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Trump Sits, Talks During Retreat on Pennsylvania ANG Base

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posted on Oct, 12 2017 @ 07:46 PM
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a reply to: Lab4Us

So that makes three people who've spent time in uniform in hangars and said you don't do anything.




posted on Oct, 12 2017 @ 07:46 PM
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originally posted by: windword
a reply to: Irishhaf


I cited from
"Chapter 8 CUSTOMS AND COURTESIES
8.1.6. Saluting the Flag."

Not about a change of command ceremony.


8.1.6.2. Flags on stationary flag staffs are only saluted during Reveille, Retreat, special ceremonies, or when the flag is being raised or lowered. In these cases, when outside and in uniform, face the flag (if visible) or face the direction the music is played and stand at attention and salute on the first note of ―To The Color‖ or the national anthem (or if neither is played, when you see the flag first being raised or lowered).



8.1.6.4. When indoors and in uniform, face the flag (or the music if the flag is not visible) and stand at attention when the national anthem (of any country) or ―To The Color‖ is played (do not place your hand over your heart). There are two exceptions. If in uniform, under arms, salute. The other rule applies to spectators in uniform at a military ceremony inside where ‗outdoor‘ rules apply (i.e. a change of command ceremony planned for outdoors but moved inside a hanger due to inclement weather). When indoors and in civilian clothes, face the flag (or the music if the flag is not visible), stand at attention when the national anthem (of any country) or ―To The Color‖ is played and place the right hand over the heart.


I don't see a hanger setting being an exception, and this wasn't a change of command ceremony. PUTUS should have at least paused in respect. But, he didn't even know what the music was. He thought they were playing it for him, not because they were lowering the flag.



Again, no pausing required while “indoors”. Maybe those who haven’t experienced the life should be more careful when declaring what’s required on a military installation during a military ceremony.

BTW...Retreat serves two purposes. 1) Signals the end of the standard duty day and 2) pays respect to the flag (see above for required actions).



posted on Oct, 12 2017 @ 07:47 PM
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originally posted by: Shamrock6
a reply to: Lab4Us

So that makes three people who've spent time in uniform in hangars and said you don't do anything.


Correct, when you’re inside, no protocol required during Retreat.

...guess I should add “when on a US Air Force installation” ... to try and put this to rest.
edit on 12-10-2017 by Lab4Us because: Added last line...



posted on Oct, 12 2017 @ 07:50 PM
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a reply to: Lab4Us

Oh I know about the indoors application (or lack thereof), just wasn't sure how it worked with hangars and flightline areas.

Grunt barracks, everybody knew to hang out near their door and then sort of just slooooowly disappear right as it got near time.



posted on Oct, 12 2017 @ 07:52 PM
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a reply to: windword

I decided to take it a step further to try and explain why you do not worry about retreat or reveille while on the flight line.
First off its a 24 hour a day operation (on active duty), and on more than one occasion I heard both in one shift.

If you are refueling a jet you need to pay attention to your gauges rather than the music because turning away even for a couple minutes (depending on the plane and the system your using to refuel the plane) could screw the CG and have the plane sit on its butt.

If I am catching a plane, assuming I know the music is playing should I make the crew wait till the music is done.. no you get them in and get to work fixing the planes.

How about working the hydraulic jacks because you need to jack the aircraft and swing the gear.

There is a lot of work occurring at all hours of the day where if you are not paying attention you can kill people and damage the aircraft so people on the flight line are not paying attention to those songs.

There is only one other place I can think of that could of been, possibly a gymnasium but most likely it was a hanger to guarantee maximum room for those that wanted to be there.
edit on 12-10-2017 by Irishhaf because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 12 2017 @ 07:57 PM
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Not a big deal, in my opinion.

This constant outrage over ceremonies and symbolism seems so be completely absurd, whether it's standing for an anthem or for retreat.

Waste of time, no matter what.



posted on Oct, 12 2017 @ 08:04 PM
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I can appreciate the input of our service members here who can attest to the daily routine of soldiers on base.

