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The GOP tax plan will...raise taxes for the rich?

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posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 12:08 PM
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We need a flat tax.

If you are the poorest bastard in the nation and you make a dollar in a years time, you pay 15 cents.

If you are one of the more affluent that makes 40 billion dollars a year.... you pay 6 billion dollars.

Corporations are people, don't forget, so they pay the same 15%.

If the government can't get by on 15% of all the income.... they suck.




posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 12:13 PM
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originally posted by: intrepid
I read about this this morning. If you're talking about citizens then yes. Include the very rich, ie: corporations then no. They get the biggest break. It will also add 1.5 trillion to the debt over 10 years. And you know who ends up paying that. The middle class. Fancy magicians handwork.


I BELIEVE Republican president George Bush senior called it "voodoo economics".
edit on 3-11-2017 by DanteGaland because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 12:20 PM
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a reply to: matafuchs

If my understanding is correct then this doesn't increase or decrease the tax for high earners.

It just stops them benefiting from a cut to the bottom rate.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 12:30 PM
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a reply to: matafuchs

The amount taxed is irrelevant depending on the deductions and loop holes? Typically the super earners hire the people that wrote the taxes codes to begin with and they pay them to get them out of paying .

I much prefer a flat taxed system with no deductions that way it makes it easy to compare apples to apples.

I'm haven't read up on the changes to be honest so I'm not thrashing it just asking in case you already read up on it. What tax breaks are the middle class working stiff (employees) getting. Note not the business owners but rather regular employees with a salary anywhere between 30K-170K?



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 12:32 PM
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originally posted by: LesMisanthrope

originally posted by: intrepid
I read about this this morning. If you're talking about citizens then yes. Include the very rich, ie: corporations then no. They get the biggest break. It will also add 1.5 trillion to the debt over 10 years. And you know who ends up paying that. The middle class. Fancy magicians handwork.


American corporate taxes are some of the highest, if not the highest, on the entire planet.


The theoretical level of corporation tax for the US is very high. The effective rate after deductions is a good bit lower (although still high compared to many other developed countries).

Corporation tax is generally a stupid way to to tax as is complicated to administer, easy to avoid, rewards companies that game the system and is misleading about how much companies actually pay.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 12:46 PM
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a reply to: butcherguy

This is agree with. I explained it to my kids the other day about each dollar you earn.

I showed them a pay stub.

The first 20 cents goes to Federal Taxes.
The next 15 cents goes to Medical Premiums.
If you live in a state with State tax it is the next 3-5 cents.
401k contribution? 5 cents

Sucks to know you are only making half of what you actually earned.

Yes, a flat tax and cheaper healthcare would really really help.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 12:50 PM
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originally posted by: intrepid
...It will also add 1.5 trillion to the debt over 10 years. And you know who ends up paying that. The middle class...


Well there's an awfully easy fix for that. Cut 1.5 trillion in spending over the next 10 years. Aaaannndd...problem solved.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 01:25 PM
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Everyone should have to pay taxes. I don't care if you make $1.00 and have to give up a nickel. Every citizen needs some skin in the game on principle alone.

The tax code is convoluted because that is how politicians dole out favors to special interests. Anyone, whether left or right, that wants to weaken power of corrupt politicians should be for simplifying the tax code.

There is absolutely no reason our tax code is like 70,000 pages. It is absurd.

We should have a flat tax across the board. No deductions or credits of any kind. All income treated the same.

Individual rate should be like 10-20%. Corporate rates should not exceed 20%.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 01:46 PM
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originally posted by: Subsonic

originally posted by: intrepid
...It will also add 1.5 trillion to the debt over 10 years. And you know who ends up paying that. The middle class...


Well there's an awfully easy fix for that. Cut 1.5 trillion in spending over the next 10 years. Aaaannndd...problem solved.


Not really as every dollar of government spending results in some value of tax back.

If trying to reduce a deficit by reducing spending alone it would take a lot more than the initial 1.5 trillion.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 01:48 PM
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originally posted by: butcherguy
Corporations are people, don't forget, so they pay the same 15%.


That's the rub though, they really don't pay anything, it's a pass through charge the end user gets saddled with and becomes an extra tax.

In my perfect tax plan there would be zero corporate tax because I don't like hidden taxes.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 01:54 PM
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a reply to: DBCowboy

Even if it benefits everyone, they'll cry about how it benefits the rich. Who the hell cares as long as it benefits you? Liberals. . .



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 02:13 PM
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originally posted by: Subsonic

originally posted by: intrepid
...It will also add 1.5 trillion to the debt over 10 years. And you know who ends up paying that. The middle class...


