Trump Supporters Believing Their Own Lies.

a reply to: MOMof3

Don't worry Trump is reshaping the taxes so we keep those jobs here.

a reply to: soberbacchus

Do you have a retirement plan you pay into? Because if you do then the stock market directly affects your retirement plan and therefore you do have a vested interest in its continued success.

originally posted by: thepixelpusher
a reply to: soberbacchus

Nope, they are just lowering tax rates to be competitive worldwide, hence less revenue. Unless you enjoy the sucking sound of our jobs going overseas.

You really think the tax collector is the best place for corporations to invest their money?

We are approaching record low unemployment with still Millions of jobs unfilled.

What job loss overseas are you talking about?

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

I seriously laughed so hard reading what you wrote. Seriously though, TDS is an obvious meme and sure there may be some who are gullible but that goes for all political affiliations. Claiming that everything is on the up and up with the giant list of people who were suppose to testify against the Clintons suddenly dying including committing suicide by shooting themselves in the back of the head twice is childish naiveness at best or intentionally lying about hard facts at worst.

But here's some from Obama's own mouth.
m.youtube.com...

originally posted by: Outlier13
a reply to: soberbacchus

Do you have a retirement plan you pay into? Because if you do then the stock market directly affects your retirement plan and therefore you do have a vested interest in its continued success.

I have a 401k plus IRA and personally invest on the side.
The stock market has been very good to me, more so in recent years.

What does that have to do with the fact 50% of the country does not have any money in the stock market via personal investments, 401ks, pensions etc....Zip, Nadda.

And the voters that pushed Trump over the tipping point in this election are not pensioners, bankers, investors or people hoping their stocks would go even higher than the past decade of consistent growth.

They were people that were LEFT OUT of the economic recovery who live in dying towns that were glibly told to learn to code and start over.

This bill hurts them. This bill throws them bread crumbs if anything and fixes nothing while transferring 1.5 Trillion in wealth to the wealthiest 5% and Corporations.

The military budget has expanded, the loop holes for the millionaires have expanded, corporations make out like kings, the middle class was thrown a bone to gnaw on which will last as long as it takes for Healthcare premiums rising and Energy costs etc. to eclipse those pennies tossed their way.

It's a sick bill and hurts the people that need help most.

a reply to: soberbacchus

Here is your quote from your previous post to a poster who did find value in the stock market:

You said:

we are discussing what is good for the country...Straight-up, the stock market rally does nothing to help them feed their family. The stock market is not the economy and hasn't been for 40 plus years now.

YOU are part of the country. YOU have retirement plans that are wholly dependent upon a strong stock market and therefore you do have a vested interest in the strength of that market.

What was the purpose of your statement if not to disparage the stock market in general and make a totally incorrect claim that it does not help people feed their families? I know plenty of people who use money earned from trading on the markets to supplement their incomes. Most people who trade in the markets are not millionaires and ease of access to on-line trading has made access to stocks so simple you can begin trading in minutes. Maybe you are old and don't realize how accessible the markets are now. Especially the younger generation who are now heavily trading in crypto currencies.

The stock market is directly related to the strength of the economy because the rise and fall of a stock is driven by various economic indicators. Therefore a very healthy stock market represents a healthy economy. If companies who make, buy, and sell goods and services are doing well then it is reflected in the performance of their stock based on positive growth earnings and the increase in value of share holder equity.

Please explain to me how this is not an economic indicator of the state of an economy? It is PRECISELY what a direct indicator is.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

The cult demands loyalty!
The cult demands loyalty!
The cult demands loyalty!

originally posted by: Outlier13
a reply to: soberbacchus

Here is your quote from your previous post to a poster who did find value in the stock market:

You said:

we are discussing what is good for the country...Straight-up, the stock market rally does nothing to help them feed their family. The stock market is not the economy and hasn't been for 40 plus years now.

YOU are part of the country. YOU have retirement plans that are wholly dependent upon a strong stock market and therefore you do have a vested interest in the strength of that market.

I am on the winning side of a rapidly increasing wealth distribution gap.
When I say "what is good for the country" I am discussing the economic health of the country, not me.

Self-interest has a relationship with time as well.
From a short-term perspective, the top 5% is doing very well in their self-interest.
From a long-term perspective, like the state of the country 15-30 years from now?
The middle class is rapidly shrinking.
The lower middle class is sliding into poverty, the upper middle class is split between getting more wealthy and sliding backwards.
The poor are locked on the economic mobility latter.
Their is a massive rise in suicide rates amongst white middle aged men. Their economic struggles have LOT to do with it.
Ditto the Heroine epidemic.

Pssst...take a look at the Gini Coefficient
This table is 8 years old. It has only gotten worse since then.
Note the Reagan tax cuts and the boost there.
Note the rise before the great depression.
Trumps tax cut favors the top 5% much more than Reagans cut.
By my estimate, Trumps cuts will send us right up to the heights reached before the great depression or further.
BTW - when was America Great? When the Middle Class was strong. Look at the years during the middle of that graph.




The Wealth Gap in the U.S. Is Worse Than In Russia or Iran:
fortune.com...

The "Bailout" of banks and wall-street was an insane transfer of taxpayer dollars.

When they started to make profits (at record levels again) the past 8 years, what did we do?

Passed a bill to let them off the hook on paying taxes for sickening amounts, and added 1.5 Trillion to our Debt to do it.

We are near full plutocracy now.

The USA will be nothing more than a dried carcass in 15 years with the middle class a statistical joke and national debt only increasing until the 5% can't bleed the average taxpayer anymore.

