Vegas: Multiple Survivors/Eyewitness Tell of Multiple Shooters at Multiple Casinos

a reply to: djz3ro

One thing I haven't seen mentioned often, if at all is that you have to take into consideration, this was the end of a festival, people were drunk, high, coked up and all sorts, having worked a few festivals, let me tell you, people don't always know where they are. Though evidence should tell where people were hit...

Excellent point -- thank you!

I think alcohol may explain the delayed response at the initial gunfire. Although I also believe once the adrenaline kicked in, any buzz was killed as the people quickly went into "flight" mode.

originally posted by: Boadicea
a reply to: djz3ro

One thing I haven't seen mentioned often, if at all is that you have to take into consideration, this was the end of a festival, people were drunk, high, coked up and all sorts, having worked a few festivals, let me tell you, people don't always know where they are. Though evidence should tell where people were hit...

Excellent point -- thank you!

I think alcohol may explain the delayed response at the initial gunfire. Although I also believe once the adrenaline kicked in, any buzz was killed as the people quickly went into "flight" mode.

Many of the spectators dident even think it was gunfire. They thought it was firecrackers. The main reason i think it is because subsonic rounds were used.

a reply to: spy66

Many of the spectators dident even think it was gunfire. They thought it was firecrackers. The main reason i think it is because subsonic rounds were used.

I don't know enough about guns and gunfire to know, so I'll take your word for it!

What I do know is that I have read many statements that describe hearing fireworks, and even one in which the survivor stated it was so close it blew his eardrums. But I have not seen even one statement of the person actually seeing the fireworks.

originally posted by: Boadicea
a reply to: spy66

Many of the spectators dident even think it was gunfire. They thought it was firecrackers. The main reason i think it is because subsonic rounds were used.

I don't know enough about guns and gunfire to know, so I'll take your word for it!

What I do know is that I have read many statements that describe hearing fireworks, and even one in which the survivor stated it was so close it blew his eardrums. But I have not seen even one statement of the person actually seeing the fireworks.

Well i dont know if you should take my Word for it. I am just trying to pice this together just like everyone else. But from personal experiance i think SuperSonic rounds would have caused a lot more damage to the surroundings. It would also have been a lot easier for the spectators to locate where the shooting was comming from if SuperSonic rounds were used.

We should also have been able to spot a lot more debries from high Powered rounds among the spectators. I have only found one projectile that hits the ground among the spectators.

a reply to: spy66

Well i dont know if you should take my Word for it. I am just trying to pice this together just like everyone else.

Good advice and fair enough!

Rather, now, I shall keep that in mind

originally posted by: ipsedixit
a reply to: Boadicea

They also cut the moment from the police body cam footage that showed a bullet coming through the mesh of a fence from a different direction from that of the Mandalay Bay Hotel. At 0:05 of the following video. Has this been brought to the attention of Special Agent Clouseau, yet?

I watched this video several times, and on first review it does appear to be a round passing through the fabric barrier from left to right, opposite of Mandalay. Upon further review, I believe it is a person standing on the other side of that fence who flinches with the shot report and bumps a shoulder or elbow against it. in the few seconds following the shot, you can see some more subtle movements of bodies against the back side of that fabric.

edit on 23-10-2017 by perma because: missing video link

Can anyone give me an idea of how far the sounds of the gunfire at the Mandalay Bay would have traveled? Or I guess a better way to say it is how loud would gunfire from the Mandalay Bay be at Hooters, which is about 3/4 of a mile as the crow flies? Both outside and particularly to someone inside the casino (so ground floor, not upper floors).

And how would it be affected by a building (the Tropicana I think) in between the two points? But not totally. From what I can tell looking at a map, as the crow flies from the gunman's room at Mandalay Bay, there is a clear view to the south end of Hooters, but the Tropicana would block the view to the north end of Hooters.

I ask because I have read a few accounts of people in Hooters who say they could hear "the" gunfire and attribute the panic there to the gunfire at Mandalay Bay/Route 91. Would it be loud enough that people would think it was right there at Hooters? Even to folks who had fled there from Route 91 where presumably the sound would have been much louder and clearer?

a reply to: Boadicea


First of Paddocks would have had to have aimed quite high to hit Hooters. That means he would have had intend to hit Hooters for some reason??


Depending on the ammo he used (supersonick or subsonic) would determin what would be heard when it comes to actuall projectiles passing by or hitting.


