Greetings again Ryan,
A quick thanks to RANT for unlocking this, a series of oversights anfd misunderstandings have been sorted out :-)
A special thank you to Bob Dylan for coming out of "retirement" and saying his piece. I appreciate your comments and am encouraged to continue
debating - I always liked Bob Dylan, he was a gadfly who said it like it was :-)
Iasion, i would like to continue this conversation with you about James, but first i must know are you saying that in the Letter of James in
the Bible it doesn't mention Jesus' name once? If you honestly are contesting that i am going to tell you to go back and re-read that 5 page, which
includes front and backs of a page, book then reevaluate what you just said. However, if you mean something entirely different just tell me.
that's exactly the opposite of what I said !
I made it quite clear, let me quote my earlier post to remind you :
James says NOTHING about Jesus, what-so-ever !
It only mentions the name "Jesus Christ" twice, without giving any details about him at all (just the typical CHristian refrence to faith in Christ
I clearly stated that James mentions the name "Jesus Christ" twice,
never mentioned anything ABOUT Jesus.
Yet you charge me with saying the opposite?
May I suggest you read more carefully?
This all came about because you claimed that Jesus' brother James "wrote about Jesus".
But as I have pointed out numerous times -
James did NOT write ANYTHING "about Jesus".
Perhaps the reason you again fail to cite anything "about Jesus" from the epistle of James is because you actually HAVE read the epistle and were
shocked to find nothing about Jesus in it at all, and now try to brush the issue away, hoping few readers will check the document for themselves.
I HAVE read the epistle of James - here are the 2 mentions of the word "Jesus" :
1:1 James, a servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, to the twelve tribes
which are in the Dispersion: Greetings.
The introduction of the letter, mentions he is a "servant" of God and of Lord Jesus Christ (ie. a typical faithful phrase invoking their highest
names) - totally FAILS to mention he is brother to Jesus.
2:1 My brothers, don't hold the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ of glory with
Another faithful phrase telling us nothing about Jesus. No mention James is his brother.
What DON'T we see in James
NO mention of Jesus' family at all - NO Mary or Joseph or siblings.
NO mention of the birth stories - NO Bethlehem, Nazareth, Magi, Herod, the flight...
NO mention of teachings Jesus - NO sermon, Lord's prayer, food regulations
NO mention of miracles - NO Lazarus, feeding the multitude, healing the sick...
NO mention of any Gospel event - NO Teaching at the Temple, Temple Cleansing, Triumphal Entry, Temptation, Baptism in Jordan etc, etc...
NO mention of the trial of Jesus - NO Pilate, Sanhedrin, Judas etc...
NO mention of the empty tomb, the crucifixion, the resurrection !!! hello?
I can not find a SINGLE PIECE of information "about Jesus" in the whole epistle of James.
From a person who was supposedly in Jesus' very family and probably would have experienced many of these events if they had really happened.
Even when expected
Even worse, if you do read James, there are many places where you would expect him to mention Jesus or his teaching -
Chapter 1 talks about resisting temptation - NO mention of the temptation of Jesus !
Chapter 2 starts like this in some versions - "do you .. really believe in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ?" (a different translation of the phrase
which in the Greek goes something like this: "do not with partiality believe in Jesus Christ the glorious").
Here is James trying to convince them to believe in Jesus Christ, and he totally fails to even mention he knew Jesus, let alone was his brother -
instead all he gives to try and prove Jesus is some preaching about the poor and the rich WITHOUT mentioning anything Jesus said about the poor.
James quotes "Love Thy Neighbour as Thyself" - but NOT from Jesus, just "scripture".
James preaches about adultery - NO mention of Jesus' teachings.
James argues that faith without works is useless - when he provides examples, it's from the OT - Abraham, Rahab - NO mention of Jesus.
James reminds people not to curse or speak evil - NO mention of Jesus' teachings on that.
James preaches about suffering and patience - NO mention of Jesus as example, just Job and the prophets.
James talks about the church elders bringing healing and forgiving sins - NO mention of Jesus doing that.
James even invokes Elijah who was a "human being like us" - NO mention of Jesus !
James never knew any Jesus
In dozens of places, James preaches something that CRIES out for a mention of Jesus or his teachings - but it looks like James has never even HEARD of
Jesus of Nazareth - just the risen Christ, a spiritual being.
Note that James uses the phrase "my brothers (and sisters)" DOZENS of times - NOT the slightest hint that HE is the brother of Jesus anywhere in the
Apologists like Ryan seem unable to read the letter for comprehension, no matter how many times I ask Ryan to provide actual evidence, all he does is
preach his beliefs. His failure to produce any evidence should make it clear.
There simply is NOTHING "about Jesus" in the letter of James.
Which supports the theory that there was no historical Jesus - along with the silence of all the other 1st century writers (no Christian writer shows
ANY knowledge of Jesus of Nazareth until early-mid 2nd century, a century and two wars after the alleged events.)
Of course, its not even sure if James existed himself, the evidence is a bit shaky for him too (like Peter and the 12 who may not have been real