Colorado doctors claim baby boy is first marijuana overdose death

originally posted by: projectvxn
In your opinion, based upon what you’ve seen and what information you have regarding this incident, do you believe that these doctors have any reason to suspect marijuana to the exclusion of other factors? If yes, do you think it is the THC itself doing this or other chemical compounds found in marijuana like myrcene?

So I learned a lesson a long time ago when I was a new nurse. We had a kid that had HUS or hemolytic uremic syndrome. They interviewed out intensivist and even though he spoke for 30 minutes about how this kid was going to be okay they used the one clip to lead off the news where he said 'It can be fatal" and thats pretty much all they played: so: untill I hear or see the autopsy reports or hear a transcript verbatim from the docs in question, its hard to tell, the media puts its own spin on everything. But:

Yes if the kid ingested (not smoked) too much pot in an edible then they can die from it.

It could be anything in the pot that was ingested to be honest. Its the amounts and concentrations in a small mass that make it dangerous. Its a pretty straight forward cascade and we see it with everything from Tylenol to other stuff

1) Too much THC/pot etc leads to a decreased level of consciousness and hypoxia (the mechanism is typically encephalitis)
2) Organ systems take a hit, including the brain
3) organ dysfunction and/or brain dysfunction becomes to much to recover
4) patient dies

Me thinks those doctors diagnosing this fatality are dip shifts.

I think people in this thread are arguing two distinct points:

A) It is difficult if not impossible to smoke your way into an overdose

B) Edibles have a much higher concentration and thus make it easier to go overboard esp if a child with a low body mass eats enough edibles for 3-4 full grown adults

BOTH are correct

originally posted by: BASSPLYR
Me thinks those doctors diagnosing this fatality are dip shifts.

Who knows. But as I pointed out in several replies we are seeing children who have overdosed and have had side effects. In my personal experience some have had Glasgow coma scales of 6-7 which are borderline for intubation etc. So the premise is more than possible.

5 brownies in a 100 kg adult is going to have a different effect than 5 brownies in a 20 kg child

Also for the record I voted to legalize pot in California last elections and I don't see and issue with adult usuage. But with things like alcohol, the adults need to show responsibility IF they have children in the house etc (no different than with guns or alcohol)

a reply to: FredT

Thank you for the clarifications.

originally posted by: visitedbythem

originally posted by: notsure1
a reply to: visitedbythem

We will begin to see deaths in the future, after Monsanto starts playing with Cannabis DNA

Damm I never thought of that before. Reading that kinda bummed me out.

That's why the people who legally grow Cannabis for medical reasons are stocking up and making their own seeds. They just keep them in the freezer for long storage.

I confirm the scenario....my strategy this season, too

get rid of couchlock.....

I voted against it, but I do see and understand why you are for it.

originally posted by: Iamonlyhuman

originally posted by: SeaWorthy
There have been many children poisoned and seriously ill from eating brownies and other "treats".

Poisoned from the marijuana or from other ingredients in the brownies? If you make a claim, you really should say where you get your information from.

There's been tons of threads on the subject, pretty common knowledge by now.

a reply to: lovebeck

Have you read their full report? The little baby had 7.8 ng/ml of THC in his blood, hours after he was first unwell, which means it must have been a LOT higher. Here it is again, I posted it above:

Pediatric death due to myocarditis after exposure to cannabis

originally posted by: Caver78

How THIS ^^^^ got twisted into four pages of irrelevant opinions eludes me. If you're going to make a thread about a subject then use click bait as your only source instead of the original material, well, shame on ya!
:

See above, that's the original source.

Colorado.... especially, Las Animas .....

What a S***hole.....over run by drugs, gangs and corruption in every level and is one of the highest in the nation for STDs.

Very sad, but Totally doesn't surprise me
😒

a reply to: Agartha

The authors report an 11-month-old male who, following cannabis exposure, presented with central nervous system depression after seizure, and progressed to cardiac arrest and died. Myocarditis was diagnosed post-mortem and cannabis exposure was confirmed. Given the temporal relationship of these two rare occurrences – cannabis exposure and sudden death secondary to myocarditis in an 11-month-old – as well as histological consistency with drug-induced myocarditis without confirmed alternate causes, and prior reported cases of cannabis-associated myocarditis, a possible relationship exists between cannabis exposure in this child and myocarditis leading to death.

how is a possible relationship between the same thing as confirmed cause?

