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The GOP tax plan will...raise taxes for the rich?

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posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 11:22 AM
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The MSM has been peddling the same old line that a new tax package will benefit the rich and tax the poor. Of course, if you actually read it, the taxes are going to help the middle class, not impact the poor and if there as a reduction of the business tax to 20% it will spur growth.

However, there is a clause that will move the top bracket of 39.6% to 45.6% for those who make over a million. It is a tax bubble that when hit will make them incur more tax.



Thanks to a quirky proposed surcharge, Americans who earn more than $1 million in taxable income would trigger an extra 6 percent tax on the next $200,000 they earn—a complicated change that effectively creates a new, unannounced tax bracket of 45.6 percent.


This would be the first change to the top bracket since the last time taxes were reformed in 1986.



Here’s how it would work: After the first $1 million in taxable income, the government would impose a 6 percent surcharge on every dollar earned, until it made up for the tax benefits that the rich receive from the low tax rate on that first $45,000. That surcharge remains until the government has clawed back the full $12,420, which would occur at about $1.2 million in taxable income. At that point, the surcharge disappears and the top tax rate drops back to 39.6 percent.

This type of tax is sometimes called a “bubble tax,” because the marginal tax rate effectively bubbles up for a brief period before falling back to a lower level. According to POLITICO’s calculation, the surcharge could raise more than $50 billion over a decade—money that will help the GOP meet the $1.5 trillion in deficit reduction and required to balance out tax cuts elsewhere. Balancing out those costs means that the bill can pass through budget reconciliation, and Senate Democrats can’t filibuster the bill. Whom would it affect? According to the Internal Revenue Service, 438,000 tax filers had more than $1 million in taxable income in 2015, most of whom also make more than $1.2 million—meaning they’d pay the full additional $12,420 in bubble tax. Altogether, that surcharge could have raised roughly $5 billion in 2015, the latest year in which numbers are available, meaning it could potentially bring in around $50 billion over the next decade. That’s not huge money in a plan that cuts taxes $1.5 trillion—but every bit counts.


This is similar to how the FICA taxes work where the rates change for high earners over 200k.

www.politico.com...

This is in stark contrast to the deal that the GOP House last year that wanted to 'lower' the top rate to 33%. Trump did not want this and it is now not only changed but it will increase.

So, how can anyone complain now? It will be interesting to see. This tax package clearly states the President is not there for the rich but for us.




posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 11:24 AM
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a reply to: matafuchs

Easy.

The democrats will lie and say that this tax plan will kill everyone and the world will explode.


They can't say that it'll be good for the economy, will let people keep more of their money.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 11:27 AM
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I read about this this morning. If you're talking about citizens then yes. Include the very rich, ie: corporations then no. They get the biggest break. It will also add 1.5 trillion to the debt over 10 years. And you know who ends up paying that. The middle class. Fancy magicians handwork.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 11:29 AM
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originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: matafuchs

Easy.

The democrats will lie and say that this tax plan will kill everyone and the world will explode.


They can't say that it'll be good for the economy, will let people keep more of their money.



Next up, "Just think of the children, they will starve if this tax plan is passed. If you support this plan, you support starving children."

SMH



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 11:30 AM
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originally posted by: matafuchs

So, how can anyone complain now? It will be interesting to see. This tax package clearly states the President is not there for the rich but for us.


You do realize that those rich people can afford to use tax shelters to hide that extra income...a tool that is not available to the middle class. The tax hike is only on "taxable income" which is easily hidden, disquised, invested into tax shelters and the like.

Best thing to do is a flat tax, with no deductions and no tax shelters...IMO. Everyone would pay their share and the tax code could be shrunk from over 75,000 pages to maybe 100 or less.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 11:31 AM
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a reply to: Krakatoa

If you support this tax plan, then the terrorists win.

Why do you support ISIS!!!!!!




posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 11:33 AM
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a reply to: matafuchs

Increasing taxes rich people have to pay will just force them to find tax shelters elsewhere, further driving down the economy. Rich people didn't get that way by being generous, they got rich by being greedy. They want to stay rich and will do anything to hide their wealth from the tax collector. No matter what they say, the poor will continue to pay more ,not the rich.

Quantitative Easing (inflation), Austerity (stealing your future), and shrinkflation (less product for same price) are all euphemisms designed to distract people from their shrinking value.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 11:40 AM
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Oh, I agree with a flat tax but in the current political climate it would never pass. I am also, for both posters, aware of tax shelters but that was not the point of the thread, and where as a good discussion, it was missed entirely my main point.

The rich will pay more and it is a different in what was proposed by the GOP house last year. This has not happened in over 30 years. All the left rhetoric of tax cuts for the rich is bogus. Again, something that cannot run on in 2018.

