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Video shows police killing of Daniel Shaver in Mesa, Arizona (viewer discretion advised)

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posted on Dec, 10 2017 @ 05:51 AM
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a reply to: Xcathdra




No I think the police have a right to be cautious and to defend themselves from a person considered to be armed when that person consistently fails to follow verbal commands. It's not murder so while im "getting over myself" you can take the time to learn the law instead of responding in ignorance.


Dont have to worry about that then. Its going to take you a long time to get over yourself.. Call it what you want. Its state produced murder and you are a supporter of it.




posted on Dec, 10 2017 @ 05:52 AM
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originally posted by: AngryCymraeg
a reply to: Xcathdra

Yet again you defend the indefensible.
Can I ask what needs to be required for you to admit that a police officer made a massive error and must be held accountable? Because you keep defending people who have overreacted to threats that don't exist.
Once again, you make me afraid to go to the USA. You really do, I am not exaggerating this, you make me doubt the judgement of US law enforcement officers.


It clearly is not indefensible, as the man shot made a sudden movement behind him and towards his waist. The officer had no option but to shoot him.



posted on Dec, 10 2017 @ 05:54 AM
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Many people die because police think they have a gun. A person can't undo that thought and is at it's mercy.



posted on Dec, 10 2017 @ 05:55 AM
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originally posted by: purplemer
a reply to: Xcathdra




No I think the police have a right to be cautious and to defend themselves from a person considered to be armed when that person consistently fails to follow verbal commands. It's not murder so while im "getting over myself" you can take the time to learn the law instead of responding in ignorance.


Dont have to worry about that then. Its going to take you a long time to get over yourself.. Call it what you want. Its state produced murder and you are a supporter of it.


So you attack me for presenting the side of the story you could care less about?

Not surprising in the least.

As for state murder again the state via the prosecuting attorney and the state via people on the jury say you are wrong.

I guess they are all supporters of state murder then right?

Do you even comprehend just how lost on this topic you are?
edit on 10-12-2017 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 10 2017 @ 05:56 AM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

A) The police officer may have gotten off being accused of murder (wrongly in my opinion) but he was still fired by the police force, so someone must have had no confidence in his judgement.
B) You always defend LEOs who everyone else thinks have overreacted or committed a crime. Every single time. The Wubbels case is a good example. Everyone but you admits that the cop there screwed up. You on the other hand doubled down on your conviction that it was a good arrest. That's why I'm afraid. How many other US cops are out there who refuse to admit that they are - can ever be - wrong? You seem to think that no LEO is or can be ever wrong. I hope I never meet you in an official capacity as I have no confidence whatsoever in your competence.
C) The very dead man in this case was being told to keep his hands up and crawl. The instructions being bellowed at him by armed officers were confused and the officer who murdered him fired his weapon in a hotel, endangering countless other people. I'm delighted that he had his badge taken away from him and outraged that he wasn't convicted of murder. He killed an unarmed defenceless man. You seem to be okay with that. I am not.



posted on Dec, 10 2017 @ 05:57 AM
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originally posted by: purplemer
a reply to: Xcathdra




No I think the police have a right to be cautious and to defend themselves from a person considered to be armed when that person consistently fails to follow verbal commands. It's not murder so while im "getting over myself" you can take the time to learn the law instead of responding in ignorance.


Dont have to worry about that then. Its going to take you a long time to get over yourself.. Call it what you want. Its state produced murder and you are a supporter of it.


At what point would the officer be justified in shooting.. when a gun had been drawn and the bullet on the way towards him???

Every time something like this happens procedures are in place to investigate and determine whether the officer used deadly force in a manner appropriate to the statutes they must abide by. In this case, the officer followed the law.

The ONLY person to blame for the victims' death is the victim himself, not the state or the officer.



posted on Dec, 10 2017 @ 06:00 AM
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a reply to: AngryCymraeg

He was not fired because of the incident.

He was, it appears, an idiot. To the extent he had carved some Rambo like BS onto his firearm. That is why he was fired.
The issue here is not the shooting - which was fully justified.

