Active Shooter Las Vegas, Mandalay Bay

a reply to: hillbilly4rent

100-200 round drums definite possibility.

originally posted by: hillbilly4rent

originally posted by: face23785

originally posted by: Cutepants
a reply to: hillbilly4rent

I think he could have done a lot of damage even with a semiautomatic one? If he pulled the trigger fast enough. I'm not a gun expert, so I might be wrong, but I used to shoot an assault rifle.

He absolutely could have. AR15s have relatively small amounts of kick, you can burn through a 30-round mag very fast. You could learn to change mags in under a second over the course of an afternoon.

Could haves are not facts do you know this guy and his physical abilities? Hell I shoot 3-4 times a week and can't change a mag in under a second and I'm almost half Stephen Paddock age.

How often do you practice changing mags as fast as possible? Most people don't. Spend an afternoon practicing and let me know how you do.

And for the last time, yes, I get the guy had automatic weapons. That doesn't change the fact you could have inflicted hundreds of casualties from that position with a semi-automatic weapon. I'm not challenging that he used automatic weapons. The facts he used autos but could have used semi-autos are not mutually exclusive.

originally posted by: Xcalibur254
a reply to: UKTruth

So if it turns out he's a member of the NRA you believe that organization should be thoroughly investigated?

Perhaps so, but perhaps we should investigate what's up with retired folks in their 60s! Wasn't the Scalice lone wolf shooting a 66 year old?

originally posted by: esteay812
a reply to: opethPA

Not speaking for onehuman, but the picture is kind of odd. Aside from the obvious guys standing out in the open on either side of the car, while the uniformed officers take cover, there is something else that could seem odd as well. Notice where the one officer is targeting his weapon. He is focusing on an area in the opposite direction of the shooter's gunfire/location.

Not that any of this means much, but it does make for an odd picture.

Not that odd. There are videos taken from the middle of the crowd, with people screaming and shots being fired, and there' are still guys wandering around calmly, or in some cases insisting it's just "fake gunshots" or "fireworks". Some people are also just oblivious to danger, not thinking that they could really be in a situation where they need to take cover.

As to the officer looking in the opposite direction? If they think they are coming under fire, it makes sense to have someone checking in all directions. If it's a coordinated attack then the first shots could be there to draw the police closer so that another shooter behind them can catch them off guard.

Or he's just confused about where the sound is coming from. Sound bounces, after all.

originally posted by: face23785

originally posted by: Jonjonj

originally posted by: onehuman
I haven't had a chance to read through the whole thread yet, been following other things at moment. I did want to post this though in case it hasn't been yet.

This came up pretty early on Twitter. It was from a series of photos that the BBC NEWS posted from the shooting. All the other pictures looked like what you would expect, but I found this one pretty curious. Kind of stuck out like a sore thumb really. I wasn't the only one to think that either. Thought I better save it just in case.

You should be able to find it by going back to BBC earlier reports. I didn't save the link at the time. It was probably around 8:30 maybe?

Anyhow, is there something really wrong with this picture or is it just me? I did resize it just so it would post here, but that's it.

The police are aiming the wrong way for a start. Or is the Mandalay in multiple buildings? I have no clue.

They don't appear to be aiming. Nothingburger.

The two cops at the back, one lying down, are looking down their weapons at something it seems.

a reply to: Bluesma

I am watching an interview with the "shooter" brother. He says that his brother didn't have religious, political, or club affiliation. He did not have a mental illness that he knows of, that he was just a normal guy, and his girlfriend was just a nice lady. Something just seems weird about this whole thing. Maybe the guy just snapped, maybe not. We'll probably never know.

I'm just waiting for all the false flag threads now.

Less than 24hours with zero facts yet except the guys and his partners age/name.

This is going to be fun.

Witness on fox right now is amazing.

He is discussing how many people were ex military or law enforcement there. They were jumping in front of people and covering them, instructing people how to stay low and move for cover during the killers reloading.

