Govt Spook Caught Face2Face Invading Privacy Last Night 4am by Muzzleflash

a reply to: humanoidlord

I posted that because they kept saying I was on drugs. It's evidence I'm not on drugs. It actually supports credibility to be clean and sober.

It's not a hoax at all so I think I'll be ok. All actual evidence that can possibly exist must support my claim because it's impossible that anything could contradict the truth.

I realize that things can be misinterpreted but really the only actual issue here is that very few people on ATS have any decent detective skills at all and will come in "knowing the outcome" then proceed to twist everything to support their preconceived notions.

That's par for the course with most of the population though so all I gotta do is persevere and, for my purposes, wait to see if anyone can (finally) ID this SUV for me so I can figure out what all of this is actually about.

a reply to: muzzleflash

Well I didn't jump to and invest myself 100% into any one specific conclusion.

Clearly you have because you haven't budged an inch from "the government is spying on me" as your conclusion.

Suggesting I'm lying is not an acceptable answer for me.

And yet it's still a possible answer, and whether you like it as an answer or not is as just as irrelevant as whether I like it as an answer or not.

but I'm not you

Thankfully.

didn't post this for you to explain this for your satisfaction.

I didn't say, nor imply, that you did. Hell, I didn't even suggest that you're lying. I simply stated that it's a possible explanation. Because it is.

I posted it looking for information so I could figure it out, and as a side benefit inform others of the strange things going on in America that they normally won't notice.

Cool.

originally posted by: thesaneone
a reply to: muzzleflash

I never said an agent followed me.

Are you kidding us? Your title says just that.

No it doesn't say that.

It says Caught Invading Privacy.

How does that = Following?

I was stationary.
Please explain how one follows a stationary object.

If English isn't your first language I'll let this slide but otherwise you really need to improve your vocabulary.

a reply to: Shamrock6

Me lying is not a possible answer. It doesn't matter how much you entertain such an impossibility it'll never make it real.

I certainly have entertained the proposal that it might have been a corporate PI, though I really doubt that because of the circumstances and the equipment.

I asked the question and stated it was the most likely feasible solution that it was the government spying, so there's nothing to budge from. It was just a statistical calculation based on all things considered.

I'm open minded to reason. Very few posters in this thread are reasonable about any of this.

Look no one's forcing anyone to participate.

a reply to: muzzleflash

You denying that you've made it all up doesn't make either your denial or your story true. Declaring that as the end of the discussion only works for yourself, because "I said so" isn't a statement that makes your story true. It doesn't matter how much you declare your story true, it doesn't make it any more true than it already was for anybody else.

You're right, no one is being forced to participate. But this isn't The Echo Chamber Forum. People are allowed to post all sorts of unsubstantiated things in The Gray Area. And people are allowed to express their skepticism over those posts. If a person is going to take that skepticism at such an intensely personal level as sometimes happens, that's nobody's fault but their own.

originally posted by: Indigent
a reply to: whyamIhere

I was pretty sure everyone knew, but old timers with millions of stars are the result of a bug that happened after some version of ats. For a while if they got a star in an old thread they would get the truckloads of stars, this was fixed and now none can get the stars like that,but the star count was never corrected.

Not that it matters, just saying that don't follow star counts as a valid metric

I was joking...

Common sense should of told people that.

Nobody has that many stars.

What about the Google mapping cars

a reply to: Shamrock6

The only thing that makes my claim true is that it actually happened in reality and I just happened to relate those actual events.

You and I don't make truth - reality, the universe itself, makes the truth.

Whether we as individuals adhere to that reality or can even recognize it at all is what determines our qualities as persons and our positions in that reality.

a reply to: Shamrock6

Answer me this:

How is telling me to "take my meds" a form of skepticism?

Isn't it a personal attack? Doesn't this website at least claim that we shouldn't do that?

How many times was I personally attacked in this thread?

Skepticism is one thing while insulting someone is something else entirely....

a reply to: muzzleflash

If yall want I could go take some photos of this location in a few hours.

