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Harvey Weinstein Has Me Thinking

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posted on Oct, 18 2017 @ 09:20 AM
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a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

..."and they did nothing"... that still seems to be the going response to inappropriate touching for a laugh or to demean or for a sexual physical/emotional/ego kick.

I recall, in high school, one 18 year old man (failed a few grades) went around grabbing girls' boobs and when he tried it on me he got a violent scene in front of everyone.

I also recall a co-worker doing the same thing and we were in our 20s. When he did it to me, I objected and I told him to stop, he did not, so I went to my male Supervisor and his reply was "can't you take a joke". I pounded my fist on the table and told him if he did not do something about this that I would. He said he would and he confronted the groper and they had a big verbal fight right in the office. The groper never touched me again, but he continued to do it to the other women that did not tell him to stop. Why did they not do anything about it? There are a myriad a reasons; fight, flight and now freeze.




posted on Oct, 18 2017 @ 09:28 AM
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a reply to: InTheLight

I do not know why people do not do their civil duties as managers. But it is a problem for me from time to time, too.

If more managers were aware that they could be personally sued for failure to act, they may take the job more seriously.



posted on Oct, 18 2017 @ 09:30 AM
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a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan


More troubling was their activities facilitating his behavior which, in my opinion, makes them complicit.



posted on Oct, 18 2017 @ 09:41 AM
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originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: InTheLight

I do not know why people do not do their civil duties as managers. But it is a problem for me from time to time, too.

If more managers were aware that they could be personally sued for failure to act, they may take the job more seriously.


But the law does not hold anyone to account for being complicit or in abetting of sexual predators actions/behaviours, such as the bartender that turns a blind eye to date rape drugs being put in drinks, like Weinstein's staff leaving the actresses alone with him, like my Manager not taking it any further than a verbal warning... when good men and women do nothing.
edit on 110CDT09America/Chicago04190931 by InTheLight because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 18 2017 @ 09:58 AM
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originally posted by: InTheLight

originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: InTheLight

I do not know why people do not do their civil duties as managers. But it is a problem for me from time to time, too.

If more managers were aware that they could be personally sued for failure to act, they may take the job more seriously.


But the law does not hold anyone to account for being complicit or in abetting of sexual predators actions/behaviours, such as the bartender that turns a blind eye to date rape drugs being put in drinks, like Weinstein's staff leaving the actresses alone with him, like my Manager not taking it any further than a verbal warning... when good men and women do nothing.


Incorrect.

If a female employee approaches me with a complaint about sexual harassment, my lack of appropriate action can make me the target of civil litigation. No, there would be no criminal charges against me...but the civil litigation is enough I would think, as a judgement not only ruins your financially, it ruins your socially as well. You are forever known as the guy who lets cads molest women.

Im not so sure a person should be criminally responsible. If im just not very observant, or am absent minded...could I end up in jail because I didn't see something to stop? What if im scared myself, or dealing with my own trauma, and am psychologically unable to help?

From a criminal standpoint I think we are better off leaving it to prosecuting what people actually do.



posted on Oct, 18 2017 @ 10:20 AM
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originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan

originally posted by: InTheLight

originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: InTheLight

I do not know why people do not do their civil duties as managers. But it is a problem for me from time to time, too.

If more managers were aware that they could be personally sued for failure to act, they may take the job more seriously.


But the law does not hold anyone to account for being complicit or in abetting of sexual predators actions/behaviours, such as the bartender that turns a blind eye to date rape drugs being put in drinks, like Weinstein's staff leaving the actresses alone with him, like my Manager not taking it any further than a verbal warning... when good men and women do nothing.


Incorrect.

If a female employee approaches me with a complaint about sexual harassment, my lack of appropriate action can make me the target of civil litigation. No, there would be no criminal charges against me...but the civil litigation is enough I would think, as a judgement not only ruins your financially, it ruins your socially as well. You are forever known as the guy who lets cads molest women.

Im not so sure a person should be criminally responsible. If im just not very observant, or am absent minded...could I end up in jail because I didn't see something to stop? What if im scared myself, or dealing with my own trauma, and am psychologically unable to help?