This would not have happened if ANY other candidate had won.




posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 11:41 AM
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a reply to: matafuchs



So, how can anyone complain now? It will be interesting to see. This tax package clearly states the President is not there for the rich but for us.


I'm not sure how a tax plan that triggers a 1% tax liability is proof of him being there "for us".



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 11:43 AM
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a reply to: DBCowboy What did I just read. Both of go to your rooms and NO tv. Go find Waldo




posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 11:45 AM
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a reply to: matafuchs

It's still an idiotic way to tax a citizenry...if you are successful, you are punished. The more successful that you are, the more you will be punished.

Our bracketed tax system and all of its loopholes and write-offs and rebates and everything else is a design obviously intended for clandestine activity.

We need something more simple.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 11:50 AM
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originally posted by: intrepid
I read about this this morning. If you're talking about citizens then yes. Include the very rich, ie: corporations then no. They get the biggest break. It will also add 1.5 trillion to the debt over 10 years. And you know who ends up paying that. The middle class. Fancy magicians handwork.


American corporate taxes are some of the highest, if not the highest, on the entire planet.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 11:52 AM
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originally posted by: LesMisanthrope

originally posted by: intrepid
I read about this this morning. If you're talking about citizens then yes. Include the very rich, ie: corporations then no. They get the biggest break. It will also add 1.5 trillion to the debt over 10 years. And you know who ends up paying that. The middle class. Fancy magicians handwork.


American corporate taxes are some of the highest, if not the highest, on the entire planet.


And those advocating increasing that wonder why companies are moving out of the country to get a better return on their corporate investments? That, in effect, results in layoffs, company closures, and more people on unemployment.

How is that a good strategy for the health of the country?



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 11:53 AM
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originally posted by: Krakatoa

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope

originally posted by: intrepid
I read about this this morning. If you're talking about citizens then yes. Include the very rich, ie: corporations then no. They get the biggest break. It will also add 1.5 trillion to the debt over 10 years. And you know who ends up paying that. The middle class. Fancy magicians handwork.


American corporate taxes are some of the highest, if not the highest, on the entire planet.


And those advocating increasing that wonder why companies are moving out of the country to get a better return on their corporate investments? That, in effect, results in layoffs, company closures, and more people on unemployment.

How is that a good strategy for the health of the country?



In short, it isn't.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 11:58 AM
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originally posted by: kelbtalfenek

originally posted by: matafuchs

So, how can anyone complain now? It will be interesting to see. This tax package clearly states the President is not there for the rich but for us.


You do realize that those rich people can afford to use tax shelters to hide that extra income...a tool that is not available to the middle class. The tax hike is only on "taxable income" which is easily hidden, disquised, invested into tax shelters and the like.

Best thing to do is a flat tax, with no deductions and no tax shelters...IMO. Everyone would pay their share and the tax code could be shrunk from over 75,000 pages to maybe 100 or less.


What tax shelters do the "rich" have that the middle class does not? Please be specific.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 12:04 PM
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That's interesting because the nonpartisan analysis from Joint Committee on Taxation, via Washington Post


3rd Nov, 2017 at 4:00 AM


At heart, the GOP plan cuts taxes on large businesses and pays for those reductions by raising taxes on individuals ..."


"The cut in corporate taxes will deplete the Treasury by nearly $847 billion over the next decade, according to the Joint Committee on Taxation. The elimination of the estate tax — which is paid only by the small portion of Americans with estates worth more than $5.49 million — and related measures will cost $172 billion. The reduced 25 percent rate for people who own unincorporated businesses will cost $448 billion."

"The GOP offsets some of those costs by raising taxes on individual earners who use tax breaks such as the mortgage interest deduction and the state and local tax deduction. The mortgage interest change, and other limits to tax breaks benefiting individual earners, would raise taxes more than $1.25 trillion over the next decade, according to the Joint Committee on Taxation."


wapo
edit on Sat Nov 4 2017 by DontTreadOnMe because: ADDED EX TAGS and SOURCE IMPORTANT: Using Content From Other Websites on ATS



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 12:05 PM
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a reply to: LesMisanthrope




with a boat load of loopholes. lol

my family is going to profit nicely off this new tax plan.. getting rid of the estate tax - yippee! my retirement, which is already hefty, will get a nice little bump.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 12:05 PM
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Rich Democrats will hate that 45.6% rate.




posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 12:07 PM
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originally posted by: intrepid
I read about this this morning. If you're talking about citizens then yes. Include the very rich, ie: corporations then no. They get the biggest break. It will also add 1.5 trillion to the debt over 10 years. And you know who ends up paying that. The middle class. Fancy magicians handwork.


if you keep using facts you will upset many here, should have a trigger warning.



posted on Nov, 3 2017 @ 12:08 PM
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maybe now trumpster will bring his companies here.. doubt it. ya'll won't hold him to that promise either most likely.




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