Still waiting.

a reply to: muzzleflash

You said it all with that last sentence......Why bother posting if all you post is garbage and nonsense? Were you looking in a mirror when you wrote that? You a long time member and should know when you post such imaginary dribble that WE ALL ARE GONNA CALL YOU OUT ON IT. You need to go back and read what you've wrote...then we'll talk about reading comprehension. Oh' almost forgot. If it takes you a minute to close an app and open your camera......you need a new phone. Aint no damn government spooks spying on you in the middle of the night. I mean come the hell on, don't you think you've drug this out for enough stars & flags.

a reply to: muzzleflash

no problem i know it isnt an hoax

I realize that things can be misinterpreted but really the only actual issue here is that very few people on ATS have any decent detective skills at all and will come in "knowing the outcome" then proceed to twist everything to support their preconceived notions.

Well.. to be fair, being abducted by aliens followed a week or so later by being spied on by government "spooks" is.. unlikely, would you not agree? You can't blame folks for being skeptical. : )

originally posted by: muzzleflash
a reply to: AtomicKangaroo

I didn't see the plates at all because I only saw the starboard side of his vehicle primarily. By the time I could see the stern side he was already moving pretty quickly and was a good distance away.

Plus I was also naturally looking at the top of his vehicle more than anything else because my brain was like "huh, what's that stuff?".

All of these suggestions are "easier said than done" and don't really take into account the novelty of various situations and the natural mindsets and reactions of people.

For example I can go back and point out all of Germany's military errors in WW2 and say "they shoulda done this and that". That's because hindsight is 20/20 but foresight is not so excellent.

Yep understandable, this is why I suggested being prepped for it now you have had two experiences so recently and close together.
You feel there is something weird going on, so you should be expecting it.

So yes it is like WW2, but in the way that the Nazi's have bombed your installations twice, so you'd take actions to be prepared for the more than likely 3rd and 4th raids.

Not trying to dismiss your experiences in any way. But without proof we must be skeptical.
If I took everything on peoples say so alone I'd believe in Unicorns, be paranoid a flying spaghetti monsters is watching everything I do and that Elvis was a martian who just went home after he got tired of living on a flat earth.

Sorry, I 'want to believe' as they say. But with millions of stories like these, it just amazes me not a single person in history, especially in this day and age of HD cameras on nearly every device that still no one has managed in all this time to document anything in any way that validates their claim. Well document in a way that is indisputable. Especially those who have constant or multiple experiences.

originally posted by: humanoidlord
a reply to: muzzleflash

no problem i know it isnt an hoax

No offence, but can you please share with the rest of us how you know it is not a hoax.

Is it not a hoax in that they really experienced these things, or not a hoax in that they believes they are experiencing these things?

No one here can say these things really happened to Muzzle without proof. It would be nice to just be able to believe people, but we all know it's not that straight forward when dealing with humans.

a reply to: starwarsisreal

I think he knew that someone was going to bring that up. Quite a plot you have going here. A story that spans from thread to thread, yet ties into each other. Nice.

originally posted by: muzzleflash

You could list a few 'innocent things' that it could have been, to at least give an idea.
Otherwise I could turn that around and say "there's a billion reasons it was definitely the MIB, too many for me to bother listing even one." That sure will convince everyone won't it?

And I'm not paranoid. I generally go through my days without worrying about much at all, except maybe basic stuff like what to eat tonight (eg - chicken or a salad?). Anytime I have something I need to deal with I think it over and decide on a course of action.

I almost never feel like anyone is after me or watching me or anything weird like that.
I usually feel really alone and isolated and ignored.
That's kinda the opposite of paranoia now isn't it?

It is more about the context of the paranoid line than actually saying you're paranoid.
You had a very vivid experience with the Marvel Hero's event. Being so vivid and that you believe you experienced it would honestly put anyone on edge.

You see a guy in a van you find to be of a strange design, in a remote location which you also find strange after you you believe you were abducted.
If you had not had the 'abduction' experience, would you still make the same connections that it's 'the man' spying on you?
Also we can be paranoid without realizing it, or acknowledging it. Even the most sturdy, stable and logical among us.

As for innocent explanations? ok here goes:

Could of misidentified perfectly normal equipment on the vehicle. Just because you do not recognize it doesn't make it anything nefarious.
Seen some of the vehicles storm chasers use?