The issue is why they not only hired this idiot, but also how he managed to get a position that allowed him onto a response team and carry an AR-15.



posted on Dec, 10 2017 @ 06:03 AM
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originally posted by: roadgravel
Many people die because police think they have a gun. A person can't undo that thought and is at it's mercy.


True that. But in this case, showing a gun in a case in a public place and then not following instructions when confronted by an armed police officer, then reaching behind your back are grounds for the officer to reasonably think the person had a gun.



posted on Dec, 10 2017 @ 06:09 AM
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originally posted by: AngryCymraeg
A) The police officer may have gotten off being accused of murder (wrongly in my opinion) but he was still fired by the police force, so someone must have had no confidence in his judgement.

Now tell us what he was fired for.



originally posted by: AngryCymraeg
B) You always defend LEOs who everyone else thinks have overreacted or committed a crime. Every single time. The Wubbels case is a good example. Everyone but you admits that the cop there screwed up. You on the other hand doubled down on your conviction that it was a good arrest. That's why I'm afraid. How many other US cops are out there who refuse to admit that they are - can ever be - wrong? You seem to think that no LEO is or can be ever wrong. I hope I never meet you in an official capacity as I have no confidence whatsoever in your competence.

No I always explain the law enforcement side. The side you and others have no desire to read up on or bother to understand it/

No the Wuebbels case is not a good example because had you actually followed that thread you would have seen where I posted numerous times the officer actions were wrong.

However you trying to make that point proves my point that you only see one side and ignore anything that doesnt support the view you want. I have also stated in many threads on these topics that my explanations are not necessarily to support the officer in that case but to represent the side you guys ignore / refuse to learn about.



originally posted by: AngryCymraeg
C) The very dead man in this case was being told to keep his hands up and crawl. The instructions being bellowed at him by armed officers were confused and the officer who murdered him fired his weapon in a hotel, endangering countless other people. I'm delighted that he had his badge taken away from him and outraged that he wasn't convicted of murder. He killed an unarmed defenceless man. You seem to be okay with that. I am not.

He was told to keep his hands where they could be seen. He failed to comply with that knowing full well the course the situation would take if he failed to comply.

As for defenseless - nope.

Secondly you nor anyone else in this thread knew the suspect was unarmed. The only reason you know it now is because the media got that information AFTER the incident was over. Also they were not reported as pellet guns. Third 2 guns were located in the guys room so yes there were weapons present. Also the girlfriend was also present at the time this occurred and was safely taken into custody first by following commands.

Information not available to law enforcement on scene at the time of the incident.

Again not a hard concept to understand.
edit on 10-12-2017 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 10 2017 @ 06:22 AM
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If a cop has the drop on me, I will put my hands in the air.
I will not move until I am cuffed.
Not a big fan of being shot.
Will not comply to barked orders by a trigger happy retard.



posted on Dec, 10 2017 @ 08:43 AM
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The guy was already prone, face-down, and ANYBODY who cared
could have seen his shorts had a weak elastic waistband that held NOTHING.

This COP escalated this on purpose, and drunk on his own power,
he committed murder.

Twelve idiots somehow got it wrong.



posted on Dec, 10 2017 @ 08:44 AM
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That has to be one of the worst things I've ever watched.

I don't see any reason for the cop to shoot.

The cop made the guy do an impossible thing that is crawl with your legs crossed behind you. Of course you can't do that and when the guy falls over he gets shot.

Sickening



posted on Dec, 10 2017 @ 08:56 AM
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SO, my husband and I have been watching this cop's trial on YouTube.....it was watching the trail that we discovered that it was NOT the cop who shot the unarmed man who was screaming the orders, it was his sergeant (or his "boss"). We also learned that the cop's father is a retired Mesa policeman and, (I know people will scream about this, but I lived 10 years in Salt Lake City, Utah when it was primarily a Mormon city), this man is a Mormon in a very Mormon city, (Mesa).
He was released on his OWN recognizance in spite of the widow's lawyer BEGGING the judge to at least set bond. None was set. The state's attorney SUCKED...and I mean she was REALLY unorganized and a BAD lawyer......MANY things we learned watching the actual trial (boring.....but fascinating in that we garnered a LOT more information). He said that shooting the AR-15 was SAFER in a motel because the ammunition doesn't go through the body, but "shatters: inside the body.
The cop was arrogant on the stand and constantly was showing this arrogance towards the State's attorney.
I live in Gold Canyon, not too far from Mesa......this IS the wild, wild West and cops RULE the roost out here.....the laws are draconian in this state and LEO's are KINGS and can do NO wrong out here.....PERIOD.