Who knows how many lives these heroes saved.

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: Jonjonj

What concerns me most in this shot is those unarmed, unarmoured citizens standing near the cop car. No matter which way the fire was coming from, none of them were being protected in the least.

I don't think the police could practically do anything other than shout "take cover" or something though, in this situation, it must have been absolute chaos.

Did you notice the horned hand sign in the background on the left? Just makes the image weirder.

originally posted by: MuonToGluon
I'm just waiting for all the false flag threads now.

Less than 24hours with zero facts yet except the guys and his partners age/name.

This is going to be fun.

Depends on the type and expedience of the fallout.

Never let a tragedy go to waste.

originally posted by: Grambler

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin

originally posted by: face23785

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin

originally posted by: face23785

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
well this is a depressing statistic.

According to the Gun Violence Watch this is the 273rd mass shooting in Vegas alone this year, a mass shooting being defined as four or more people being killed in the same location.

If that does not scream that there is a bit of a problem with gun violence in America I don't now what will.

That number doesn't sound right. Not saying you're lying, but I think there may be some confusion. Got a link?

sorry I double checked 273rd in the States this year not just Vegas my bad!

It would be nice if they noted how many are gang violence committed by career criminals with illegally possessed weapons, for context. But who wants that?

Link

The list loads of stats around gun violence, its interesting reading.

Perhaps you ought to get your facts straight.

You first claimed most mass shootings in the US were from young white men, now you are posting stats discussing gang violence having so many mass shootings, which would not be mostly young white men as you claimed earlier.

Perhaps avoid the gun baiting rhetoric that mods as mods asked, as it is making you seem irrational and like you are pushing an agenda.

oh for god sake!!!

Right.

I was posting to a member who was trying to make the claim with zero proof that this was a Muslim attack.

I pointed out that in general most high profile mass shootings like this come from young white men.

Much later in the thread I found a interesting website that collects stats on gun violence in America that I figured could be of interest and posted a link to it.

I missed the warning from the mods, my apologies that I do not spend every minute of my day checking in on what I can and cannot post on ATS.

Sorry but it really annoys me when people twist what others have posted out of context, I did make a error in reporting the stats which I immediately corrected, yet you jump in with the " get your facts straight line"

Honestly sometimes when I start posting on ATS I get the feeling that there are vultures circling who are just waiting attack soon as they see a opening.

I find the concept of 2 shooting platforms for 1 shooter to be a bit questionable.

Hopefully we get more(and better) info as this gets pieced together.

originally posted by: JAGStorm
a reply to: Bluesma

I am watching an interview with the "shooter" brother. He says that his brother didn't have religious, political, or club affiliation. He did not have a mental illness that he knows of, that he was just a normal guy, and his girlfriend was just a nice lady. Something just seems weird about this whole thing. Maybe the guy just snapped, maybe not. We'll probably never know.

I think one thing is obvious this guy didn't just "snap" far too much planning and preparations went into this heinous act. Premeditated obviously, though motive is unclear.

imo

originally posted by: JAGStorm
a reply to: Bluesma

I am watching an interview with the "shooter" brother. He says that his brother didn't have religious, political, or club affiliation. He did not have a mental illness that he knows of, that he was just a normal guy, and his girlfriend was just a nice lady. Something just seems weird about this whole thing. Maybe the guy just snapped, maybe not. We'll probably never know.

I don't know much about the whole Manchurian Candidate thing but if there ever was a case for it, it sounds like this guy's the dude.

Now ISIL is reporting he became a Muslim a few months ago. Will be interesting to find out if that's true or not.

Edit to add: Vegas is saying no there is NO reason to believe he's associated with ISIL but...

Poor America...

originally posted by: Jonjonj

originally posted by: face23785

originally posted by: Jonjonj

originally posted by: onehuman
I haven't had a chance to read through the whole thread yet, been following other things at moment. I did want to post this though in case it hasn't been yet.