Given this information, the authors deduce that cannabis consumption occurred within the recent two to six days

again i am no doctor but it seems like plenty of assumptions/associations are being made.

2-6 days after ingesting some insane edible the baby died?????

Limitations in this report include the case study design, the limitations on interpreting an exact time, dose and route of cannabis exposure, the specificity of histopathology being used to classify etiology of myocarditis, and inconsistent blood culture results. The inconsistency in blood culture results also raises concern of a contributing bacterial etiology in the development of myocarditis, lending to the possibility that cannabis may have potentially induced the fatal symptomatology in an already-developing silent myocarditis.

a reply to: seattlerat

“We are absolutely not saying that marijuana killed that child,” said Dr. Thomas Nappe, an author of the report who is now the director of medical toxicology at St. Luke’s University Health Network in Bethlehem, Pa.

WaPo article

originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: seattlerat

“We are absolutely not saying that marijuana killed that child,” said Dr. Thomas Nappe, an author of the report who is now the director of medical toxicology at St. Luke’s University Health Network in Bethlehem, Pa.

WaPo article

Nappe, who co-authored the report with Dr. Christopher Hoyte, explained that the doctors simply observed this unusual sequence of events, documented it and alerted the medical community that it is worth studying a possible relationship between cannabis and the child’s cause of death, myocarditis, or inflammation of the heart muscle.

sadly like with every article these days people dont get much past the headline or the first paragraph. the source article said as much too.

people are already spreading this around via twitter and whatever else.
the demon weed just killed a baby. time to eradicate

Nappe emphasized that the word associated should not be interpreted as indicating a cause and effect.

“You just can’t make those statements because then what happens is lay people say ‘Oh my god, did you hear a kid died from marijuana poisoning?’ and it can be sensationalized,” said Dr. Noah Kaufman, a Northern Colorado emergency room physician.

it already started in this thread. edibles are too strong. dispensaries dont know what they are selling.
there needs to be this or that

a reply to: seattlerat

No they aren't. That is the sensational story the media told.
The truth behind the ‘first marijuana overdose death’

Except that’s not what the doctors meant.

“We are absolutely not saying that marijuana killed that child,” said Thomas Nappe, an author of the report who is now the director of medical toxicology at St. Luke’s University Health Network in Bethlehem, Pa.

Nappe, who co-authored the report with Christopher Hoyte, explained that the doctors simply observed this unusual sequence of events, documented it and alerted the medical community that it is worth studying a possible relationship between cannabis and the child’s cause of death, myocarditis, or inflammation of the heart muscle.

ETA: Yikes! I was beat by at least two other people. Glad to see some ignorance being denied here.

a reply to: TinySickTears

Tobacco overdose has been far more deadly to children

originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: TinySickTears

Tobacco overdose has been far more deadly to children

correct. and like i said earlier so has prescription drugs and car rides and baby blankets and stairs

originally posted by: TinySickTears
how is a possible relationship between the same thing as confirmed cause?

again i am no doctor but it seems like plenty of assumptions/associations are being made.

2-6 days after ingesting some insane edible the baby died?????

Their deduction is based on chemistry: they found Δ-9-carboxy-THC in his blood, a high level.

Δ-9-carboxy-THC is a product of the metabolism of Tetrahydrocannabinol. THC is the original compound and Δ-9-carboxy-THC a product of its synthesis.

If THC in its original form had been found in the blood, it would have shown the ingestion had happened within the previous 24 hours. In fact, sometimes THC is undetectable even 6 hours after exposure in a person who does not smoke or ingest cannabis frequently.

Δ-9-carboxy-THC has a longer half life, being detectable even weeks after consumption (in heavy users). Source.

As THC was not present, but Δ-9-carboxy-THC was, and bearing in mind it may take a couple of days for myocarditis to fully develop, the scientist came to the conclusion ingestion was two to six days previously. I hope my explanation makes it a bit clearer.

I repeat what I've said before: doctors have not concluded cannabis was definitely the culprit, but as there have been other cases of myocarditis in healthy patients who were only exposed to cannabis, they are suggesting more research is needed, and that pediatricians should make parents aware of a possible link between cannabis toxicity and children's sudden cardiac problems.

a reply to: Agartha

It is a fairly well documented fact that THC, or something within cannibis, can cause cardiac issues. Especially when mixed with other drugs (coke mixed with pot can cause heart attacks)