From a criminal standpoint I think we are better off leaving it to prosecuting what people actually do.


What exactly is appropriate action for a Manager?

From what I have seen firsthand, is that there is an initial complaint, then the complaint goes through channels usually up to the President's Office and then is investigated by the company and the authorities did not seem to have a front role in the investigation?

I am witness to this complaint being reported but the very young woman was told to 'keep quiet' for the reason that it was being investigated and is confidential and while this was going on, the predator moved on to another job and location.

Two years later (believing she put her trust in the right people to help her and being in a vulnerable emotional state, I presume) she must have healed herself somewhat because she then leaked it to the news media and then only after a backlash was the appropriate action was taken. After all was said and done, that company formed a special department with trained staff just to handle sexual harassment complaints.

Weinstein, in my opinion, was abetted all the way, perhaps not intentionally by some, but by others I am sure they just looked the other way. Weinstein said 'he made a mistake', how I interpret that is that the mistake he made was getting caught.
edit on 110CDT10America/Chicago025101031 by InTheLight because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 18 2017 @ 11:08 AM
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a reply to: InTheLight

A manager should first follow company policy. Use the open door and ensure the grievance is heard. If the grievance is criminal in nature, making yourself available to provide a statement wouldn't hurt either.

If there is no resolution then it would seem that the manager should then file their own complaint with HR citing a hostile work environment. If someone sexually harasses you, it makes me uncomfortable. Just like I don't want to see flirting at work. So your harassment can easily be made into my claim, and as a manager i'd likely file a claim as well.

If that goes nowhere, then you and the manager both have cause to resign (and file on unemployment insurance) as well as contacting an attorney.



posted on Oct, 18 2017 @ 11:20 AM
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a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

Resigning does not address the internal systemic business or societal problems of inaction or incompetence.



posted on Oct, 18 2017 @ 11:39 AM
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originally posted by: InTheLight
a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

Resigning does not address the internal systemic business or societal problems of inaction or incompetence.



No, but that is more than a single person with a grievance can hope to achieve. What a single person can do is sue. If you are forced to leave a job, then you have a larger settlement.



posted on Oct, 18 2017 @ 11:51 AM
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originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan

originally posted by: InTheLight
a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

Resigning does not address the internal systemic business or societal problems of inaction or incompetence.



No, but that is more than a single person with a grievance can hope to achieve. What a single person can do is sue. If you are forced to leave a job, then you have a larger settlement.



The women that received monetary settlements agreed to his 'code of silence', so I am sure there is a logical explanation for this.



Dozens of Mr. Weinstein’s former and current employees, from assistants to top executives, said they knew of inappropriate conduct while they worked for him. Only a handful said they ever confronted him. Mr. Weinstein enforced a code of silence; employees of the Weinstein Company have contracts saying they will not criticize it or its leaders in a way that could harm its “business reputation” or “any employee’s personal reputation,” a recent document shows. And most of the women accepting payouts agreed to confidentiality clauses prohibiting them from speaking about the deals or the events that led to them.


www.nytimes.com...



posted on Oct, 18 2017 @ 12:23 PM
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a reply to: InTheLight

Yeah, if you want your story to get out there you don't settle.

When you settle you are essentially saying "my dignity has a price"



posted on Oct, 18 2017 @ 12:26 PM
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originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: InTheLight

Yeah, if you want your story to get out there you don't settle.

When you settle you are essentially saying "my dignity has a price"


Or, the women may have wanted to bury it once and for all.



posted on Oct, 18 2017 @ 01:23 PM
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originally posted by: InTheLight

originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: InTheLight

Yeah, if you want your story to get out there you don't settle.

When you settle you are essentially saying "my dignity has a price"


Or, the women may have wanted to bury it once and for all.


That could be true. The case would be embarassing, and likely would end up with you having your character attacked in open court. That really sucks.



posted on Oct, 18 2017 @ 01:32 PM
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originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan

originally posted by: InTheLight

originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: InTheLight

Yeah, if you want your story to get out there you don't settle.

When you settle you are essentially saying "my dignity has a price"


Or, the women may have wanted to bury it once and for all.


