Hiker Commits Murder-Suicide Rather Than Be Killed By The Elements.

originally posted by: carewemust

originally posted by: CharlesT
The title says it all, Murder-Suicide......

But rescuers eventually found them by following their trail of candy wrappers, and water bottles. Doesn't sound like they went to the Park for that reason...but you never know.

That is another reason why I think this was an intentional act carried out by the hiker/s.

If they were leaving enough garbage behind to be tracked, then they themselves should've been able to Hansel and Gretel their way back to safety.

Of course this is all speculation on my part, but I think at least one of them was not planning a return trip upon departure...

a reply to: norhoc

When shtf, think of how many people will die when their devices got shut down.

As for the hikers it's really tragic but then again we have been far too disconnected with nature.

a reply to: Elostone

I appreciate that additional information about the Joshua Tree National Park. I've been to several, but none that didn't have green trees and creeks running through them.


Here's an update with additional information...
time.com...

All signs point to the couple simply choosing to end their own life, due to being in such misery. Gosh..

a reply to: carewemust

If they were in excruciating pain and lost any glimmer of hope of being found, I could understand why they would take their own lives. I compare it to someone who is dying of cancer or any other extremely painful sickness. Why should someone endure such pain when they know the final outcome is death? I had to watch two of my sister-in-laws die of cancer. They were in extreme pain and were both bed ridden for months until death gave them peace. When our pets are in extreme pain and dying, we think of nothing but putting them out of their pain and misery. We really treat animals far better than we do humans when they're at the end of their life.

Many people think euthanasia is a bad thing. I can bet my last dollar if these same people switched places with those who were experiencing excruciating pain and being bedridden needing 24 hour care, they would quickly have a different perspective. It's really a selfish perspective for the living. Our sadness of losing a loved one and keeping them alive at any cost is more important than ending the dying person's excruciating pain and having them die with dignity.

originally posted by: carewemust
Have any of you ever been so miserable and close to death, that you felt like stopping the suffering by committing suicide? I find it hard to imagine losing hope to the point where you'd kill your mate/friend, and then yourself.

-CareWeMust

You must not be married.

What if one of them had tripped and broken a leg. They wouldn't be able to move anywhere, and wouldn't survive if they stayed where they were. How much ammunition did they have with them. Just a few rounds wouldn't be enough to fight off a hungry critter.

a reply to: seaswine
The link below is to the safety page of the visitors guide. Carry 2 gallons of water per person per day is recommended. No water is available in the backcountry. The summer temperatures is 120 during the day and drops to 40 at night. Expect no cell service. Carry an advanced first aide kit.


www.nps.gov...

Well I would not go to a desert in the summer, but if I was in that situation, no I do not think I could pull the trigger, unless I was facing being eaten alive that MIGHT make me do it.

If they were found locked in an embrace.

How is it possible for them to shoot themselves?

Sounds like someone murdered them.

a reply to: seaswine


We don't really know what happened. Frankly, I would expect some evidence of a note or some sign that they were in a desperate situation and took their own lives. Or, maybe he just took here way out there in the wild to kill her. That part doesn't seem too logical though does it?

Whatever, you make the trials of life and death so simple: "One, ...Two, ...Three...."
Life and death are not done that way by logical choices by desperate people.

originally posted by: Nexttimemaybe
If they were found locked in an embrace.

How is it possible for them to shoot themselves?

Sounds like someone murdered them.

Not at all..he is hugging her , pulls the trigger then kills himself..

Not hard at all to figure out the logistics of that..

I strongly doubt this was a case of exposure leading to suicide. Very very few recorded cases of such events in the US.

I'm pretty confident there was more to it than this.

originally posted by: seaswine
Yeah that doesn't make sense.

First off it's a national park, not some random wooded area that is uncharted. Even if they went off trail and got lost, just pick a direction, downhill preferably, and walk. You'll hit a marked trail.

Second: they went missing during the summer. Basic survival skills like foraging and trapping/catching small critters could've sustained them.

