Lessons to be learned from the NFL issue...so far.

originally posted by: dfnj2015
a reply to: nwtrucker

What I learned is how masterful Trump was in changing a protest about social injustice of police forces against black people to be a story about NFL players not standing during the national anthem. Most people in this country don't even know why the NFL players were kneeling in the first place.

The lesson learned here is it does matter what the story is because it's always about Trump.

Some think so, as you do. What I believe what you miss is he is the focal point, the conduit, so to speak. His message resonates. As it would, or will rather, when someone else supplants him.

No. it isn't all about Trump. It's about the rest of us....

a reply to: nwtrucker

Lots of "false prophets" resonate it doesn't make their message true.

originally posted by: luthier
a reply to: nwtrucker

I would hope. That blm guy that went nuts and shot Dallas cops was a vet.

The ptsd and coming home to racism is an issue.

Imagine how the blacks felt in ww2, korea, and Vietnam pre civil rights when they came home.

Now we have let the police and public distrust get outrageous.

Cops are killing whites as well.

There is an issue with poor training, screening, and pay. Officers are asked to pick up the garbage and paid and trained poorly to do it. 80 percent are out of shape..protected by unions....

It's just a mess in this identity politics world.

I very much appreciate your consideration and thought even though we may disagree.

I was talking to a friend that is connected to a Law firm that represents wrongful death suits against police. He claims every single one of them was a vet who had seen combat. I don't know if that's true or not. If it is or even close to the truth, we may be onto something.

originally posted by: luthier
a reply to: nwtrucker

Lots of "false prophets" resonate it doesn't make their message true.

Nothing new there. Then again, sometimes truth is unpalatable to some.

Hey! it's time for some college football!! See ya....

a reply to: nwtrucker

I don't know. I think Trump has proven himself as a bad leader. Without question.

He may be doing good deals behind the scenes but that is a different thing and a different position to hold.

A leader would have found a way to make the majority happy. Like I am.making a gesture to join you on the field to recognize your struggle but you have to join me in standing for the flag.



Believe it or not we used to have people like that. As I get older it gets harder to remember those times.


This is a leader..
leader

originally posted by: eNumbra

originally posted by: nwtrucker

[...]
Now that politics has almost irrevocably entered Professional football, [...]

Politics entered football when the DoD began paying the NFL to put the players on the field for the national anthem.

We could go back to the days prior to that and while I’m sure a handful of the narrow-scope nationalists who insist on the anthem being a part of every waking moment of everyday life would be upset, I guarantee the majority of America wouldn’t care and you’d simultaneously solve the problem of everybody getting upset at the method of protest.

Damn right! How dare the DoD spend money on acknowledging their heroes instead of more weapons....

Lil' Donny is just tossing spitballs because when he tried to buy a team... the NFL owners wouldn't let him in the club. He has a big chip on his shoulder, and decided to use the office of the Presidency to take a swing at their bottom line.

Stand with neo-nazis & the KKK... and you're among "fine people".

Respectfully take a knee during the anthem to acknowledge police brutality... and your mother is a "female dog mature for breeding".

a reply to: luthier


Sorry, but I don't buy your attempted differentiation. It is bogus.

a reply to: nwtrucker

Whatever that means (not sure)

Trump leads the country for a minority of people.

It's a trend in politics he is the current apex.

The General I linked is how you deal with issues. Not by dividing the public more.

You don't give babies clamoring about how unfair it is a voice you don't give bullies a voice you just direct people to join together.

Trump and his silver spoon have no idea what it's like to be raised in squalor. Nfl teams and the military both have a wide base of backrounds and the motivation to squash bigotry is simple. To operate effectively without internal conflict. In the process they learn about different backrounds and points of view.

a reply to: nwtrucker

I also have to ask how you dont see a crisis in law enforcement. I may be closer to the situation being a grappler instructor who has worked over the years with many officers but paying a cop 37k in Atlanta with no maintenance training and poor rotation out of high stress work is a very big problem. It makes bad cops. Throw in unions and it's a real big problem.


So not talking about it and making it about the flag and patriotism is a total deflection.

originally posted by: nwtrucker

originally posted by: eNumbra

originally posted by: nwtrucker

[...]
Now that politics has almost irrevocably entered Professional football, [...]