This came up pretty early on Twitter. It was from a series of photos that the BBC NEWS posted from the shooting. All the other pictures looked like what you would expect, but I found this one pretty curious. Kind of stuck out like a sore thumb really. I wasn't the only one to think that either. Thought I better save it just in case.

You should be able to find it by going back to BBC earlier reports. I didn't save the link at the time. It was probably around 8:30 maybe?

Anyhow, is there something really wrong with this picture or is it just me? I did resize it just so it would post here, but that's it.

The police are aiming the wrong way for a start. Or is the Mandalay in multiple buildings? I have no clue.

They don't appear to be aiming. Nothingburger.

The two cops at the back, one lying down, are looking down their weapons at something it seems.

The one laying down definitely isn't aiming, his weapon is too low. He's just laying down and holding his weapon. Your weapon is always pointing in some general direction, that doesn't mean you're aiming.

The one on the far left I can't really tell what he's doing without seeing a bigger pic.

Either way, nothing unusual in the pic except for the dummies standing out in the open checking their phones.

originally posted by: Grambler
Witness on fox right now is amazing.

He is discussing how many people were ex military or law enforcement there. They were jumping in front of people and covering them, instructing people how to stay low and move for cover during the killers reloading.

Who knows how many lives these heroes saved.

Yeah see, I only played a few quick clips, but what I saw as soon as it started it didnt look like hardly anyone was trying to get away but instead were standing their ground trying to help the fallen. If anything.

originally posted by: hillbilly4rent

originally posted by: face23785

originally posted by: Cutepants
a reply to: hillbilly4rent

I think he could have done a lot of damage even with a semiautomatic one? If he pulled the trigger fast enough. I'm not a gun expert, so I might be wrong, but I used to shoot an assault rifle.

He absolutely could have. AR15s have relatively small amounts of kick, you can burn through a 30-round mag very fast. You could learn to change mags in under a second over the course of an afternoon.

Could haves are not facts do you know this guy and his physical abilities? Hell I shoot 3-4 times a week and can't change a mag in under a second and I'm almost half Stephen Paddock age.

Not to mention that (according to someone who timed it) there's roughly 15 seconds between extended strings of fire. That is one of the things that suggest a belt-fed or drum-fed firearm.

There are semi-auto versions of belt/drum guns so it doesn't mean that it was definitely a full-auto.

originally posted by: MisterSpock
I find the concept of 2 shooting platforms for 1 shooter to be a bit questionable.

Hopefully we get more(and better) info as this gets pieced together.

Why would it be questionable? Obviously this was well-planned. At some point he figured out that after he shot a certain direction for long enough people would flee so he would have to fire a different direction.

Ever go on a rampage in GTA? How often do you only shoot in 1 direction?

originally posted by: Xcathdra

originally posted by: Simon_Boudreaux

originally posted by: Xcathdra

originally posted by: hutch622
a reply to: JinMI

Question . Would it be easy to get ten guns into a hotel in vegas , and , if spotted why no questions raised .

Yes - put them into a large bag and take them in. Bags are not checked and there are no metal detectors.

Being there was a concert in town it wouldn't be hard to get it all past everyone if it's in cases that look like music equipment. The duel shooting platforms still confused me. Would it be normal for one shooter to do this?

To be honest it depends on weapons and the persons background. There are no balconies for the hotel he was in so he had to shoot the window out. Chances are he had a table or something else close to the window to use as support. It is also possible he used a sniper technique which is to set up the room in a way where you can see and shoot from a point away from the window, concealing muzzle flashes, messing with reports in addition to making it harder for people on the outside to locate you.

those are just guesses though.

He fired so much that the smoke detector went off, that's how they knew what room he was in.

That's what they said, anyway.

Makes sense it would go off.

Stephen Paddock at an Anti-Trump Protest?