Personally i think Hooter was used as a staging Place for what ever help was needed at the fairgrounds.....

No first aid will just barge in at the seen that is not secured.

a reply to: spy66

I was thinking in terms of how shots fired into the Route 91 venue would sound at Hooters. But the thought that he might have shot towards Hooters is intriguing, although I think it's more likely he would have shot towards the Tropicana with stray shots going beyond the Tropicana to the Hooters.

And I keep forgetting about subsonic vs supersonic. Could either be loud enough to sound as if it was in close proximity as opposed to 3/4 miles away? And would it depend on exactly where/which direction he was firing?

Edited to respond to your edit:

Personally i think Hooter was used as a staging Place for what ever help was needed at the fairgrounds.....

At this point, I have to think it was both. There was definitely a panic and a mad rush at Hooters. That's described in several accounts/articles. If it was simply an initial panic caused by the Mandalay Bay gunfire, then I'd expect any threat would have been quickly ruled out and the staging/triage would have begun. What I'm not sure of is if there was a second panic, or if a gunman was found and killed -- which I guess would also secure the area for staging/triage.

a reply to: Boadicea



I have not looked at the map when it comes to this situation you speak of.

But there is a posebillity that 223 rounds from the shooters at the fair grounds could have reached Hooters??

originally posted by: spy66
a reply to: Boadicea


First of Paddocks would have had to have aimed quite high to hit Hooters. That means he would have had intend to hit Hooters for some reason??


Depending on the ammo he used (supersonick or subsonic) would determin what would be heard when it comes to actuall projectiles passing by or hitting.


Personally i think Hooter was used as a staging Place for what ever help was needed at the fairgrounds.....

No first aid will just barge in at the seen that is not secured.

Hooters was a triage area, as was the major one in front of the Excalibur and a place where people ran to during the shooting...

originally posted by: Boadicea
I found a new survivor statement last night -- well, new to me! -- from Rick Ardito who was at the concert with his wife and friends. There is both a written statement and an interview podcast at the link, but I've only read the statement. I have not listened to the podcast. A couple things jumped out at me from the written statement:

We had considered sheltering in Hooters, then all of the sudden there was a massive panic and stampede of people trying to get away from Hooters. We started running again as fast as we could, unsure exactly what the panic was about.

This happened immediately after running from the shooting at the venue. So the (first?) panic at Hooters happened almost simultaneously with the gunfire at the venue -- or at the very least immediately after. But if the Route 91 gunfire lasted 10 minutes as reported, then it must have been simultaneous, because there's no way it would take more than 10 minutes to run from the venue to Hooters.

And then this:

We heard talk of multiple shooters in multiple locations. This was the point that I remembered how unreliable early information is in these situations. We didn’t know what was true that we were hearing, and what wasn’t....

As we approached McCaren airport we heard rumors that one of the shooters had stolen a Police vehicle during the Chaos.

I do note that he called the information about multiple shooters and a gunman stealing a police vehicle "rumors," and rightfully so because unless he had seen it with his own eyes, that's pretty much all it was. But it's noteworthy.

And it does cast some doubt on the police audio, as someone with nefarious intentions now had access to police communications, and the ability to taint those communications with false information.

This is in reply to your later post about people hearing firecrackers but not any reports of someone SEEING them. The quote above- this guy- I actually listened to his interview on Rense, and he reports seeing those firecrackers. He heard them and saw them, he says in the interview. I believe the guy quoted above is the same guy whose interview I heard today, and he alsaw the firecrackers.

a reply to: KansasGirl

Thank you!

From his written statement:

The first pops were a string of fire crackers. One of the distinct differences about these pops versus the gunfire that followed is that the sound came from directly on the ground at the venue, and not far from us. Maybe 40 feet. There are additional details I have remembered that I may add in the future. I know this doesn't agree with the media reporting, but I am 100% convinced the shooter was aided and signaled from inside the venue with these firecrackers.

If he's correct, then it would seem the firecrackers were a signal to someone(s) in an elevated position, wouldn't it? And I wonder if they would even be visible from the Mandalay Bay position; so perhaps the firecrackers were meant for someone closer as well, or instead of, Mandalay Bay gunman. I'm not sure it would be effective for anyone on the ground as they couldn't be sure anyone else would see/hear them across the venue... and if they were standing next to each other, there wouldn't be a need for such a signal. Or am I missing something?

I'm going to try to listen to the podcast interview at the site I linked and see what he says.