Politics entered football when the DoD began paying the NFL to put the players on the field for the national anthem.

We could go back to the days prior to that and while I’m sure a handful of the narrow-scope nationalists who insist on the anthem being a part of every waking moment of everyday life would be upset, I guarantee the majority of America wouldn’t care and you’d simultaneously solve the problem of everybody getting upset at the method of protest.

Damn right! How dare the DoD spend money on acknowledging their heroes instead of more weapons....

So you’re going to ignore the fact that politics have been a part of football for years now - particularly in response to the negative reaction to the war in iraq at the time of the change?

That your outrage is based on something that wasn’t originally a tradition and was in fact pulled into being by your own side in this battle?

originally posted by: luthier
a reply to: nwtrucker

I also have to ask how you dont see a crisis in law enforcement. I may be closer to the situation being a grappler instructor who has worked over the years with many officers but paying a cop 37k in Atlanta with no maintenance training and poor rotation out of high stress work is a very big problem. It makes bad cops. Throw in unions and it's a real big problem.


So not talking about it and making it about the flag and patriotism is a total deflection.

The deflection is YOURS. You have a problem with Atlanta's police pay/training, take it up with THEM. Not a Federal issue. The flag, the Anthem IS a Federal issue. Trump is correct.

That same general would have kneelers out on their asses in a heartbeat if they used the USAF for a platform for a police issue.

You want to play a social media magnate, have at it. Keep up this strategy and it will be hoisting your own petard.

My friends and I no longer meet up at the pub for beer and wings to watch the games. People were arguing over politics around us over the kneeling thing and some got pretty hot and loud over it.

The only arguing and yelling during the game should be over the game, but no there was politics. Kind of ruins the experience.

originally posted by: eNumbra

originally posted by: nwtrucker

originally posted by: eNumbra

originally posted by: nwtrucker

[...]
Now that politics has almost irrevocably entered Professional football, [...]

Politics entered football when the DoD began paying the NFL to put the players on the field for the national anthem.

We could go back to the days prior to that and while I’m sure a handful of the narrow-scope nationalists who insist on the anthem being a part of every waking moment of everyday life would be upset, I guarantee the majority of America wouldn’t care and you’d simultaneously solve the problem of everybody getting upset at the method of protest.

Damn right! How dare the DoD spend money on acknowledging their heroes instead of more weapons....

So you’re going to ignore the fact that politics have been a part of football for years now - particularly in response to the negative reaction to the war in iraq at the time of the change?

That your outrage is based on something that wasn’t originally a tradition and was in fact pulled into being by your own side in this battle?

What are you talking about? War in Iraq and Football? At best, there was little politics in football prior to this. Obviously, you're not a football fan.

It's not the kneeling. If anything it looks like praying and in more support for the flag then having to stand with hand on heart. It's that they are getting into this wagon that's going down hill. We don't pay them millions to have an opinion. Just play football. Since that day I have yet to watch a game until this crap comes to a close. They are not doing nothing but wanting attention in my book and they are going about it the wrong way. Just SHUT UP and play FOOTBALL.

I'm just waiting for the day it comes to our children's cartoons...that's how far this will go and it will only get worse I'd this isn't stopped at the bud.

That's just my opinion and it has no value.

originally posted by: nwtrucker

originally posted by: luthier
a reply to: nwtrucker

I also have to ask how you dont see a crisis in law enforcement. I may be closer to the situation being a grappler instructor who has worked over the years with many officers but paying a cop 37k in Atlanta with no maintenance training and poor rotation out of high stress work is a very big problem. It makes bad cops. Throw in unions and it's a real big problem.


So not talking about it and making it about the flag and patriotism is a total deflection.

The deflection is YOURS. You have a problem with Atlanta's police pay/training, take it up with THEM. Not a Federal issue. The flag, the Anthem IS a Federal issue. Trump is correct.

That same general would have kneelers out on their asses in a heartbeat if they used the USAF for a platform for a police issue.

You want to play a social media magnate, have at it. Keep up this strategy and it will be hoisting your own petard.

