It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Second Amendment Advocates Have Blood on Their Hands

page: 42
88
<< 39  40  41    43  44  45 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Nov, 6 2017 @ 08:44 PM
link   
a reply to: Willtell

I have and DO repeatedly ,NOR have you demonstrated any superior knowledge on weapons use ,the military or what to do when a loud noise happens for that matter.
I have ,'t called YOU a liar as a person and YOU gave to do so about me or the simple fact of military service makes your perceived "AUTHORITY" mute and my own readily identifiable,so YOUR only debate answer here is to call me a liar.
You see I CAN dance around the room when any liberal civilian clams A THING about guns and says they know more OR my impairments are so crippling,I can't tell.
It makes me feels SO intelligent easily winning debates as YOU yourself ran off saying I was lying or or refusing to answer because it won't fly anywhere else but left.
You don't KNOW and we ARE aware of how you FEEL will there be anything else you require?
edit on 6-11-2017 by cavtrooper7 because: (no reason given)

edit on 6-11-2017 by cavtrooper7 because: (no reason given)




posted on Nov, 6 2017 @ 08:46 PM
link   

originally posted by: Krakatoa

originally posted by: Willtell

originally posted by: Krakatoa

originally posted by: Willtell
a reply to: SailorJerry

If you willingly allow access to guns to psychopaths you are responsible, particularly I light of the reality that it keeps happening and folks like you do nothing about it

Won’t move off your stubborn path

That’s your worst sin.

Heedlessness


Diagnosed psychopath are already denied access to legal firearm ownership.
Yet more ignorance of the subject to which you continue to chide us all on here.

Please, get educated on the law, and of firearms and safety. Details matter....or don't you give a damn about that?



I’m talking about the fact that mental illness, undiagnosed and unknown, is rampant in this society yet the gun freaks knowingly DON’T CARE.

You keep assuming I don’t know this or that because you have no intelligent argument just straw men you bring up that are not true and not applicable to the main disscusion


How do you propose to strip a United States citizen of their legal rights if they are undiagnosed? Are you a psychic? See, there is this thing called innocent until proven guilty. We do not, nor should we, have thought crimes in this country. Much to the chagrin of the likes of you that want magic to occur that spots potential criminals before they commit any criminal act.

Seems to me, that is a symptom of a dissociation disorder and indicates a delusional mind. Perhaps you are an undiagnosed psychopath and need all your rights stripped away, just in case?


Above is my full post regarding your emotional and mental state. Nowhere did I call you a psychopath. I asked the question if you were an undiagnosed psychopath based upon your repeated bouts of emotional triggered rantings, overt hostility toward those that have a differing viewpoint, and delusions of knowing who is worthy of having their rights tripped away based upon nothing but conjecture and emotional outbursts.

That was a concerned posting that you might need some time to step back and put away those delusions. Before someone with your same viewpoint decides to use that view upon you.

Again, I see no insults, only logical extrapolations based upon your own willful ignorance and failure to understand and accept an opposing viewpoint without resorting to using children as a tool in your argument.



posted on Nov, 6 2017 @ 08:57 PM
link   

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
a reply to: RainyState

I think you make some good points in that post.

One of the important things I think to remember is that I (and I think others might agree) believe that guns are a big part of American culture so you are never going to be able to just change this over the course of a few years, this would require a very slow change over a generation to reduce gun numbers and gun violence.

Legislating for stronger gun controls is only one part of the problem but I believe it is a important obstacle that has to be overcome to bring about any real change and a reduction in overall gun deaths.


why do u think more legislation would change anything? what historical evidence do u have to suggest it would help. as far as im aware when we had very little firearm laws or legislation we didnt have these types of shootings at all. yes we had gun crime but it was due to criminal behavior in the first place and usually there was a carrot at the end of the stick for the crimes committed. not like today where these people have no expectation to survive what they are doing. so weve gone from a time where we didnt have these crimes at all and anyone could walk down to the store and buy a gun outright, to a healthy amount of legislation that covers practically all scenarios in most cases yet we have these crimes happening more and more. do u think that maybe just maybe it has nothing to do with guns or legislation and is possibly a sympton of something within our societies today?
edit on 6-11-2017 by TheScale because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 6 2017 @ 08:58 PM
link   
a reply to: Willtell




I express deep empathy for murdered children so I’m a psychopath? umm...


