It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

First Good Example for an Assault Rifle Ban???

page: 18
26
<< 15  16  17    19  20  21 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 11:11 AM
link   
a reply to: JoshuaCox

Really because Northern Ireland seemed to do pretty well when they called a cease fire and an arms armistice
and the government collected tonnes of illegal fire arms and the IRA decommissioned alot of their weapons
as did the other paramilitary groups

and we are talking about terrorist organisations which were already at war with the British army
Im not talking about civilians defending their right to hold weapons and fight the government if they get too big for their boots.

In this case the IRA were fighting the UK government without any constitutional protection , and they gave up their arms

you dont need weapons to over throw a government you just need the will to do it!


edit on 3-10-2017 by sapien82 because: (no reason given)




posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 11:14 AM
link   
a reply to: JoshuaCox

It's all good man I was just clearing up those two different types of logical fallacy .

For me the comparison is they are firearms and both fall into the category of weapons



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 11:15 AM
link   

originally posted by: JoshuaCox
I think Comparing civilian firearms to military grade firearms and home made explosives to military grade explosives are close enough to be a fair analogy.



I'd have to disagree. I think its like using an Indy 500 race car to justify regulations on street cars. The similarities are largely superficial and the purposes are different.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 11:18 AM
link   
a reply to: JoshuaCox

Its a moot point man. You live in a country where a person anyone can have a parts kit delivered to their door with no checks whatsoever. You can get any machine gun you like in this way. The country is flooded with em. During the Clinton era ban those affected just simply cut receivers and shipped ten times as many weapons into our country. 10's of millions exist and for those who don't mind the risk of felony charges, well they can have anything they like. Homemade silencers abound etc..

Parts kits on gun broker
www.gunbroker.com...

Based on the cyclic rate and sound I still refuse to believe this guy was using an AR 15 like many are saying, but if you listen to a M1919 being fired well you be the judge. Clearly 600-800 rounds per minute in Vegas. An M16/AR15 would have a much higher rate of fire, and just sounds different.
Here is a nice M1919 parts kit.
www.e-sarcoinc.com...

The cats already out of the bag. You can only limit those willing to abide by the laws of this land. I assume a mass murderer would be unconcerned about any bans.




edit on 3-10-2017 by Donkey_Dean because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 11:22 AM
link   

originally posted by: Donkey_Dean
a reply to: JoshuaCox

Its a mute point man. You live in a country where a person anyone can have a parts kit delivered to their door with no checks whatsoever. You can get any machine gun you like in this way.


You can't assemble a functional firearm from those parts kits without also having a receiver. The receiver must be shipped to a dealer, which does require a background check.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 11:26 AM
link   
Thing is you can ban guns or make the licensing extremely difficult , guns are like that here in the UK
but a couple of young guys in their 20's shot up each other in a family feud at 2pm in a kids play park in Castlemilk in Glasgow
about a couple of months ago

These wee guys didnt have a license and they got hold of illegal firearms no problem

like I said where there is a will there is a way.
Even if america were to ban guns completely , sale and manufacture, guns will still be shipped from mexico , or made by craftsmen!

So again whilst guns are bad and can be used to kill many people , you wont ever stop the flow of firearms even if they are outright banned (which would be amazing )
especially when the USA already arms plenty of "moderate rebels" around the world as does the UK

we will never be shot of guns , but we can change peoples minds easier
and stop them from ever picking one up or pulling the trigger






edit on 3-10-2017 by sapien82 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 11:36 AM
link   

originally posted by: JoshuaCox
a reply to: IlluminatiTechnician
1) We ban a bajillion things because of their ability for one idiot to cause mass devestation constantly.. if “they could just find another way” was a reasonable excuse then that would apply to everything. So no reason to restrict C4, they could just find another way.


Except they do find ways. They turn pressure cookers into bombs, they fly planes into buildings, they fill backpacks with home-made explosives and blow themselves up the London Underground, they drive large vehicles through crowds of people.

My objections to restricting C4 is nothing to do with the idea that people "will just find something else". My objection is on the basis that things should not be restricted. People, the actually individuals who cause harm or create unacceptable risk, should be dealt with on a case-by-case basis.


originally posted by: JoshuaCox
a reply to: IlluminatiTechnician
2) we let the military have toys that are far too cool for firearms to be a realistic deterrent. Also if we are doing it for that reason, we should definitely be allowed military grade weapons to combat them with.. which is talking about murdering us Troops and police offices FYI..


Technology moved further and faster than the philosophy behind it. That doesn't make the philosophy wrong. Even at the time of the founding fathers, many of the heaviest weapons of the day (cannon, for example) were owned by civilians. Events at Lexington and Concord were triggered by the British trying to find cannons that they had heard were hidden there.


originally posted by: JoshuaCox
a reply to: IlluminatiTechnician
3 ) the same as 1..


Except the millions of people who own firearms, including the thousands (tens of thousands?) of civilians who legally own fully automatic firearms, all without ever being a danger to anyone... rather underline the validity of the argument.

The people who pick up a piece of wood or a rock and beat someone else to death with it, or the bomb builders, or the people who drive trucks into crowds... also rather underline the validity of the argument.

People do things with tools. Tools do not make people do things. Why not treat people like people and criminals like criminals, instead of treating all people like criminals.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 11:40 AM
link   

originally posted by: vor78

originally posted by: Donkey_Dean
a reply to: JoshuaCox

Its a mute point man. You live in a country where a person anyone can have a parts kit delivered to their door with no checks whatsoever. You can get any machine gun you like in this way.