The other cops could have come up to that man as he was in that position of being on his knees with his legs crossed and arms out in front of him on the floor....and they could have cuffed him. The man was DRUNK.....some movements, especially when drunk, are automatic....like pulling up your pants when they are about to be pulled off....NONE of us would think that we would be MURDERED by cops.....NONE of us would think that if we were drunk......

Watch the trial on YouTube......

a reply to: notsure1

edit on 12/10/2017 by Cornczech because: failure of autocorrect to do it's dang job



posted on Dec, 10 2017 @ 09:01 AM
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the man TRIED to follow the LOUSY instructions given by a SCREAMING cop......the man who was shot was DRUNK.....listen carefully to the instructions and tell me you wouldn't have gotten confused.....

There used to be a time when the police were NOT armed like the military....remember the days of tasers?

what happened to non-violent means to subdue suspects?

>a reply to: UKTruth



posted on Dec, 10 2017 @ 09:15 AM
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this incident happened TWO YEARS ago.....WAY before the Vegas shooting......

a reply to: HawkeyeNation



posted on Dec, 10 2017 @ 09:16 AM
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Our policing in this society arose from slave patrols and evolved not much from that point on. The police exist to serve the aristocracy and protect them and their extracted and concentrated wealth/property from the rest of us who perform the labor that allows them to amass such fortunes.

The power structure knows full well it has lost all semblance of legitimacy. Societal wealth is extracted at home to maintain the outer reaches of empire abroad as we occupy the planet militarily for the benefit of the Wall Street/donor/”job creator” class to insure their access to the resources of other nations in endless wars of profit.

Militarized police depts., corporate for profit prisons with convict labor leasing and stocks traded on Wall Street is the corporate state’s idea of a jobs program. As societal wealth is further and further concentrated into the hands of fewer and fewer, poverty will require criminalizing, and the system can turn $40-50K per head, per year on the incarcerated. Couple that with the fact that citizens in the US no longer have a guarantee of Habeas corpus, and all this blathering on about fweedumb is for those who cannot bear to face the truth.



posted on Dec, 10 2017 @ 09:20 AM
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originally posted by: Cornczech
the man TRIED to follow the LOUSY instructions given by a SCREAMING cop......the man who was shot was DRUNK.....listen carefully to the instructions and tell me you wouldn't have gotten confused.....

There used to be a time when the police were NOT armed like the military....remember the days of tasers?

what happened to non-violent means to subdue suspects?

>a reply to: UKTruth


I guess they disappeared when people started marching and chanting "pigs in a blanket, fry 'em like bacon" and cops came under ambush from radicals.
It's the people that have created the environment, not the state.
I fully understand cops ensuring their own lives are protected in the climate that has been created by these radicals. They have families to go home to as well.

edit on 10/12/2017 by UKTruth because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 10 2017 @ 09:24 AM
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originally posted by: bigyin
That has to be one of the worst things I've ever watched.

The cop made the guy do an impossible thing that is crawl with your legs crossed behind you. Of course you can't do that and when the guy falls over he gets shot.

Sickening


It is very very easy to shuffle along the floor with your legs crossed and hands in the air - as easy as walking.
Try it.



posted on Dec, 10 2017 @ 09:30 AM
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originally posted by: skunkape23

Will not comply to barked orders by a trigger happy retard.


....and if the cop was this guy pointing a gun at you, he would've shot you for not complying with his orders. You still would've been fubar'd.



posted on Dec, 10 2017 @ 09:35 AM
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originally posted by: skunkape23
If a cop has the drop on me, I will put my hands in the air.
I will not move until I am cuffed.
Not a big fan of being shot.
Will not comply to barked orders by a trigger happy retard.


I am with you there.
i will put my hands in the air and turn my back towards them and ignore all other commands from them.

It would be a clear case of execution if they shot a man in the back with his hands up




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