Example of a 'Storm Chaser' vehicle.

Now it looks nothing like a vehicle most people would be familiar with. Nothing out of the ordinary about it though.
It's loaded with equipment for a specific, rational task.
But the average person who saw such a thing and did not know its purpose would probably think "WTF?" and start thinking what it could be. "I think I just saw a black ops military vehicle".
It's the type of conclusion any one could make. They would be incorrect, but they would certainly tell friends and family about this weird # they saw and experienced but could not correctly explain, now imagine that same person had just recently had a rather vivid experience. That would no doubt influence their perception of said vehicle.

I own a 3DR Solo quad copter. I cannot fly it in the suburbs as doing so is illegal. (Not to fly over other people property, roads or people themselves that kind of thing.) Plus footage and photos of the suburbs is boring.
So I drive to extremely isolated and photogenic location to fly.

These are the types of areas that you'd think the chances would be a billion to one of running into someone.
Yet I often encounter people at these places. say like you, 3-4 times in a year.
(Which lets admit is not really that rare, 4-5 people in a decade though? That would be. But that's a matter of perception)

My drone just seems to be a magnet of fascination those unfamiliar with them. Be just about to fly and suddenly a hiker will appear, or an elderly couple on their retirement nationwide tour.

Reactions from them vary from complete awe at such amazing tech. (The Solo is a 'smart' drone that can pretty much fly itself, has a unique look unlike most drones like DJI phantoms people are used to.)
To outright paranoia that I am up to something completely nefarious.

If I had a dollar for every time I have had someone approach me asking 100 questions and accusing me of breaking laws or spying on them.....

These people not understanding what it is I have and are doing, gives them the impression I am doing anything but what I am doing.

I have had people turn up and act weird then leave also. More than likely because they too thought they would not encounter a stranger with weird equipment in their special spot 'nobody else knows about'.
And if I am already flying here I am holding this weird thing with big black square panels (antennas) and a Tablet display on top just standing there. They don't see the drone because it's 120m up and about 1k away. I'm watching its live feed and flying by that. But for them I am just some extremely tall (6foot 7 inches) weird looking guy just standing there holding some weird device.

Would love to be a fly on the wall when they go home and tell their friends and family about what they saw. lol.

Thing is all involved are doing nothing wrong, and are nothing but regular bipeds doing whatever they are doing.
What matters though is how each perceives what they saw and experienced.

On the other end of the spectrum, I myself have turned up to places I expected to be alone and there has been other people. I am actually a shy person. When I turn up and decide whether to stay or go it probably makes me look weird to. It's just one of my quirks, not proof I am a man in black or alien.

More often than not though, if people see the drone they will be fascinated and approach me and ask a bunch of questions. Those people are able to get true perspective of me and my actions and I they and theirs.

So maybe the situation you experienced is the same. Guy could of been a meteorologist or some other scientist with some equipment you're unfamiliar with, just out to do some experiments, or look at the stars with some funky equipment, or even some new stuff he has, wanted a remote location as to not be interrupted while they do what they do as with me and my flying.
Then all of a sudden they see you and like me being shy don't know how to react. I know my size and even my sadly bad teeth can be intimidating and weird people out. I have no idea what you look like, you could of looked like a serial killer or a Sasquatch to this guy and he decided to go elsewhere.
He could of simply been going to go camping or fishing and just got an early start.

You could of easily misidentified some kind of storage on the roof. Or other quite innocent equipment.
You said "4am", so I am assuming it was dark? I mean bit hard to star gaze when it's not. (why exactly if I may ask were you yourself only starting to stargaze at 15 minutes after kicking back around 4am?)

He probably thought "WTF is a guy doing here at this time of the morning?

Gotta admit it would be weird for most people to encounter someone at that time of the day in the middle of nowhere. Did you have a tent and campsite setup? A clear indicator of what you were doing there? I ask as I get the impression you like sleeping under the stars.

For me it seems like you had a weird experience, something so strange but you are convinced it happened. That would make anyone start seeing anything slightly out of the normal as connected. You're only human after all.

