difficult.
Real entrepreneurs react to crisis. And you do not need to exploit or fraud.
The new trend is called social entrepeneur. Big money like Musk and some of the Walton's are going there.
We just need a fair means of exchange. But until then, i am sure you got alot of stuff to trade for my freshly roasted Columbian roast. It's all i got

a reply to: Realtruth

What would you rather fail first?

1 Your money

2 Your crops

originally posted by: neutronflux
Owed to the public is not the same as ourselves.

Are the citizens not the public? We own most of our own debt, it's a fact as your source shows.

a reply to: bulwarkz

Can't wait to see those Tesla big rigs on the road!

Heard they got a lot of pre-orders to keep up with...

originally posted by: CainHarmbank
a reply to: Realtruth

What would you rather fail first?

1 Your money

2 Your crops

That was answered 100 years ago in Ukraine.
It is known as the Hollodomor.

originally posted by: SlowNail
Jacques Fresco's dream of a resource based economy. The main hurdle in the Venus Project.

'Dream' is correct, it only works for countries that have enough desireable resources.

originally posted by: jacobe001
If we go back to bartering it might be a way to reset the system so true value is found again.

I don't want to have to barter for everything I need in life and I'm pretty sure the majority of the population feels the same way, it's highly inefficient.

originally posted by: jacobe001
Well, at least you admit banks inflate the cost of homes.

The cost of homes, like everything else, are mostly driven by simple supply and demand economics.

Now that corporations have gone global, tariffs is a dirty word.

They should be, tariffs only impact the end user.

originally posted by: bulwarkz
i see things different than you.

Agreed, you see numbers as sorcery.

Roasting your own coffee is not difficult.

Nobody said it was difficult, I said it was a waste of my time.

We just need a fair means of exchange.

We have one, it's called money.

But until then, i am sure you got alot of stuff to trade for my freshly roasted Columbian roast.

This disproves your whole point of local bartering if your coffee is from Columbia. You need to plant, grow, harvest and roast it all in Jerkwater, USA to adhere to your bizzaro analogy, and we all know that ain't happening.

a reply to: bulwarkz

Do you think current farming practices, like mono-cropping, using large plots of land to farm one single crop like wheat, corn, or soybeans, are unsustainable, and will result in loss of fertile soil in the regions supplying large amounts of crops?

originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: bulwarkz
i see things different than you.

Agreed, you see numbers as sorcery.

Roasting your own coffee is not difficult.

Nobody said it was difficult, In said it was a waste of my time.

We just need a fair means of exchange.

We have one, it's called money.

But until then, i am sure you got alot of stuff to trade for my freshly roasted Columbian roast.

This disproves your whole point of local bartering if your coffee is from Columbia. You need to plany, grow, harvets and roast it all in Jerkwater, USA to adhere to your bizzaro analogy, and we all know that ain't happening.

no, you assume all your own strawman args. Spinning circles.
You strain at the gnat, and swallow a camel.

Your silly args fly in the face of all history. Your funny money is but 100 years old. It is time for a better solution than a system based on debt.
We got tricked and lied to. The FED system failed us. If we had fair money our successes would eliminate the need for this convo. With fair money our collective energies move forward in positive achievements benefiting all(prisoners dilemna!)
The end of sociopathic debt prisons run by sociopathic controllers(zero-sum game)

a reply to: bulwarkz


That's nice. You go do your barter thing and I'll stick to using dollars for what I need. Don't forget to send me all your useless dollars.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

I usually think posting things here is a waste of my time... But I guess I just can't resist myself sometimes...

a reply to: CainHarmbank


It all depends, if the person is stuck in some sort of desire to revert to primitivism then it may be a waste of time trying to educate them.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

Resources aren't traded between countries in the Venus Project, rather pooled and distributed worldwide as needed.

Kind of an automated global socialism.


The biggest problem would be getting people to abandon the concept of ownership. If we could do that, the rest would fall into place.

originally posted by: SlowNail
The biggest problem would be getting people to abandon the concept of ownership.

Which I don't think is going to occur.

It boils down to WHO issues our money and every time the US has allowed a privately-owned central bank to do so we end up with runaway inflation and a National Debt. Andrew Jackson ended the 2nd Bank of the United States and it was the only time the US had no National debt. Congress was given the power to issue money without interest but they were always bought off by those who knew that a private bank would generate endless streams of revenue.

Our current debt is thanks to the Federal Reserve System which loans our government money at interest. This is why we have developed the warfare/welfare state to continually force spending beyond our means. It is the method of our enslavement. One country bucked the system of international bankers and produced an economic miracle in only a few years. It eventually brought them in to conflict with the rest of the world and it is debated as to who exactly is to blame for that. Any move by the US would likely produce a similar result finding ourselves the international pariahs and under attack by a coalition of nations beholden to those banks.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

Sadly, I have to agree.

At least for the foreseeable future.

originally posted by: CainHarmbank
a reply to: bulwarkz

Do you think current farming practices, like mono-cropping, using large plots of land to farm one single crop like wheat, corn, or soybeans, are unsustainable, and will result in loss of fertile soil in the regions supplying large amounts of crops?

The tech we have to restore soil is here. It is easy. By fertigation you can do everything. A soil media can be stripped of nutrients and still be restored. Vertical farming is about to happen for cities.
I am big on permaculture. Farmto table knowledge for a consumer should be essential knowledge.
Wd can do amazing things to soil. The new cahnnnihbihs retail market looks to be the source to open this door possibly. Because of the medical push behind it everything about what is in the plant is being tested and watched for pesticides and adulterations. Big,BIG financial incentives behind everyones motives atm. They, most, are trying to get it right. Even with what they do with and reclaim spent soil and water.

I am big on wormcastings. In the FMA (food modernization act) they did everything but outlaw worm castings. So f***in ridiculous. )

There is an enzyme in the gut of red wigglers that is in their casting.
That enzyme dissolves the exoskeleton of ALL INSECTS. If you have enough worm castings in the soil and what goes through the roots and into the plant, there is an odor that is enough to keep the insects off the plants completely.