However ...

President Trump is NOT a soldier and is NOT on any base every day. In fact, it is a rare matter for him to be on base, agreed? It is an event in and of itself, isn't it?

What would be the problem with walking a few feet, facing the flag, and doing basic honors to our servicemen and servicewomen, veterans and honored dead?

PARTICULARLY given the rabble-rousing he's generated about honoring the flag properly?

Isn't there such a thing as respect paid for respect's sake? Whether he "has to" or not?



posted on Oct, 12 2017 @ 08:05 PM
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a reply to: Irishhaf


It was a hanger. The media said so. There was no flight line. This was a planned event.

Trump was doing an interview with Sean Hannity. He heard the music and asked about it, then made a comment that they were playing it for him. Then, he joked they were playing it for Sean Hannity, because of his ratings.

Now, is that respectful behavior for the lowering of the National Flag, and the ceremonial music accompanying it?

It looks like ignorance to me. But that's even worse! And, considering the timing of this gaff, and the national debate about respecting the flag that Trump himself started, there is no excuse for his behavior. But, this isn't the first the president's behavior has been inexcusable.
edit on 12-10-2017 by windword because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 12 2017 @ 08:08 PM
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a reply to: windword

That post is spot on. I didn't know he thought that Retreat was being played for him.

That's ... just so wrong, and then to joke on air that this solemn ceremony was to celebrate Hannity's ratings???

Can you imagine Obama doing that with Maddow?

Jesus.
edit on 12-10-2017 by Gryphon66 because: Noted



posted on Oct, 12 2017 @ 08:14 PM
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originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: windword

That post is spot on. I didn't know he thought that Retreat was being played for him.

That's ... just so wrong, and then to joke on air that this solemn ceremony was to celebrate Hannity's ratings???

Can you imagine Obama doing that with Maddow?

Jesus.


He thought it was being played for him?

Well, I suppose I spoke too soon in my last post.



posted on Oct, 12 2017 @ 08:16 PM
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Sigh...carry on all of you who live your lives hoping against hope POTUS made a gaff (when he didn’t; nor would have previous POTUS in same circumstance).

Guess it’s a good sign when that’s all the usual suspects here can try to whine about...



posted on Oct, 12 2017 @ 08:16 PM
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a reply to: introvert

Sadly ... yes.



President Donald Trump appeared confused about a longstanding military tradition on Wednesday night.

While speaking with Fox News' Sean Hannity at an Air National Guard hangar in Middletown, Pennsylvania, Trump paused as loudspeakers began playing the tune, "Retreat," in the distance.

It's part of a firmly rooted tradition that predates the American Revolutionary War; the US military tune signals the end of the official duty day on military installations.

"What a nice sound that is," Trump said, as the tune began playing. "Are they playing that for you or for me?"

"They're playing that in honor of his ratings," Trump quipped, answering his own question to Hannity. "He's beating everybody."


Business Insider



posted on Oct, 12 2017 @ 08:18 PM
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originally posted by: Lab4Us
Sigh...carry on all of you who live your lives hoping against hope POTUS made a gaff (when he didn’t; nor would have previous POTUS in same circumstance).

Guess it’s a good sign when that’s all the usual suspects here can try to whine about...


LOL, this latest silly BS is far from the only thing to criticize Trump on today. There were three ridiculous categories before I finished my morning coffee... but that's Mr. Trump.

I want to thank you for your service. I'm sorry that you seem deluded by our current President's shenanigans.



posted on Oct, 12 2017 @ 08:20 PM
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originally posted by: introvert
Not a big deal, in my opinion.

This constant outrage over ceremonies and symbolism seems so be completely absurd, whether it's standing for an anthem or for retreat.

Waste of time, no matter what.


An extreme show of patriotism.

"You stand for the flag, or get the # out!"

It's... bemusing.



posted on Oct, 12 2017 @ 08:21 PM
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originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: introvert

Sadly ... yes.