For all we know that guy is having a discussion on a another forum somewhere right now saying:

"Hey guys, I went to chart star 'X' this morning as the best time to do it as you know is 5am due to the Earths rotation. Went to location 'X' because it is away from light pollution and I go there all the time because it's isolated. But I freaked out when this scruffy looking bushy bearded serial killer type appeared out of nowhere. I kind of freaked out and decided to get the # out of there, didn't get a good look at him but it could of been a Sasquatch."

Who knows?

only thing I could find

sorry ran out of space on that post lol, a first for me on ATS.

I almost never feel like anyone is after me or watching me or anything weird like that.
I usually feel really alone and isolated and ignored.
That's kinda the opposite of paranoia now isn't it?

Not really. Felt the same way myself, quite often. I am high functioning autistic, not something In usually mention to people. But it makes for a lonely life as everything I do is logic driven. It makes people uncomfortable to be around me some times, because they look at they sky and see pretty lights painted on a backdrop, while I ramble on about the infinite vastness of space and giant balls of burning elements and other 'can see the whole picture' stuff that most people I know cannot process.

Such loneliness can have an impact on you mentally. And sometimes we can be unaware of having mental health issues or crisis. Especially if like me you want to be extremely social and interact with others.
Isn't there a saying about how the problem with crazy people is they don't know they are crazy?
(Not saying you are to be clear. I think we're all insane to some degree, it's the people who say they're sane that scare me lol )

I get depressed, but it took me a long time to identify when I am depressed because I don't get sad, I get apathetic.
People would say they thought I was depressed, but I would reply "But I don't feel sad". Looked into it and it seems to be quite a common thing for those with autism of some form.

I cannot really comment on that aspect though. I do not personally know you, your biology, diet, sleeping patterns and general lifestyle.

Lack of sleep, lack of certain elements like vitamins in your diet, just getting older and a bunch of other things can impact our mental health along with our perception of the world.

I have had dreams so vivid that I could say I have genuinely appeared on Australias Big Brother TV show. A show I am not even a fan of. (Hate 'reality' TV) Yet despite being realistic, thinking about such dreams there are things that make no sense in them. Passage of time that is illogical, but you don't think about until you're awake and are aware you were just sleeping and can process it.

I have myself, especially working in IT, basically used to work 24/7 from having clients around the globe, have burned myself out to the point reality and imagination started to blur together. Was this memory I having real, or was it a dream? It was getting kind of bad to the point I have actually physically damaged my body from over working it and being stressed. (Have some issues with my nervous system now, at one point I lost control of my left hand and arm and occasionally experience minor seizures) Only came right when I stepped back looked at my life and addressed the areas I had neglected, sadly the physical problems are with me for life now, although the mental problems are gone.

But yes, lack of sleep, poor diet, sitting at a computer 24/7 building websites and doing graphic designs and having little to no face to face interactions with humans and some rather stressful events of a personal nature took a toll.
And honestly much of it I was not aware of until other people and my body pointed it out to me.
If I had not crashed and burned at the time I would of still told everyone I felt fine.

But yes, we are by design social creatures, we are designed to seek out others, we crave companionship, even anti-social so and so's like myself.

If our mind and body is not getting what it wants and needs, things start going wrong, and sometimes it is just easier to tell ourselves we're doing just fine than accept life is not what it should be.

But again I am no doctor, and all I know about you is via some text on a screen. So all is assumptions.

Any way I wish you well, but I'd honestly recommend looking at your life, even the unlikely and not so obvious things and ask yourself if the needs in those areas are being met?
For as strong as we feel, we mortals are quite fragile creatures.

Could be as easy as if you use a microwave to cook food, stop it. Been stated by some scientist types it can destroy vitamins in foods. So while you're chicken and veggies seem a correct food, they may not be giving you what you need.

If you are awake all night, or like me used to stay awake for 3 days at a time. Then you need to try and get a regular sleep pattern happening. And if you're lonely do what you can to fix that. Talking to randoms online is not substitute for direct physical contact.

Anyways time for me to stop rambling. Best of luck and I hope you find some answers to your experiences be they natural or supernatural.