The police are certainly under the DOJ. If they need to step in and require officers to be able to do their jobs they should.

The fbi says 80 percent over weighthe and out of shape.

As an avid sports marksman I can tell you good shooters aren't out of shape. I have never seen a three gun race won by a fat guy. Being out of shape lowers tactiCal awareness capability as your body dumps adrenaline.

Police are poor marksman. They are forced to use heavy triggers on service weapons and do not do maintenence marksmanship mandatory in a way to handle threats.

Unions protect bad tactics bad cops and private prison money...

It's a federal issue at this point.

originally posted by: luthier

originally posted by: nwtrucker

originally posted by: luthier
a reply to: nwtrucker

I also have to ask how you dont see a crisis in law enforcement. I may be closer to the situation being a grappler instructor who has worked over the years with many officers but paying a cop 37k in Atlanta with no maintenance training and poor rotation out of high stress work is a very big problem. It makes bad cops. Throw in unions and it's a real big problem.


So not talking about it and making it about the flag and patriotism is a total deflection.

The deflection is YOURS. You have a problem with Atlanta's police pay/training, take it up with THEM. Not a Federal issue. The flag, the Anthem IS a Federal issue. Trump is correct.

That same general would have kneelers out on their asses in a heartbeat if they used the USAF for a platform for a police issue.

You want to play a social media magnate, have at it. Keep up this strategy and it will be hoisting your own petard.

The police are certainly under the DOJ. If they need to step in and require officers to be able to do their jobs they should.

The fbi says 80 percent over weighthe and out of shape.

As an avid sports marksman I can tell you good shooters aren't out of shape. I have never seen a three gun race won by a fat guy. Being out of shape lowers tactiCal awareness capability as your body dumps adrenaline.

Police are poor marksman. They are forced to use heavy triggers on service weapons and do not do maintenence marksmanship mandatory in a way to handle threats.

Unions protect bad tactics bad cops and private prison money...

It's a federal issue at this point.

Nope. It belongs on a state, even city level. There's more than enough incursion by the federal gov't into affairs not authorized by the tenth amendment.

This may be a more accurate reason for the overall response by the NFL and part of Trump's motivation? dennismichaellynch.com...

P.S.. As I posted earlier, it seems virtually every wrongful death suit against the police has a vet as the shooter. Combat experienced and 'shooters'

Again, I don't know how true this is, whatsoever. So it is a 'qualified. ' post.

Not sure why it's to much to ask the NATIONAL football league to stand for the NATIONAL anthem. Plus if my tax dollars go to build these fancy stadiums it's the least they could do.

Especially seeing as they are protesting a nonexistent oppression.

There is no invisible entity out there oppressing people. Especially blacks. Most of their problems stem within their own communities and homes. Oppression is self imposed anymore. No one is forcing people to break the law.

Hell I'm starting to think half of these overpaid kids game players don't even know what they are kneeling for. Haven't watched football in years and this is just reassuring me of my choice.

The NFL is garbage and if more people payed attention to things that directly effect their lives we would be living in a much more prosperous society for all people...

Except these athletes...
They will be forced to work a real job and be judged by the content of their character not their bank account.

originally posted by: luthier
a reply to: nwtrucker

Funny Thursday night numbers weren't down at all.

Maybe it's all bs and nobody really cares that much.

People are lazy they think standing up for the flag supports the troops.

Yet make no big deal out of the treatment of vets when they get home and are labotimized with pharmaceuticals after getting ptsd.

Nobody protests for the soldiers well being. Except maybe the guys protesting in the NFL who can shed some light on what it's like for the vets coming home to racism.

It's almost like 2 of the top 3 franchises played back to back. Who would of thought ratings would be well for Dallas and New England, 2 of the biggest NFL markets?

Another 10% Dip Overall:
www.google.com...

I'll let you know the fan reaction in Philly tomorrow but it was pretty patriotic last game.

Get Politics out of Football, support Military sponsored week

Support American "Freedom and muh constitution" Get upset when people do a form of "Peaceful Protest"

Not care about the people at Home that remain seated, or the crowd at the stadium in line for refreshments, or in the Restroom

Patriot Logic