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Americans Hopeful This Will Be Last Mass Shooting Before They Stop On Their Own For No Reason

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posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 09:12 AM
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a reply to: Gryphon66



Nah, I mean gun control has no effect on someone putting together an arsenal of assault rifles.

Or you know the other 300 mass shootings each year... no relationship at all to the level of gun ownership.

Where were all the concealed carry heroes? Why didn't a citizen with a gun prevent this? Isn't that why you all have guns?




posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 09:14 AM
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a reply to: TerminalVelocity

So you think guns are working well for America?

If not... surely you are in favour of a similar Amendment to the one that followed the 18th?



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 09:15 AM
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a reply to: Boadicea

Even bigger sigh.

Yet, there are countries where there haven't been 1,516 mass shootings in 1,735 days. 1,719 deaths. 6,510 injuries.

I'm asking what the solution is. Not the question. There must be a solution.

edit on 10/3/17 by Gaspode because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 09:18 AM
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Maybe Jimmy Kimmel said it better than I - or The Onion - can.



We cannot do nothing. There must be a line in the sand.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 09:19 AM
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a reply to: Wayfarer


So then I imagine you are for completely open and unrestricted weapon access. I am sure arms companies would love to sell heavier/more expensive equipment to a hungry US public. Is your solution to let everyone have access to mortars, grenade launchers, mines, chemical weapons, etc merely because you can't envision a solution to the problem?


Um... I didn't offer a solution to "the" problem, but that doesn't mean that I cannot envision a solution to the problem... some more reasonable than others.

My solution would be to take reasonable precautions for reasonable risks. And those risks are many. For example, I would much rather see us do something about the lead and psychoactive medications and other sources that we KNOW can cause violent tendencies, including both suicidal and homicidal ideation and execution. I would much rather see us take more care with the "refugees" we let into our cities from nations and cultures that are known for violent practices and who have sworn to kill and maim our people. And, for that matter, I would much rather see firearm education and safety taught to anyone and everyone, thus increasing the number of responsible and knowledgeable firearm holders who can protect and defend themselves (and others) in real time -- BEFORE police have a chance to arrive. Shall I go on???

It seems to me that I'm not the one who cannot envision other solutions. In fact, I would say that I am addressing the real problem, rather than the symptom.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 09:19 AM
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a reply to: joemoe

It's also because of the Constitution that your freedom to have a gun is guaranteed.

I hope the lawmakers will address it soon. My provision would be for the ammo side. Like no one needs high capacity magazines that can be purchased by psychopaths.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 09:20 AM
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Therein also is another misconception: Government.

When this country was created the idea was to have a government that is ruled by the people, for the people.

Not a government that dictates what freedoms it's citizens are "allowed" to have.

It's why most Americans get pretty ticked off at being told what they can or can not drink. What size soda they are allowed to have. How much salt they can put on their food. What they can or can not smoke.

What you can or can not own.

It's because we've given the government that much power (unfortunately), and are increasingly living in a Nanny State.

Personal responsibility has gone out the window. Too many are begging the government to dictate every aspect of their lives, and too many non-US citizens keep telling us that it's okay to trust your government.

Yah.....I'm pretty sure the Native Americans will get behind that and tell us how great it is to trust the government to look out for us....

smh



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 09:21 AM
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a reply to: SudoNim

Not a member of the NRA ... but generalize away.

The CDC hired the Institute of Medicine and National Research Council for a study, they estimated number of defensive uses of guns ranges "from about 500,000 to more than 3 million per year."

But if you do not believe in having a firearm ... it is your right not to own one. However, you have no rights to disarm me and my family.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 09:22 AM
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Here is my question, since every tom dick and harriet is screaming for gun control now.

Last I read the guy did not have trouble with the cops, was not in and out of a mental hospital, was well off financially.

So zero red flags in the system, what possible legislation could have stopped this?



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 09:22 AM
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a reply to: MOMof3

Get rid of the 2nd legally. Otherwise "Shall not be Infringed"!



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 09:25 AM
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originally posted by: Gaspode
a reply to: Boadicea

Even bigger sigh.

Yet, there are countries where there hasn't been 1,516 mass shootings in 1,735 days. 1,719 deaths. 6,510 injuries.

I'm asking what the solution is. Not the question. There must be a solution.



Have you investigated where the mass shooting took place?

Or who was involved in those mass shootings?

Did the weapons used in these shooting violate existing laws?

Did the shooters obtain the guns legally?