You can't assemble a functional firearm from those parts kits without also having a receiver. The receiver must be shipped to a dealer, which does require a background check.


You think you cant home build a receiver too? Over in Afghanistan we are fighting some of the poorest folks on the planet. They turnout high explosives starting with nothing more than plain ole compost and some of those hand built AK's have pushed hundreds of thousands of rounds at our guys over there. See if you can find a show called Gunsmith of Williamsburg. After knowing what people are capable of in the real world, ask yourself what change could really make a difference if any. Where there is a will there will always be a way. Hell, hit youtube and see a few of the thousands of videos showing how to assemble a parts kit or build a suppressor etc.. It may make you feel better to do something, but what effect will it have in the real world? Maybe we should expect this kind of thing from time to time and prepare a better defense of some kind. I don't know I just know you cant stop a man willing to give his own life in the pursuit of something without putting a bullet in his head.
edit on 3-10-2017 by Donkey_Dean because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 11:47 AM
link   
a reply to: JoshuaCox

Everyone's saying the crowd was most likely 99% republicans, seems like this is just a deflection from the real issue of the dems firing the real first shot at republicans.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 11:49 AM
link   
a reply to: Donkey_Dean

I'm sure they can, though I'm not sure of the legality of doing so. Regardless, it was just that you seemed to be implying that these parts kits contain everything needed for a functional rifle.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 11:55 AM
link   

originally posted by: vor78
a reply to: Donkey_Dean

I'm sure they can, though I'm not sure of the legality of doing so. Regardless, it was just that you seemed to be implying that these parts kits contain everything needed for a functional rifle.


The point was to say we are lucky we do not see this all the time, and to point out that a ban is 100% politically motivated and would only affect the legal gun owner. I think we all want to do something, but what if anything can really stop these maniacs? Maybe a crowd of 20K people should warrant some serious hardware be present etc.. The threat is real and present all of the time. Hell one highly trained individual with a scoped rifle could have ended this pretty quickly and sent a strong message to future attackers.
edit on 3-10-2017 by Donkey_Dean because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 12:00 PM
link   
a reply to: Donkey_Dean

In that case, I agree on both points. I don't think an AWB would do anything but hurt the law-abiding gun owners, either, and I certainly don't support it.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 12:22 PM
link   
a reply to: vor78

Umm...

Any half competent machinist can build a fully functional receiver, or any other part for that matter, in a matter of a few hours or days.

It may not look like much, but it'd do the job.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 12:37 PM
link   

originally posted by: Donkey_Dean

originally posted by: vor78
a reply to: Donkey_Dean

I'm sure they can, though I'm not sure of the legality of doing so. Regardless, it was just that you seemed to be implying that these parts kits contain everything needed for a functional rifle.


The point was to say we are lucky we do not see this all the time, and to point out that a ban is 100% politically motivated and would only affect the legal gun owner. I think we all want to do something, but what if anything can really stop these maniacs? Maybe a crowd of 20K people should warrant some serious hardware be present etc.. The threat is real and present all of the time. Hell one highly trained individual with a scoped rifle could have ended this pretty quickly and sent a strong message to future attackers.


The problem is right now it's all about plucking people's heartstrings for votes. The calls to do something, anything, as long as we can pat ourselves on the back are illogical. It makes no sense to just pass A law, if it would have no impact on these things. That's usually the kind of crap that gets proposed, and then they wonder why it always gets defeated. Propose something that would actually have some impact, and people may be more receptive. They're making calls to pass x or y already in response to this, and we don't even know the details yet. That makes one wonder about their motives.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 12:44 PM
link   
a reply to: seagull

I misunderstood his post to imply that the parts kits themselves contained everything needed for a functional rifle.

I'm aware that anyone with access to a machine shop could build the receiver or any missing parts. In fact, its one of the reasons I don't think an AWB will work.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 01:16 PM
link   
a reply to: vor78



I may have over reacted. Sorry.

I've seen the work that some people are capable of with a small forge and a collection of hammers and files, etc... Most any tool you can find at a hardware store--and it's impressive.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 01:18 PM
link   
a reply to: seagull

No need to apologize. No offense was taken.



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 02:24 PM
link   
a reply to: Donkey_Dean

If this was the first actual example of an attack bat an assault rifle made it worse???

Because I never said ban anything...



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 02:31 PM
link   
a reply to: WhyDidIJoin

I don’t know what you mean, but it’s a hard case to call politcally...

A 67 year old rich white guy with a hunting license and arsenal screams “right wing militia”, but the country music location hints left wing..

We will find out I’m sure, sooner or later....



posted on Oct, 3 2017 @ 02:36 PM
link   

originally posted by: JoshuaCox
a reply to: EvillerBob
What is the functional value of regular citizens owning assault rifles??



They allow you to kill a lot of people in a short amount of time, but a hand or shotgun works better for defense and hunting...

So kinda like with a bazooka. The only societal value they have is in entertainment.


Well Apparently its easy to create a home made bazooka rocket launcher. some high pressure pipe for the body. igniter for the rocket projectile to activate with a trigger pull. machining th e parts would be easy. obtaining the RTX for the warhead might be tricky though.



new topics

top topics



 
26
<< 15  16  17    19  20  21 >>

log in

join