That could be true. The case would be embarassing, and likely would end up with you having your character attacked in open court. That really sucks.


Or receiving comments such as "you asked for it".



posted on Oct, 18 2017 @ 01:44 PM
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originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: InTheLight

Yeah, if you want your story to get out there you don't settle.

When you settle you are essentially saying "my dignity has a price"

I know what you are thinking, and it is a quite common response. I myself used to become frustrated when dealing with a patient that wanted the police to investigate the assault, but they wanted to remain anonymous and they didn't want the assailant to know that he had been reported.

Of course, it can't be done that way, so a lot of victims refuse to report. In the areas where I work, there are a lot of high profile and wealthy people that have been accused of sexual assault, but their power and position places them in a safety buffer zone.

In cases of the poor, being powerless leaves them at the mercy at those that control the shelter for them and their children, including the food they eat and whether they live or die. They want their complaints heard, they want it to stop, they just aren't willing to risk their lives or the lives of their loved ones.

Those in positions of power and control have gotten away with the crime of sexual abuse for so long because it is not just the dignity of the victim that is for sale.


edit on 18-10-2017 by NightSkyeB4Dawn because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 19 2017 @ 12:16 PM
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posted on Oct, 21 2017 @ 01:29 PM
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a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

Here you are asking if you're making sense... but let me ask you this.

What part of


originally posted by: geezlouise
And while I understand that sometimes in some situations we can’t do that, so it would be smart to take precaution


do you not understand?

Because clearly, you are not accepting that I am capable of comprehending what you are proposing, as if it's some wildly deep and obscure notion that someone like me wouldn't normally grasp so you have to say the same things over and over again- when you really only had to say it once.

Maybe you're being distracted by the profile picture.

It's like that show on TV where people fix up old houses.

They find an old piece of sh-t for their clients to fix up, and the clients are always scared... because they can't see the future. They don't know the process. They're not familiar with all of the steps. But the visionaries know what's possible of the future and they're familiar with all of the steps that it'll take to get there and they print out plans for their clients to look at and they talk their clients through it all, holding their hands through it all... and in the end, the clients have a new fancy house that they're happy with.

But it's always the same... when people look at a piece of sh-t house all they see is a piece of sh-t house- but the visionary sees what it could be... and they see what steps are needed to get there, too.

Maybe I'm not a visionary but I'm definitely looking at a piece of sh-t house and I know it can be better.

Does this make sense to you?

In a reverse sense when people look at a beautiful mansion... that's all they'll ever see. They'll never think that the mansion could have ever experienced other states of being... and I forgive people for being super one-dimensional because I know that they can't help themselves as much as I can't.

Love,
Lou.



posted on Oct, 21 2017 @ 01:56 PM
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a reply to: geezlouise

Im sorry for trying to make sure i was clear. I didnt think it would piss you off.





posted on Oct, 21 2017 @ 01:59 PM
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a reply to: MRuss

Also I wanted you to know that I didn't get that vibe from you initially and I love you for the thread and also I think you're really easy to read, which is pleasant and I love that too.

I think it was comments from others who chose to go into that direction and reinforce those ideas that really triggered me. And I may just be particularly triggered because I am a victim of a serious crime... and I struggle with guilt and shame about it everyday.

So, idk.

Also, what I said up there ^.

I'm not incapable of understanding how to take precautions in unsafe situations. I am fully capable.

But also, there's something about trauma that sometimes traps people into a loop of revictimization- and it's not their fault. Their minds are desperately trying to process what happened to them, and possibly finds validation through the revictimization process too- because validation is so important to everyone.

So, even those people who find themselves in situations similar to the initial trauma and abuse over and over again, they were victims of abuse and initially didn't choose it, and now they can't get out and it's not that they're stupid or any less capable of understanding either. The world simply hasn't proven that it could be any other way to them, yet. They're looking at a sh-tty shack and can't imagine that it could be any different.

I'm not telling you personally but anyone who is here who might listen.



posted on Oct, 21 2017 @ 02:02 PM
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a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

Lol. I'm not really pissed off but I guess I didn't feel heard... which is normal, too. We all don't feel heard sometimes.



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