Well there's an awfully easy fix for that. Cut 1.5 trillion in spending over the next 10 years. Aaaannndd...problem solved.


Yes because Washington has a great track record of cutting spending.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 02:18 PM
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originally posted by: AugustusMasonicus

originally posted by: butcherguy
Corporations are people, don't forget, so they pay the same 15%.


That's the rub though, they really don't pay anything, it's a pass through charge the end user gets saddled with and becomes an extra tax.

In my perfect tax plan there would be zero corporate tax because I don't like hidden taxes.

Everyone makes money off of someone else.
My doctor charges a certain amount for his services and some of that ends up being profit. He pays taxes on that. I pay part of his taxes.
The Mom and Pop sandwich shop down the street from my house is not a corporation, but they pay taxes on their profits.... some of it is my money.
If we go down that road where certain people or groups pay a different tax rate.... or none at all, that is where things begin to get stupid.
Loopholes. We need to make sure that there are none.
Churches.... tax them.
Charities.... tax them.
Non profits.... only tax the profits (meaning the CEOs of nonprofits that get part of their living tax free, like housing, clothing and travel).



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 03:58 PM
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a reply to: intrepid

They will soon....



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 04:22 PM
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a reply to: matafuchs

No they won't. The way the GOP spins this is that lower taxes = more spending = more jobs = more revenue.

Kansas is a good example of what happens when you lower taxes on corporations and the wealthy. You lose all your government funding. That's it.

You know what creates jobs and brings in crazy amounts of revenue? Giving poor people free money.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 05:16 PM
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originally posted by: links234
a reply to: matafuchs
...
You know what creates jobs and brings in crazy amounts of revenue? Giving poor people free money.




posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 05:21 PM
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Any tax plan developed either by the rich or the middle-class would focus on reaping benefits from that particular income level. To think Trump's tax plan won't benefit him or those like him is naïve. If anyone here had the power to develop a new tax plan, be honest, wouldn't you make sure your family directly benefited from it?

The majority of our legislatures are multi-millionaires. We'll never have a tax plan that will truly benefit the working class. The majority of our representative don't truly represent the majority of working-class Americans! It's exactly why hard working Americans don't have a voice in government.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 05:26 PM
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Bloomberg



Republicans, pushed along by President Donald Trump, have a new tax plan they're unveiling in Washington on Thursday. Among the various proposals in the plan is the elimination of the alternative minimum tax, or the AMT.

The AMT was rolled out almost 40 years ago to make sure that wealthy Americans couldn't take advantage of lots of deductions and credits that allowed them to end up paying next to nothing in federal income taxes. That cohort of wealthy Americans has always included taxpayers like the president.

In 2005, according to Trump's personal tax return for the year, the president paid $38 million in federal taxes on income of $150 million. The return, leaked to reporter David Cay Johnston and featured on Rachel Maddow's MSNBC news show in March, showed that $31 million of that $38 million in taxes that Trump had to pay was due to the AMT kicking in. He claimed $103 million in deductions on his return that year, and only paid $5.3 million in regular federal income taxes.



edit on 3-11-2017 by Connector because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 05:58 PM
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a reply to: Krakatoa

Economic growth more likely when wealth distributed to poor instead of rich


According to research from the Brookings Institution and the Reserve Bank of Australia, the marginal propensity to consume of high-income earners is substantially less than for low-income earners. In other words, poorer people are likely to spend the bulk of any extra income while the wealthy are more likely to save it.


Give Poor People Cash


At less cost to the government, cash programs led to the same health outcomes as food-based programs, but also provided additional resources for recipients to spend on schooling, medicine, and transport.


What Happens When You Just Give Money To Poor People?


"We don't see people spending money on alcohol and tobacco," he says. "Instead we see them investing in their kids' education, we see them investing in health care. They buy more and better food."


Definitive data on what poor people buy when they’re just given cash


Before receiving the cash, any spending on education or health might have seemed futile, but afterwards, parents might decide that a serious investment in their children’s school was sensible.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 06:10 PM
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a reply to: links234

You are joking right? Giving away money is what reduces debt? Look at the last 10 years. High taxes and more people than ever in history on assistance.

Take away the free money and they have to get jobs. Lower the tax rate on businesses and they can hire more. More money for R&D. The US at one time was the leader in technology and innovation. Now we are a nation of EBT cards, 300 dollars sneakers and 1000 phones while the middle class pays for it all and goes bankrupt. Not the rich.

It's Simple. It is not trickle down economics it is how it was for decades.



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