I got young kids and I even have IRAs for them too (you can start an IRA at any age). I like to believe my grandkids will live in the USA, the country my ancestors first arrived in during the early 1600's and the country my family has fought for for hundreds of years, but the beating it has taken by the banks and billionaires the past 20 years is very, very severe.

This bill was gross.
Does it help me? Sure.
At the expense of a pipe to the head of the middle class who has been getting their ass kicked for 20 years at the least.

a reply to: Outlier13

Below is a breakdown of who the bill benefits.

IMAGINE what a boost it would have been to the economy if the GOP had placed that same emphasis on the Middle Class?

Instead they made the problem MUCH WORSE..

a reply to: soberbacchus

At what point do you begin to realize your argument is a circular one and the fact remains that the top 1% of wealth will always and forever remain in control by those at the top? You seem intelligent enough to know your argument is literally a complete waste of brain power.

The control of wealth will never change so either become one of the few smart enough to realize this and profit to the benefit of you and your family and give up this lost cause of redistribution of wealth.

originally posted by: soberbacchus
a reply to: Outlier13

Below is a breakdown of who the bill benefits.

IMAGINE what a boost it would have been to the economy if the GOP had placed that same emphasis on the Middle Class?

Instead they made the problem MUCH WORSE..

Please explain to me in detail exactly what this chart shows you. I want to know what you see when you put this chart up because your statement regarding "emphasis on the middle class" when this chart is relative to corporate tax rate reduction needs some explanation.

Tell me how a reduction in corporate tax rates is going to hurt the middle class. Don't Google it or don't give me some parroted line of BS you copy and paste from some website of liberals who don't have a clue. I want to know from you directly how this is going to hurt the middle class. And for the sake of argument let's assume YOU are part of the middle class.

Explain to me in detail how this is going to hurt you.

The chart shows that most people who own corporations are pretty well off. Its an obvious observation as most small business owners aren't Incorporated at the moment. Being a C corp or an S corp isn't what most small business owners do.

I would see more smaller businesses incorporating now with the new laws. In the past it wasn't even advisable to convert to an s-corp as a small business owner if you made less than 40,000 profit. As a result most people never start out as one and never convert even if it would save them taxes.

a reply to: Outlier13

It shows level of investment in stock market broken down by income. Of course the more money you have means the more money you can invest.

originally posted by: Outlier13
a reply to: soberbacchus

At what point do you begin to realize your argument is a circular one and the fact remains that the top 1% of wealth will always and forever remain in control by those at the top? You seem intelligent enough to know your argument is literally a complete waste of brain power.

I appreciate the compliment to my intelligence.

I wish your statement warranted me returning the favor.

Your statement is bizarrely ignorant or desperately fallacious, not sure which.

Of course the top 1% of wealth will always belong to the top 1% of the wealthy.

It is the proportion of the total that changes.











www.motherjones.com...

Nation’s top 1 percent now have greater wealth than the bottom 90 percent
www.seattletimes.com...

Can you give us this list of people about to testify against the Clintons that are dying? Or even a link demonstrating that someone shot themselves in the back of the head twice?

I voted for Hillary but don't have strong feelings for her at all. In fact, there are many Republicans I would've voted for over Trump.

I find it odd that people who freak out about the "lawlessness" of Obama or Hillary are perfectly fine with Trump, asking for "Loyalty" from the FBI director (or, of course, Comey's lying - right?). If Trump is such a good guy, and Obama is so lawless, why is it that Comey (a Republican), said that he'd had all of 2 conversations with Obama in his entire tenure, neither were substantive about anything, and yet Trump invites him to dinner and demands loyalty? Why does Trump need "loyalty"?

Loyalty is what dictators demand.

I think most Trump supporters know full well he's acting just as a dictator would, and that's part of what they like so much about him.

I heard a TON of anti-Obama stuff from the right when Obama was president, but nary a single thing about the FBI. It wasn't until the FBI - while doing its job - finds evidence of Trump's Russian contacts, which intel services around the world also have knowledge/evidence of, only then does the FBI get linked to Obama as "bad."

The trumpettes would be entertaining if they weren't so dangerous to the idea of a republic. Again, though, I suspect many Trump supporters specifically want a fascist dictator, so long as its their fascist dictator.

originally posted by: DBCowboy

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
a reply to: DBCowboy

Trump voters suck.

I think this is another part of the problem.

It all becomes very personal.

Its not that Trump voters suck as individuals on a personal level, its not that Trump supporters are inherently bad people its just that there is a political disagreement at play.

Its the politics of Trump voters that I think suck, not they themselves.

Yet from what I have observed, it seems that quite a lot of people on both sides of the political divide like to make this personal, when its really not necessary.

As a Trump voter, I am for more freedoms, lower taxes, smaller government, fewer regulations.


The problem with anti-Trump people is that (by default) you now place yourself on the side of bigger government, higher taxes, less freedoms, more regulations.

That's a tough ideological position to defend.

Wait til he's re-elected. The libs will go into vapor-lock.

To be brutally honest, I'm a long term investor. I'm bookmarking this topic so that I can come back and gloat in say, 6 months about how well the country is working.

EPIC....

Fred..

a reply to: dragonridr

That is not what I asked that poster. I asked for him to explain to me how a corporate tax rate cut is going to hurt him. Since you want to chime in then please explain to me how a corporate tax rate cut is going to personally hurt you. I'm waiting for an appropriate response from someone and have yet to receive a valid answer.

a reply to: soberbacchus

Again you cannot answer a simple question. Explain to me how a corporate tax rate cut is going to personally hurt you. Or will you continue to avoid the question and deflect in typical liberal ignorance fashion?

One last time.

How is a corporate tax rate cut going to personally hurt you?