The most evil verse in the Bible Peter 2 18 how can this even exist

originally posted by: MOMof3
a reply to: Raggedyman

I’ll remember this argument the next abortion debate. I actually agree with it. But you are as a Christian commanded to be a light to the world. Different from atheists and other religions.

If a woman chooses an abortion, it's not for me to condemn, it's her choice

Yes Christians are called to be the light, we are not, sad isn't it

Dp oops

originally posted by: filthyphilanthropist
a reply to: dfnj2015

I think you aren't seeing the bigger picture. Back then and even today in many places around the world slavery was a hard truth. It exists, and we are taught hiw to conduct ourselves as followers of Jesus when dealing with our enslavement to man. Submit oneself to God. Be a slave to Jesus. Humility is key to a spirirually fruitful existence, and that humility is a reflection of one's submission to Jesus. Because we are all slaves to something. This doesn't condone such kinds of slavery, but rather it instructs one how to deal with such enslavement with his head held high in spirit. It does not tell one to obey a master who insists he go against God's word.

It's the same principle as treating your enemies well. What credit is it to one treating those who are good to him with kindness? None. Even evil ones will treat their comrads well.

And rape is a sin. Always has been; always will be. Sex must be with consent and within marriage.

The bible is relevant today as it was yeaterday. Murder is murder. Justified killing is not murder. When is it justified? Read the Bible with the Spirit, and you'll know.

Discernment shows that dfnj2015 is not Christian and his feeble attempts and blasphemy are becoming boring. He can not be taught for the holy spirit does not reside within him.

originally posted by: MOMof3
a reply to: Raggedyman

I’ll remember this argument the next abortion debate. I actually agree with it. But you are as a Christian commanded to be a light to the world. Different from atheists and other religions.

Good statement but lets not forget we are also to stick to one another - our kind (other Christians) and to stay away form those who do not believe or who worship other gods so that we don't become misled and deceived as dfnj2015 attempts to do.

originally posted by: Raggedyman

originally posted by: MOMof3
a reply to: Raggedyman

I’ll remember this argument the next abortion debate. I actually agree with it. But you are as a Christian commanded to be a light to the world. Different from atheists and other religions.

If a woman chooses an abortion, it's not for me to condemn, it's her choice

Yes Christians are called to be the light, we are not, sad isn't it

My sister we are to reprove one another....

Luke 17:2- 4 - It would be better for him to have a millstone hung around his neck and to be thrown into the sea than to cause one of these little ones to stumble. 3.Watch yourselves. If your brother sins, rebuke him; and if he repents, forgive him. 4.Even if he sins against you seven times in a day, and seven times returns to say, ‘I repent,’ you must forgive him.”…

Definition of reprove

reproved; reproving

1 : to scold or correct usually gently or with kindly intent
2 : to express disapproval of......

If I see a sin, I make it known to the sinner as I expect others to do to me. This is how we stick together...through thick and thin we are family.... a spiritual family and I do NOT want to see any brother or sister heading to hell due to living in sin. If it takes a hug, a stern scolding, or tears I don't care as long as my brother or sister sees the error and returns back to the fold.

Revelation 3:19 - Those whom I love I rebuke and discipline. So be earnest, and repent.

Using the lens of modern perception to hold judgement over the past is about as useful as Stephen Hawking's Etch-A-Sketch. Go buy yourself an ice cream and enjoy life.
a reply to: dfnj2015

originally posted by: szino9
a reply to: dfnj2015

I wonder when will they start calling the bible 'racist'...

The Bible calls out and supports quite a bit of ethnic cleansing in the name of God. Especially in the OT. I wouldn't call it racist, but your sarcasm isn't exactly far off enough to make your joke funny.

slavery was an institution that was heavily embedded in the society. it wasn't something that christ and his disciples were gonna change in their lifetime. it probably would have destroyed the civilization if they had actually overturned the institution. instead they planted seeds...
the op left out the part that gives instructions to the masters. that if they become brothers and sisters in christ, they should be freed, that they should be treated with kindness, forgive your debtors, ect. it was much the same instructions that were given to wive/husband relationships, which in time it replaced the lord/servant relationship with one where love would rule.
but it took time.

lincoln thought about freeing the slaves, and how many people died in that bloody civil war? how many slaves chose to remain with their masters, under different, although still oppressive arrangements because they had no other place to go or way to live? and how long was it before the descendants of those slaves got even a glimpse of having an equal opportunity in our world?

some seeds grow very, very slowly but they grow.

and now, that they are so close to being mature, some seem to want to pull them out by the roots and discard them. wanting to go back to the time before, using such verses as this to justify doing so... trying to convince us that it was so much better back then. to me, that is far more concerning than these verses in the ancient scriptures that instructed people to love on another.

originally posted by: TinfoilTP
We all have one chance to live here on Earth, why should one who is unfortunate enough to be cast into slavery not have an opportunity at salvation? There are millions in slavery today, building Dubai for instance. There are billions who are Muslim who have no problem with slavery and wherever they come into power, enact some form of it. Is there no hope of salvation for them unfortunate infidels just because they are trapped in the reality of slavery? If the Bible taught hate then you would be correct that verse does not belong there, but it doesn't.

