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Liberals please help me understand

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posted on Dec, 4 2017 @ 09:15 PM
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originally posted by: RickinVa
I have not watched a single pro game this year.

I prefer my sports without politics.


Amen.




posted on Dec, 4 2017 @ 09:20 PM
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Tebow knelt to pray.

Kapernick knelt to protest the police in the middle of the National Anthem.

You would have to bend over sideways and backwards to compare the two. Whether a person thinks either was right or wrong, there is no equivalency.

You must have read the Huffington Post piece or one of the equivalents, which were propaganda opinion pieces. The intellectual dishonesty in that is staggering.

I'm an Independent so I hope you mind my view. I have no problem with anyone kneeling to pray or as a form of protest, although I think the NFL players are wrong minded to do it the way they are.



posted on Dec, 4 2017 @ 09:26 PM
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Here is something that may explain this to you a bit:

Colin Kaepernick vs. Tim Tebow: A tale of two Christians on their knees

I'm not sure how people reacted to Tebow, in my opinion, both should be allowed to kneel in protest. I'm guessing Republicans were against Kaepernick while Democrats were against Tebow? Both are Christians kneeling for their beliefs. However, as the article says, there are two different branches of Christianity emerging in the United States.

Here is how I see it. I was very annoyed at Trump and others trying to take away Kaepernick's right to kneel during the national anthem as a form of protest. I think that free speech is important, and he is in a position where he can make a difference in the lives of many.

Similarly, I don't see why liberals should take away Tebow's right to kneel. That is hypocritical.

The thing is, conservatives are hypocrites as well if they say Tebow can kneel but Kaepernick cannot.
edit on 04pmMon, 04 Dec 2017 21:32:57 -0600kbpmkAmerica/Chicago by darkbake because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 4 2017 @ 09:35 PM
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originally posted by: Liquesence

originally posted by: Teikiatsu

originally posted by: Liquesence
a reply to: Teikiatsu

One could argue protest is a form of support for lesser causes.

That said, he has just as much a right to kneel as anyone. Reason doesn't really matter, the right to does.


One could, but one could also call Kapernick (and the other idiots like him) a putz who is ignorant of crime statistics and doesn't understand their audience nor that they are not winning many converts from the stands.



One could call him what one wishes, but in calling him a 'putz' one might not understand the larger issue in a broader context, the causes and reactions to which he's trying to bring awareness.


Mmm.... issues, context and awareness. I'll stick with putz.



posted on Dec, 4 2017 @ 09:37 PM
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originally posted by: Teikiatsu

originally posted by: Liquesence

originally posted by: Teikiatsu

originally posted by: Liquesence
a reply to: Teikiatsu

One could argue protest is a form of support for lesser causes.

That said, he has just as much a right to kneel as anyone. Reason doesn't really matter, the right to does.


One could, but one could also call Kapernick (and the other idiots like him) a putz who is ignorant of crime statistics and doesn't understand their audience nor that they are not winning many converts from the stands.



One could call him what one wishes, but in calling him a 'putz' one might not understand the larger issue in a broader context, the causes and reactions to which he's trying to bring awareness.


Mmm.... issues, context and awareness. I'll stick with putz.


Yeah, calling names is always easier.



posted on Dec, 4 2017 @ 09:40 PM
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originally posted by: Swills
a reply to: Liquesence

Why did he kneel?


Tebow or Kap?



posted on Dec, 4 2017 @ 09:47 PM
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One was kneeling for perceived and arguable social injustice, done before the game was started, the other for his faith, during the game(if that makes any difference)..honestly neither particularly bothers me, I guess it could be argued once the game is in play..stick to the game.



posted on Dec, 4 2017 @ 09:52 PM
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originally posted by: vonclod
One was kneeling for perceived and arguable social injustice, done before the game was started, the other for his faith, during the game(if that makes any difference)..honestly neither particularly bothers me, I guess it could be argued once the game is in play..stick to the game.


Meh. I don't see how either could bother anyone. It's that silly "faux rage' again.



posted on Dec, 4 2017 @ 10:02 PM
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a reply to: Tekaran

I don't think it's different at all. Bully for them both for kneeling for their belief.