Really? whats your stance on abortion?



posted on Nov, 6 2017 @ 08:59 PM
link   

originally posted by: Willtell
a reply to: projectvxn

I'm very calm, I've always been calm, I think its thou who aren't calm.


Again more nonsensical rhetoric

At what point has he not come across as calm and measured?



posted on Nov, 6 2017 @ 09:03 PM
link   
a reply to: cavtrooper7

Look my friend, I have nothing against you or your friends. I hold you within the same feelings of compassion I hold the poor victims of this tragedy and any human.

I'm not about hurting people but helping people. If I called you a liar, though I don't recall that, then I apologize.

God bless you brother!



posted on Nov, 6 2017 @ 09:04 PM
link   
God help us all we sure need it!



posted on Nov, 6 2017 @ 09:09 PM
link   
a reply to: Willtell

I made my place as a soldier I have other skills but nothing will change what I already am.
It is accurate.



posted on Nov, 6 2017 @ 09:13 PM
link   

originally posted by: Willtell
God help us all we sure need it!


How about ... you concentrate on you getting better ... with God's help if you need Him ... and come back to us as a real person ... as opposed to this trollish persona.

P



posted on Nov, 6 2017 @ 09:15 PM
link   
a reply to: Willtell

You are blind to your own hypocrisy, aren't you?

You castigate some for calling you names, yet do the same thing yourself.

Might I suggest that your argument, faulty as it is, might be, at least, a bit more effective with a bit less in the way of hypocrisy?



posted on Nov, 6 2017 @ 09:20 PM
link   

originally posted by: seagull
a reply to: Willtell

You are blind to your own hypocrisy, aren't you?

You castigate some for calling you names, yet do the same thing yourself.

Might I suggest that your argument, faulty as it is, might be, at least, a bit more effective with a bit less in the way of hypocrisy?



Or at least some facts involved, I can deal with the "ignorant" accusations etc and usually overlook them in favor of substance.

But there arent even any facts involved and apparently NO knowledge of how the documents that established our republic even work, or the laws enacted since then.

Thats my main issue, that and the refusal to answer questions posited that challenge his stance.



posted on Nov, 6 2017 @ 09:43 PM
link   

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin

originally posted by: JinMI
a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

What about truck owners? Are they responsible for the events in NYC, Nice and the UK?



Apples and oranges this is about and the second amendment.

Its not about Trucks, knifes or the UK its about the Second amendment


...your remarks contain everything educated Americans need to know or deal with.

"this is about and the second amendment". If you have a problem with The Rule of Law, don't live in the U.S.

In your case... you live in the most surveilled society on earth, and STILL have to deal with violence, pedophiles and rank criminality... even though the average Brit is captured a couple/few thousands times a day on CCTV.

...and yet... YOU are going to lecture US?

Your countryman, George Orwell was thinking of folks JUST like you, literally, when he wrote "1984" and "Animal Farm".

Good luck with that...



posted on Nov, 6 2017 @ 10:04 PM
link   
a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin>>>> Well, we have the air force to blame and we have a hero with a gun to thank for ending the rampage. So I don't think the deep staters will be doing anything but scratching their red baboons asses knowing they can't turn this into the gun grab PR event they want. These shootings only sell more guns and make the people want to carry them even more.



posted on Nov, 6 2017 @ 10:29 PM
link   

originally posted by: seagull
a reply to: Willtell

You are blind to your own hypocrisy, aren't you?

You castigate some for calling you names, yet do the same thing yourself.

Might I suggest that your argument, faulty as it is, might be, at least, a bit more effective with a bit less in the way of hypocrisy?



What are you talking about. Its you who is blind to your duty as a moderator. As I have to waste time defending insults that YOU suppose to be moderating

YOUR THE HYPOCRITE AND SHOULD BE FIRED
edit on 6-11-2017 by Willtell because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 6 2017 @ 10:42 PM
link   

originally posted by: thesaneone
a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin




You second amendment advocates have blood on your hands.


What a joke.

I'm pro 2nd and I will sleep just fine tonight.


Just lucky for those survivors that someone had a gun to defend them. Guns don't kill people, people kill people. But don't expect a reasonable discussion from the anti-gun nutters.



posted on Nov, 6 2017 @ 10:42 PM
link   
a reply to: Willtell

Now you play the victim?



posted on Nov, 6 2017 @ 11:55 PM
link   

originally posted by: Willtell

originally posted by: seagull
a reply to: Willtell

You are blind to your own hypocrisy, aren't you?