I don't know if anything new can be obtained from this video, but it gives a good view of the concert area below from the 63rd floor of the Mandalay Bay Hotel.

Jason Hartman's eyewitness account of the shooting in Las Vegas as seen from the Foundation Room within the Mandalay Bay Hotel. The Foundation room is a member only club and is on the 63rd floor of Mandalay Bay.

An explanation for the 63rd floor is given under the video: youtu.be...

a reply to: sled735

Actually, the shots sound further away.

The sirens sounded much much closer.

Cam anyone confirm how soon after the shooting started that triages were set up? Just thinking out loud here.

originally posted by: denybedoomed
Cam anyone confirm how soon after the shooting started that triages were set up? Just thinking out loud here.

As near as I can tell, within minutes. Starting with these guys:

Fire engineer Brian Emery was driving his station's engine back from a call for a minor car crash when hundreds of hysterical people began swarming the vehicle near an outdoor country music festival in Las Vegas.

"Then, suddenly, we heard automatic gunfire," Emery recalled Thursday after his crew became the first to respond to the deadliest shooting in modern American history.

First Responders to Las Vegas Shooting Were There by Chance
Like everything else, the article is vague as vague can be. But it seems that they were driving south on Las Vegas Blvd, returning to the station which is also on Las Vegas Blvd, south of the Mandalay Bay. After being swarmed, they pulled into a nearby parking area, and began to set up a triage staging area. Presuming they were in fact traveling south on LV Blvd, they would probably pull to their right or the west side of the road. I'm think it was probably the triage set up at Excalibur that our own abeverage spoke of in his thread.

And several articles are linked and quoted here which refer to another triage staging area quickly set up outside Hooters, right next door to the Tropicana.

And there's a video from a guy staying at Hooters who came outside just as the first wave of concert-goers are arriving. The camera is facing west from the north-facing front of Hooters, which is the direction people are coming from, with the Tropicana visible in the background, and he points out that the triage will later be set up there... of course he doesn't stick around for it, because about 1m30s in, something causes a panic and he starts running east with the rest of the crowd.

Okay, this is crazy stuff here. Don your tinfoil hat nice and tight!

I found the following in the comments of a video regarding Hooters. The video isn't important. The comment is.

Dude, did anyone else notice [that] about the time the hockey game let out (last preseason game; I was there that night and parked at Hooters), there was a steady increase of all blacked out truck[s]. Not SUVs, but off-road mid-size pickups with off road tires, mufflers, lights, etc. And at first I noticed one, and then another about ten minutes apart. But then it went to about six minutes apart, and my buddy John and I were in the parking garage smoking catching a fade, and swear to God when they got to about two minutes apart, going up the Hooter garage, driving to the top -- or at least above level 2 where I was parked, catching a fade. And they got so many so close together I said, "Dude, that's the police or something. Some kind of government. We're out of here, dude. Let's roll." And so we dipped. I started noticing them after about the 5th or 6th truck going up the ramp, and I was, like, "Look, dude, there's another one. Yo, look, Bro, another one." Point being they started catching my attention. They were coming so frequent. Like they were up to something. I couldn't really say whether peeping and scrolling or setting up shop. But they were def[initely] up to something for hours before the shooting. I dipped when it got to be too many, and I got home 35 minutes later. And 10-15 minutes later I was getting calls making sure I left from down there after the game.

Please don't ask me to explain his slang!!! And FYI the comment was very poorly written and in all caps, and since I had to re-type it anyway to get rid of the all caps, I cleaned it up to make it easier to read and (hopefully) comprehend. However, if you prefer, you can read the full comment here. It is the third reply to a comment by Ronson jn sjn California --

i was at hooters # was crazy ..........

a reply to: Boadicea

Funny because I just posted something on another thread about the 17 ambulances allegedly pulling bodies out of hooters and that individual is talking about being at Hooters when the sketchy beefed up black vehicles were pulling up every 6 minutes - check it out:

(video)

Thread: www.abovetopsecret.com...

Laura Loomer uploaded a video to Twitter tonight that supposedly shows a body on the floor of the Msndalay Bay casino that night. From one of her "inside sources." For the record I do think she does clearly have contact with someone who works there.

The video clip is clearly from a phone and looks like it's being hastily taken, but it does show a white sheet covering something on the casino (or lobby) floor, and shows several cops strolling through, guns drawn.

I can't embed and tried linking but it didn't work. It's under Laura Loomer from tonight's twitter. Hopefully someone here can link it.