Honestly, it's the same thing, IMO.



posted on Dec, 4 2017 @ 10:06 PM
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a reply to: angeldoll

I would agree.



posted on Dec, 4 2017 @ 10:25 PM
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One is a positive statement of thanks to God

The other is a finger to American patriots

This is how we can each tell what we are.



posted on Dec, 4 2017 @ 10:49 PM
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Op. You're asking "liberals" to help you "understand"? You're either a "liberal", trying to get a reaction out of strait/sane/un-mentally ill



posted on Dec, 4 2017 @ 10:53 PM
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"Kap's" an obvious pos! No man, takes a knee.. For anything.



posted on Dec, 5 2017 @ 05:28 AM
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a reply to: Tekaran

As far as I remember no one made a big brouhaha over T Bow kneeling, at least not on the scale of Kap, but I wonder how it would play out if a player ,bought out a prayer mat turned towards Mecca and start talking foreign.
BTW personally I had no problem with T Bow or any potential future chanting Muslims on the field.



posted on Dec, 5 2017 @ 07:32 AM
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a reply to: vonclod

I don’t see how the social injustice is precieved....

Anyone with even the most remote knowledge of the Civil War , reconstruction and the civil rights movement, would never claim the social injustices were only precieved..

The country didn’t go from white supremacy LITERALLY being considered a scientific fact less than 2 life times ago. To any social injustices only being precieved lol..



posted on Dec, 5 2017 @ 07:36 AM
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a reply to: visitedbythem

How is kneeling in protest during the national anthem a middle finger to the military/patriots???

Oh, the rightwing talking heads told people it was , and the sheeple just baaa baaa(ed) behind them all the way to bank....

They were protesting police violence against black people... not patriots and the military..

Some of the population is easier to drive crazy than a cat faced with something shiny..



posted on Dec, 5 2017 @ 07:44 AM
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originally posted by: darkbake

Colin Kaepernick vs. Tim Tebow: A tale of two Christians on their knees


That was a good read -- thank you for posting! I knew Kaepernick was a guy that puts his money where his mouth is (unlike so many others who just talk) and that he had promised to donate the proceeds from his jersey sales to charity; I didn't know he had done so much more. Nor that he was such a devout man. I don't think it's an accident that his faith has been ignored though.

It's not an accident that the author seems to think all Christians and all Christianity is one and the same and is just now changing. For too many years, I suppose since the rise of the "Moral Majority," there has been a deliberate and coordinated effort to focus on the loudest and most obnoxious Christians and then pretend all Christians are the same, and to ignore (or even deny) the very varied beliefs of other Christians. I used to be shocked at how many folks right here on ATS would "correct" Christians who tried to present another perspective, and even tell us what we must believe to be a Christian.

I don't want to derail the thread, so I'll just say that I hope this is the beginning of a new understanding of faith and Christianity -- and a new approach by media, politicians, and society in general.


I was very annoyed at Trump and others trying to take away Kaepernick's right to kneel during the national anthem as a form of protest.


Me too. The president should have let this play out in the private sector and the court of public opinion where it belongs. This is not an executive matter. And it's very disappointing to say the least that our president would encourage punitive action against a private citizen exercising his Constitutional rights... but I don't think Trump would know Constitutional principles if they bit him in the arse. So it is what it is.

Bottom line to me is that both Kaepernick and Tebow have the right to kneel in protest or in prayer on their time. Not on the NFL's time. And neither has any right to be an NFL player. So if the players cannot come to an agreement with their bosses, then they can all go their separate ways. No harm, no foul.



posted on Dec, 5 2017 @ 08:29 AM
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a reply to: Tekaran

Tebow was kneeling in "support" of something.

Krapernick was kneeling in "protest" of something...a whole country.

Seems pretty simple to me.



posted on Dec, 5 2017 @ 08:35 AM
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So, here's what I think...

I think the NFL should make a rule change. They should change the rules to state ambiguous statements during the National Anthem are now expressly prohibited and will result in an automatic unsportsmanlike conduct penalty. Instead, players wishing to make a statement during the anthem are absolutely required to be crystal clear about the statement they are making.

So, in Krapernic's case, he should stand and flip off every person in the crowd, with both hands, for the duration of the anthem. No more ambiguous S#, let's cut right to the chase!



posted on Dec, 5 2017 @ 09:36 AM
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a reply to: Flyingclaydisk

Why is the national anthem off limits to protest?!?!




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