You castigate some for calling you names, yet do the same thing yourself.

Might I suggest that your argument, faulty as it is, might be, at least, a bit more effective with a bit less in the way of hypocrisy?



What are you talking about. Its you who is blind to your duty as a moderator. As I have to waste time defending insults that YOU suppose to be moderating

YOUR THE HYPOCRITE AND SHOULD BE FIRED


again ignorance of how things work....he doesnt moderate threads he posts in, he cant its against T and C
And honestly if this were anything but the mudpit you would have been post banned by now with all your personal attacks, so if I were you , I would back off trying to tell mods how to do their jobs.

Honestly if you werent a member since 2013 I would think were a teenager



posted on Nov, 7 2017 @ 12:02 AM
link   

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
Another mass shooting.

And this is not going to be a popular thread……

So before anyone wants to post some knee jerk reaction this title please just read what I have to say.

So I have often said that the reason that Trump does what he does is because his base of support do not challenge him. If every time he says or tweets something stupid and his base of support rush to defend him he will keep doing it, even to the detriment of the nation. This is because there are two extremes, his opposition are pretty unlikely to support him no matter what and he knows this, trying to appease them is pretty pointless yet his supporters it seems will defend him no matter what. By extension then so long as Trump supporters continue to defend him they too are also partly to blame for the mess he is slowly creating.

This however is not another Trump thread.

I realised yesterday that this line of thinking applies to more than just trump supports and partisan politics. It could apply to political issues, second amendment advocacy for example.

The biggest obstacle to introducing gun control policies in America is a lack of political will and the force behind the big lobbies. If Trump and the Republicans were to turn around today and announce they were going introduce British or Australian gun laws it would be political suicide. The NRA has something like 5 million members (some estimate up to 14 million) so right away they have lost 5 million votes. That alone could be enough to have a huge impact in swing states however we know that there are many millions more in America who would also strongly oppose any such changes to gun laws. It would be political suicide so no politician is going to want to do it because doing so would be to sacrifice the power that comes with political office. Some would probably even take to actual violence in opposition to any changes in the law.

Let me say that I think its sickening that the politicians refuse to act out of this fear, they fear losing the support of the gun lobbies and they fear losing the votes that will see them maintain their position of power.

Yet if the people who are such strong advocates of gun rights were to revolt, if they were to say enough is enough and in enough numbers and demand sweeping changes to gun laws to try to stop all these senseless killings then things would change. It would give the politicians the political will to stand up to the gun lobbies and pass laws that would be the start of adopting more sensible gun laws.

The big problem then lies with those who refuse to challenge these gun laws for selfish reasons. After every mass shooting there is a plethora of individuals who rush to defend their guns and deflect away with other arguments about cars, knifes, mental illness and that I am British…..

The truth is that every time you defend your right to own a gun you are defending the rights of the shooter as well and as such I believe you have blood on your hands. So long as you continue to defend your precious second amendment you are defending the ability for these men to walk into a church or school and kill indiscriminately. If you would change your thinking, admit this is wrong and pressure your politicians to act to bring about stronger gun regulation and kick out the gun lobbies it would happen.

You have the power you just refuse to use it.

It coms down to that old quote

“The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing”

That is what is happening right now you are all sitting back doing nothing, preventing change and the result is a mass shooting almost every day.

You second amendment advocates have blood on your hands.


I read your entire writing. Here in a little while I am going to come back and say more, so as not to give a "knee-jerk" response.



posted on Nov, 7 2017 @ 12:07 AM
link   

originally posted by: JinMI
a reply to: Willtell

Now you play the victim?



Of course he is, besides he thinks its all a conspiracy anyway and theres nothing we can do ..


His thread he thinks the gov is killing both sides

So this means hes trolling, he has no sincere belief in any of it, If he truly believes his own thread then "Gun legislation" wouldnt matter because the gov is doing it to pit us against each other!

Willtell time to come clean on your motivations buddy, this is intentional trolling and a breach of T and C

I feel like its just an exercise to see how much he can get away with before being banned, he knows ATS is much more lenient than it use to be, hence attacking a moderator.