President Donald Trump appeared confused about a longstanding military tradition on Wednesday night.

While speaking with Fox News' Sean Hannity at an Air National Guard hangar in Middletown, Pennsylvania, Trump paused as loudspeakers began playing the tune, "Retreat," in the distance.

It's part of a firmly rooted tradition that predates the American Revolutionary War; the US military tune signals the end of the official duty day on military installations.

"What a nice sound that is," Trump said, as the tune began playing. "Are they playing that for you or for me?"

"They're playing that in honor of his ratings," Trump quipped, answering his own question to Hannity. "He's beating everybody."


Business Insider


I don't give one rat's ass about the symbolism and the tradition, but it does take some arrogance to assume or question if it's being played for himself or a media #stain.



posted on Oct, 12 2017 @ 08:23 PM
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originally posted by: introvert

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: introvert

Sadly ... yes.



President Donald Trump appeared confused about a longstanding military tradition on Wednesday night.

While speaking with Fox News' Sean Hannity at an Air National Guard hangar in Middletown, Pennsylvania, Trump paused as loudspeakers began playing the tune, "Retreat," in the distance.

It's part of a firmly rooted tradition that predates the American Revolutionary War; the US military tune signals the end of the official duty day on military installations.

"What a nice sound that is," Trump said, as the tune began playing. "Are they playing that for you or for me?"

"They're playing that in honor of his ratings," Trump quipped, answering his own question to Hannity. "He's beating everybody."


Business Insider


I don't give one rat's ass about the symbolism and the tradition, but it does take some arrogance to assume or question if it's being played for himself or a media #stain.


I'm not sure if it's arrogance or ignorance (or dementia) ... but it is certain that if the previous President had done or said anything even FAINTLY resembling this sh!tshow ... many of these same folks would be bouncing off the walls, calling for the tree of liberty to be watered, etc.



posted on Oct, 12 2017 @ 09:19 PM
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originally posted by: windword
a reply to: Irishhaf


It was a hanger. The media said so. There was no flight line. This was a planned event.

Trump was doing an interview with Sean Hannity. He heard the music and asked about it, then made a comment that they were playing it for him. Then, he joked they were playing it for Sean Hannity, because of his ratings.

Now, is that respectful behavior for the lowering of the National Flag, and the ceremonial music accompanying it?

It looks like ignorance to me. But that's even worse! And, considering the timing of this gaff, and the national debate about respecting the flag that Trump himself started, there is no excuse for his behavior. But, this isn't the first the president's behavior has been inexcusable.


so where pray tell are hangers located, please enlighten me apparently my experience was all in my head and everything I saw every day of my career was just imaginary fever dreams.



posted on Oct, 12 2017 @ 09:49 PM
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Sorry guys, he was set up on this. His advisors are not working for him, but against him, now if this isn't clear enough for us members here to understand that, well, someone help America become sane again. I, at one time wore the military uniform and as a Vietnam Veteran, I felt betrayed by the politics of the US president at that time, the betrayal was on the American people, this time though, his advisors betrayed President Trump. Poor guy, I hope he fires them after reading my post here. Do it, Mr. President, they shafted you really good this time. I'd fry their ass's if I were you, at least something along them lines.
edit on 1000000051492017-10-12T21:49:51-05:00495110pm9 by musicismagic because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 12 2017 @ 10:26 PM
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a reply to: Irishhaf

You still haven't provided proof that because the event was held in a hanger, the ritual respect around the national flag Retreat ceremony is suspended.

The president heard the music, commented on it, then speculated that they were playing it for him. Then Trump joked about it being played to celebrate Sean Hannity's ratings.

What does any of that have to do with disrespecting the flag because the event being held in a hanger?


edit on 12-10-2017 by windword because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 12 2017 @ 10:34 PM
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originally posted by: Shamrock6
a reply to: Lab4Us

So that makes three people who've spent time in uniform in hangars and said you don't do anything.


TRump didn't even know what was being played he sure as hell didn't know the regulation.

He is a clown.



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