Rabbi's Compare Trump To "Cyrus The Great"

DP

a reply to: Blue_Jay33

I don’t agree , but That is irrelevant concerning what I said..

That is why I capitalized INTERPRETED, because from the POV of the ancient Jews, all the way down to modern ones.. that is not how they interpreted it.

ACCORDING to them they were not expecting a divine son of god, nor was one prophecized.


To the point your making, the only way he fits is if everyone Jewish that as pre-Jesus has it wrong, and that would include those who originally wrote it down the first time.

Plus it is funny how many of those check lists are based on intangibles, and speculation..

The Jews expected to be released from bondage “in the flesh” not some in some intangible spiritual sense. They were presently enslaved by Rome. Part of the messiah check list requires the Jews to be freed.

The Jews were not freed. They continued in bondage to Rome for centuries after that.



I haven’t glanced at the site you linked yet, but I bet that is their justification for that and I personally don’t buy it.

It reeks of snake oil since it’s justification is based on something that can’t be checked..

You might as well say that Jesus went back in time and changed the text of the original phrophecies to confuse the Jewish people..

You can fit ANYTHING you want in that whole.

a reply to: Blue_Jay33

On a side note I heard this one historians/theological take that says ..


“When we think of Jesus, we think of the man who went around performing miracles to the poorest of the poor for free. We think the unique part of his story is the miracles because we live in the modern world and know miracles might never happen.

But what made Jesus unique in his own time , was that he gave them away for free..

Faith healers were a dime a dozen back then . Touring the countryside healing the rich and famous in exchNge for room , board and patronage..

Then some yahoo come along and reportedly does some amazing stuff for free. Well that messed up the local priesthood’s whole buisness model so he had to go.

a reply to: JoshuaCox

When people are presented with over 350 Hebrew prophesies that are fulfilled with Jesus and still say, nope......
choosing to ignore the facts of the bible, I can't really say too much more.
Personal ideology/dogma is like a nose everybody has their own, but in the end their can only be one reality for the real truth of the spiritual as it relates to God...keep searching.

Back to the topic now


As it stands we don't know if Trump is just the setup man for everything, or is everything going to break apart while he is still President. My theory is this, either the lying MSN which is like a vampire and keeps coming back with stupid news, gets a powerful event happening which is like stake through it's heart, killing the false narratives for good. Or the democrats put a really awesome candidate in, and the MSN celebrates their arrival. Either way the news has to turn really positive at some point according to the bible if only for a short time.

a reply to: JoshuaCox

The only people who consider Jesus fulfilling those 354 phrophecies are Christians who have a personal and financial stake in finding that..

No scientist, archeologist or historian has gone from being an atheist, to making some tangible discovery that makes them convert to Christianity..

People with those titles have had a spiritual experience “off the clock” that made them convert..

OMG DUDE I JUST SCANNED THE LIST AND GIVE ME A BREAK?!?!

Omg.. it is just sentence fragments that mean nothing in the form he is using them..

Did you even read that?!?!

“Seed of Abraham will bless all nations”

That is proof of a Jesus prophecy?!?

Lmao..

There is no way you just got self righteous with that garbage as your trump card..


He doesn’t even list why that verse is a Christ phrophecy NOR how Jesus fulfills those verses..


I’m almost offended.. I guess you thought I wouldn’t check it..

I’m glad you needled me into looking.

a reply to: Blue_Jay33

The argument that Jesus fit 350 or more prophesies is a feat easily achieved when you consider a few simple facts:
1. The gospels were written at least 30 - 60 years after Jesus allegedly has lived.

Ponder this carefully in light of the fact that History is written by the victors.

2. Because it is written after the "fact" it is very easy to mold the narrative according to historical events.

It is a bit akin to what today we would go see in a movie theater: A movie based on actual events. The story line does not even have to conform to reality, only to be probable.

3. Eye witness accounts are known to be highly problematic in terms of what really happened.

Each and every person recounts an event as he or she has seen it, from their own reality. And how our reality generally is shaped is by events and emotions of the past.
Wim Kayzer has written a most enjoyable book and made a television series about how we access memories and use it from the perspective of writers, psychologists etc. Ben Okri, Gary Lynch, Elisabeth Loftus, Joseph Brodsky, Mario Vargas Llosa, Gerhard Durlacher, to name a few. 19 hours of interviews. You can find them online: "vertrouwd en o zo vreemd, in English: familiar and yet so alien. (use startpage or ixquick click video's)
Mario Vargas Llosa is an accomplished writer, yet when he recounts a memory from way back, about the color of a house in his village, he used to be convinced the color was pink. After visiting the town again, it turned out it used to be green.
Our memory is bits and pieces strung together with a mix of our own desires, hopes and fears. Not the most reliable source, though it might provide leads to further inquiry.

4. Further inquiry is practically impossible because there are no other contemporary sources that corroborate the given narrative.

The 325 Council of Nicea has done it's job very well in destruction of source material. What we are left with is an accepted politically motivated narrative that we are supposed to belief. This is a bit akin to the Warren Commission report, or the report on 9/11.

I am aware that some of you will feel offended. If you do, I cannot help you, and I will not apologize, though I do feel empathy for you. These are the things that happen each and every time, however attached you may be to an idea.

5. The motif of a liberator, son of god who dies and is resurrected, are basically the main ideas that can be found in many old religions.

This should not suggest, it did not happen, only that it happened more often than one might think. And that should give pause to consider the slight possibility that the whole story revolves around the insecurity mankind has with the question of death. What is it, and how can a survivor reconcile himself with it.

Unweaving the web here we are actually left with two basic concepts:
1. To deal with life and death is a personal matter where each and every one of us has it's own path of discovery.
2. By politicizing this realm, people are easily aroused and thrown in to gear.

Take your pick. We can debate till .... eh ... Kingdom come, so to speak, and it would not resolve anything. Personally, I would be highly suspicious of religious leaders who pander to politicians or the other way around. Because the stronger we feel about a certain subject, especially when it concerns genuinely held beliefs, however barbaric, retarded, progressive or not, the easier we are sucked into groupthink and fall victim to lack of reason.

Once, during the age of enlightenment, we discovered that separation between religion and politics was a good thing. In French this is called: cohabitation. Many countries since have followed similar ideas. One might think of it as:

Oh, East is East, and West is West, and never the twain shall meet,
Till Earth and Sky stand presently at God's great Judgment seat;

Yet, when you really consider it's meaning:


But there is neither East nor West, Border, nor Breed, nor Birth,
When two strong men stand face to face, though they come from the ends of the earth!

and it comes to the nitty gritty .... do you still feel that petty divisions matter at all? That it matters whether or not some rabbi's see patterns fueling their hopes? They look in the past, to see the future, when all they contend with are fleeting illusions.

a reply to: Blue_Jay33

but was not of the Davidic line

Yeah thats a given considering he was from Persia.

a reply to: JoshuaCox

I understand you are fully locked into your personal ideology, it's people like you I really want to live long enough to see the finality of the end times....so live long and prosper.

Sure they didn't mean Billy Ray Cyrus?

a reply to: Blue_Jay33

I really find that offensive...

Not the “people like you “ part, but just the insult to my intelligence concerning those 350 checklist..

I was on board after the first one..

Born from the seed of a woman..

But then it just went off the rails..

I don’t even believe you think that they all make sense..

a reply to: Lysergic

Billy ray and trump have much in common!!