Maybe the answer to your question lies in the answers to those questions.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 09:25 AM
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originally posted by: Wayfarer

originally posted by: Gryphon66
B) Legal limitations on gun ownership in the US are unconstitutional.


Therein is the problem, and its not like the constitution hasn't been amended since its inception. You are conflating national identity with hard facts.


I'm not conflating anything at all ... I didn't say a word about nor reference "national identity."

The facts are these. The US is one of the only countries that has EVER had a Constitutional right to carry.

There are only three in the world now (US, Mexico, Guatemala) and the US is the only one that is not Constitutionally restricted.

If you're arguing for a Constitutional Amendment, that's a different matter. However, currently, restrictions on gun ownership itself is not the answer.

If you consider Heller, Justice Scalia gave as good a summary and argument as any ever written on the Second Amendment: Heller decision



Like most rights, the right secured by the Second Amendment is not unlimited. From Blackstone through the 19th-century cases, commentators and courts rou­ tinely explained that the right was not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose.


and further



Although we do not undertake an exhaustive historical analysis today of the full scope of the Second Amendment, nothing in our opinion should be taken to cast doubt on longstanding prohibitions on the possession of firearms by felons and the mentally ill, or laws forbidding the carrying of firearms in sensitive places such as schools and government buildings, or laws impos­ing conditions and qualifications on the commercial sale of arms.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 09:35 AM
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a reply to: [post=22727696]joemoe[/post

Amendments are constitutional.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 09:36 AM
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originally posted by: Irishhaf
Here is my question, since every tom dick and harriet is screaming for gun control now.

Last I read the guy did not have trouble with the cops, was not in and out of a mental hospital, was well off financially.

So zero red flags in the system, what possible legislation could have stopped this?


Bingo.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 09:36 AM
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a reply to: Gaspode

Okay, fair enough... but your OP presumes that guns are the problem -- NOT those who misuse them, and can misuse lots of things for the same ends. That's the real problem.

So isn't the real issue to be discussed and addressed what causes people to want to kill others? Are we just supposed to be angry because the murderer used a gun? Or should we be angry because he killed people?

In reply to another poster, I mentioned lead and psychoactive drugs which we know are a source of homicidal ideation and execution.

Violence is a much bigger problem than just mass executions. Let's look at the inner cities, where gang violence is rampant... as is lead poisoning. There have countless studies performed confirming that lead poisoning causes lower IQs and reasoning ability, loss of empathy, compassion, and leads to violent practices. Countless articles have been written about it. We know. But we do nothing -- except blame those who don't know any better due to lack of education and information AND LEAD POISONING!!!

Not only would we address the violence by addressing these root issues, we would also improve countless lives in countless ways for eternity.

Our problems are much much bigger than guns with many root causes, and there is no one solution. And we have to address all of them to address the bigger issue. But if I had to reduce it to one thing: Take care of the people and for the most part the problem will take care of itself.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 09:39 AM
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originally posted by: Irishhaf
what possible legislation could have stopped this?


Why is this such a hard concept to understand. Zero Guns. Gun Ban. If you can't buy a gun, it doesn't matter if you're a criminal or a saint.

The 2nd amendment has done nothing but kill people (mostly innocent people). How many tyrannical governments have we overthrown with our overwhelming civilian firepower? How many Abrams tanks and MQ-9 Reapers are we going to be able to destroy with all these guns if/when the Government comes to oppress us?



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 09:40 AM
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originally posted by: Boadicea

Our problems are much much bigger than guns with many root causes, and there is no one solution. And we have to address all of them to address the bigger issue. But if I had to reduce it to one thing: Take care of the people and for the most part the problem will take care of itself.


I'd like to highlight this if I may. We are being conditioned, as a nation, into absolutism. We are going to have to turn this trend around, as a People, and start compromising to find actual solutions to actual problems ... or we are lost.

IMO



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 09:43 AM
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a reply to: Wayfarer

So you have faith in the Fed to remove a constitutional right, and not over reach with maybe the first, or finish the death of the 4th?



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 09:44 AM
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a reply to: Boadicea

Exactly. Almost.

I will try to make my point again:
1. We cannot do nothing.
2. The gun owners vs. gun control discussions go nowhere - so what can be done without even considering the gun control issue? Can the issue be addressed without addressing gun control? This is an opportunity for pro-gun folks to step up. If not the guns, then what?
3. The problem will not go away. As we've seen over the past 2 decades it has been getting worse.
4. We cannot do nothing.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 09:44 AM
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a reply to: Irishhaf

The Fed, the States or any level of government would be just as bad ... and just as against the Constitution.



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