Third: he had a gun!? That makes the whole survivng off the land thing easier. Also, with that gun he could've signaled for help using the universal "3 shots as fast as possible around dusk hours" that any park ranger and most hikers would recognize.

Yes, they could've been out of water... he may have had very limited ammo...

But IT RAINS and don't ever give up. Ever.

I think you have a skewed idea of how easy it is to survive when you have little to no survival training.

I don't care what kind of preparations they made, or whether they had a gun or not, surviving in the desert is not for the faint of heart.

They got lost and chose to end it rather than suffer a horrible death from dehydration and exposure. I don't know why this surprises anyone.

originally posted by: carewemust

originally posted by: cancerslug
a reply to: seaswine
were they were located there is no water source. also for the most part flat. you can get lost out there. mountain lions are very rare out there and bobcats wont want to mess with you. bringing a gun to that park is very strange. rattlesnakes and tweekers are about the only dangerous things out there.

Thankyou for that information about the Joshua Tree National Park. Apparently the "will to live" wasn't as strong as what we've seen in others who have been rescued, after weeks of being lost.

The others you spoke about probably had water. The article I read said they had ran out of all water and were suffering from exposure.

I don't think the 'will to live ' was any less in these unfortunate people. They were suffering unimaginably and simply decided to end it. Calling this a murder is very sad. They were boyfriend/ girlfriend, and he most likely loved her. Probably the hardest thing he ever did in his life. And perhaps the most noble.

originally posted by: Nexttimemaybe
If they were found locked in an embrace.

How is it possible for them to shoot themselves?

Sounds like someone murdered them.

Where the hell you get that from?

The poor guy shot her, wrapped his arm around her for one last embrace, then shot himself. Such a sad story.

originally posted by: Flyingclaydisk
I strongly doubt this was a case of exposure leading to suicide. Very very few recorded cases of such events in the US.

I'm pretty confident there was more to it than this.

You get lost In the desert with no water and be close to death and tell me if a bullet to your head doesn't sound tempting.

First as it has been mentioned it was a National Park

2nd it was a National Park

3rd it was a National Park....now that I got that out of the way Outside Magazine why 1,600 people went missing without a trace in our National Parks



Missing 411

When you look at how the media is portraying how desperate they were and how no foul play was found...it is to cover what really happened to this couple.

originally posted by: abeverage
First as it has been mentioned it was a National Park

2nd it was a National Park

3rd it was a National Park....now that I got that out of the way Outside Magazine why 1,600 people went missing without a trace in our National Parks



Missing 411

When you look at how the media is portraying how desperate they were and how no foul play was found...it is to cover what really happened to this couple.

1st The park is massive.

2nd There is no cell service.

3rd They ran out of water.

4th It's a desert.

5th They got lost.

6th IT'S A DESERT!

Does everything have to be a conspiracy? Do yourself a favor and Google how long it takes someone to die of exposure in the desert when they have no water. Hint? Its not even days.

originally posted by: carewemust

originally posted by: CharlesT
The title says it all, Murder-Suicide......

But rescuers eventually found them by following their trail of candy wrappers, and water bottles. Doesn't sound like they went to the Park for that reason...but you never know.

Who said it was premeditated? It could have been a reaction to uncontrollable frustration that set him over the edge of coping with the situation with rationality.

originally posted by: abeverage
First as it has been mentioned it was a National Park

2nd it was a National Park

3rd it was a National Park....now that I got that out of the way Outside Magazine why 1,600 people went missing without a trace in our National Parks



Missing 411

When you look at how the media is portraying how desperate they were and how no foul play was found...it is to cover what really happened to this couple.

Yellowstone is the nations first and I would argue best National Park.I guarantee you thst within 15 mins of walking in the back country you would be lost and without the proper supplies it could get dangerous and hopeless very fast.

So I'm not sure why you think it being a National Park somehow means it's unlikely that two people got lost in one..