Since you are dead set on slavery as the ultimate evil, guess where that places all Muslims?

Not just slavery but all acts against the nature of God. There are lots of way to destroy people's enthusiasm that I would consider sinful.

Why are you hateful of Muslims?

a reply to: SecretsoftheBlueApples

You too.

a reply to: DeathSlayer

Someone pretending to speak for God. I'm so glad you have omnipotent powers of observation you can share with us.

originally posted by: MOMof3
a reply to: dfnj2015

The human governments are not god’s kingdom. That is yet to come, “thy kingdom come...”. They belong to evil. The Bible is ancient stories of good people trying to live amongst corruption and unknowns. At least the writers tried to give slaves hope.

I always like your posts. Please forgive me with my OP. It is not my intention to insult you or your faith. However, after countless insults for my observations questioning my faith or claiming my fate of eternal damnation I do occasionally lose patience when it comes to some of these details. I think the essential message of the Bible is morality is important. I think people way too rigid in the way they worship the authority of the Bible. But that is just me. Maybe it's right. Maybe it's wrong. But I cannot accept the implicit idea that slavery is okay because of verses like Peter 2 18. I just can't.

There's a ton more evil verse's than that one......the evil lies in the fact that this book fools even the most educated amongst us. Pains me to see a highly educated individual that believes what this book spouts....sort of goes against logic & reason. The bible contains over 2,500 verses pertaining to money & possessions, and around 500 pertaining to love & faith. It reads like Japanese stereo instructions......and your Icelandic.

a reply to: dfnj2015

I don’t make up the words in the Bible. I have been studying it for 56 years. Did you read, actually READ the sermon on the mount given by Jesus? Does any of that sound like god says slavery is ok? When in front of Pilate, Jesus said he could call on 10000 angels to save him, he could have freed slaves too. But, this is not gods kingdom yet. His kingdom Lives in our hearts. The word says he searches hearts. A Christian life is to be a witness to the world. Real Christians should CHOOSE not to own slaves.

a reply to: DeathSlayer

Jesus said to go out two by two and knock on doors and persuade hearts. Yes, Christians are to assemble and lift each other up. Jesus said his way would not be easy.

a reply to: MOMof3

And to rebuke one another as well when one sins,

God bless

a reply to: openyourmind1262

Those are some pretty good criticism. What other verses would you consider to be more evil or immoral than the one that implicitly implies slavery is morally okay?

I'm not a big fan of animal sacrifice for sin atonement. I think atonement can only come from the people we have sinned against. I think the way Christianity makes it so easy to get forgiveness for sin is a complete cop-out. I doubt just saying words or doing rituals matters to ones salvation. Salvation comes from genuine acts of contrition in my opinion.

a reply to: dfnj2015
To continually attack with only a cursory knowledge of Biblical text/teachings is both a disservice to you and to Christians.

It's ok to not understand and take so much out of context, but to espouse it as gospel truth is sketchy at best.
Many of your questions are valid, but you come from a lay mans perspective and seem not to see the whole picture. Sometimes several chapters are needed to arrive with a suitable context and reasoning for the actions that followed.

The Old Testament is loaded with examples of Gods wrath at disobedience, and the results from defiance or idol worship....... and worse... absolute depravity. Man has always had free will after all, but he has also been delivered the Ten Commandments as a guide. Many, many of us here like your oratories and subject matter however.

But sometimes your knowledge comes through without enough sound examination beforehand or lacking context, rather sensational. Never the less we look forward to your OP's.

originally posted by: MOMof3
a reply to: dfnj2015

I don’t make up the words in the Bible. I have been studying it for 56 years. Did you read, actually READ the sermon on the mount given by Jesus? Does any of that sound like god says slavery is ok? When in front of Pilate, Jesus said he could call on 10000 angels to save him, he could have freed slaves too. But, this is not gods kingdom yet. His kingdom Lives in our hearts. The word says he searches hearts. A Christian life is to be a witness to the world. Real Christians should CHOOSE not to own slaves.

Of course I've read the Bible many times. And I've studied comparative religion. I am not doubting anything you say. And I always like your point of view even when I do not quite share it completely.

I really like what you said about "real Christians should CHOOSE not to own slaves". The teachings have meanings. Sometimes I think people spend too much time idolize the words that they really do not live the teachings. I find your interpretation and sentiment to be more meaningful to me than many of the verses in the Bible that seem out of place by today's standards.

The sermon on the mount is of course a profound expression of proper spirituality one should hold dear. But the problem with Peter 2 18 is the implicit implication that slavery is morally okay. Again, I'm not saying this to be irreverent. I'm just saying I cannot accept this implicit implication as being okay. When I read versus like this I think the Bible is the word of man full of bias, bigotry, and prejudice.

The problem is once you go down the path of cherry picking which verses are relevant then people have all kinds of disagreements about salvation. But I think this is the proper way. The verses in the Bible should be read with the historical context in mind and not be considered absolute truth for all-time. I think you and I can both agree the essential message of the Bible is morality is important should not be lost.

a reply to: dfnj2015

This is where the witness and the Word comes in. If you believe that interpretation of that scripture, does it contradict the teachings of Jesus? Then it is not doctrine, it is the personal opinion of that writer.