A few years ago this wouldnt have gone on this long, we need to get back to our stringent policies, no offense but ATS has become a microcosm of our own society and how people get away with crap
edit on 7-11-2017 by SailorJerry because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 7 2017 @ 01:31 AM
link   
a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

ok, here is my non-knee-jerk response to your post.

“By extension then so long as Trump supporters continue to defend him they too are also partly to blame for the mess he is slowly creating”.

Which mess is he creating?

“This however is not another Trump thread”.

So glad!

“The biggest obstacle to introducing gun control policies in America is a lack of political will and the force behind the big lobbies”.

Agreed, big lobbies have ALWAYS been a huge problem!

“If Trump and the Republicans were to turn around today and announce…”

If ANY past president would have announced…”


So then why have they ALL catered to big lobbies over our entire history?

“It would be political suicide so no politician is going to want to do it because doing so would be to sacrifice the power that comes with political office”.

"Let me say that I think it’s sickening that the politicians refuse to act out of this fear, they fear losing the support of the gun lobbies and they fear losing the votes that will see them maintain their position of power".

It IS sickening that they have refused to act out of fear of losing their power!

“Yet if the people who are such strong advocates of gun rights were to revolt, if they were to say enough is enough and in enough numbers and demand sweeping changes to gun laws to try to stop all these senseless killings then things would change”.

Revolt? To stop the violence?? Makes sense. How would they revolt? By marching in a picket line with a sign?


“It would give the politicians the political will to stand up to the gun lobbies and pass laws that would be the start of adopting more sensible gun laws”.

It would really help our country if the politicians could stand up to these lobbies and adopt more sensible laws in many areas, especially crime.

“The truth is that every time you defend your right to own a gun you are defending the rights of the shooter as well and as such I believe you have blood on your hands”.

!TROLL ZONE!

Every time I think of defending my right to own a gun so that I can protect the safety of my friends or loved ones if I had to – makes me a person who is trying to care about others.


“So long as you continue to defend your precious second amendment you are defending the ability for these men to walk into a church or school and kill indiscriminately”.

Is it your opinion then that because we want to have the right to own a gun, then we are all AGAINST strict background checks? That we wouldn’t be willing to agree to own only one gun (to protect innocent lives) if such a law was passed? That we dance with glee when a criminal commits a gun crime? That we don’t care if a criminal takes innocent lives? Are you saying that you are against the Constitution? or that we should just scrap parts of it?

“If you would change your thinking, admit this is wrong”…

I cannot and WILLNOT change my way of thinking because it is the right thing to do as a responsible, law-abiding citizen of the USA, and as a mother, sister, and friend. And YES, I would even volunteer to get signatures for VERY STRONG background checks! I am all for that and I would even encourage the lawmakers to implement very frequent checks to ensure things have not changed in a person’s background.


“The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing”

Finally, something we can agree on for sure!! I just wish the people everywhere who are now quoting this quote would have advocated for this a LONG TIME AGO! It might have cleared up 9/11, Vegas, Rwanda,The Clinton (purported) crime trail, Hitler, worldwide poverty, economic inequality, ISIS, the opioid epidemic, the list is endless!! If the SAME aforementioned people would hav_javascript:icon('
')e stood up against even just ONE of these things – things might be different to this day! And even though they DIDN’T…many, if not most, of us who might advocate against disarming the citizens of the US still have not spoken the words “but the blood for all this is on their hands”.

“That is what is happening right now you are all sitting back doing nothing, preventing change and the result is a mass shooting almost every day”.

How do you know what we are doing? What did you do today?

“You second amendment advocates have blood on your hands”.

REALLY? I spend 90% of my time/conversations with people, and especially young people, talking to them about God, Jesus, peaceful and respectful living, and also try to help those in need. I have spent my life helping/encouraging others to achieve their dreams so that they would not have to resort to a life of crime (hopefully). What have you actually done?

So in my opinion, although I agree you have the right to yours as well, it is this kind of rhetoric that assures us that nothing can ever get accomplished so long as we continue to stick our head in the sand and refuse to see what is REALLY going on and then placing blame in the WRONG places.

Guns, knives, cars, trucks, water, poison, drugs, etc. do not kill people. PEOPLE kill people.
If guns were outlawed on the entire planet and no gun existed…would it be utopia?




top topics



 
88
<< 39  40  41    43  44  45 >>

log in

join