It takes a big pair to make the claim of atheism.

originally posted by: Lurker1

originally posted by: TJames

originally posted by: Lurker1
All I'm saying is I've seen enough for me to accept something more advanced than me is likely responsible for my reality.

What have you seen to convince you that there is something more advanced responsible for your reality?

ETA
I've seen nothing, I don't believe in ghosts, goblins, dragons, gods, creators, souls, or anything which is unverifiable.

With respect, I prefer not to say. This was a very personal experience for me.

Fair one, but I guess you can understand why people such as myself who have experienced nothing to draw them towards believing in gods are sceptical.

originally posted by: TJames

originally posted by: Lurker1

originally posted by: TJames

originally posted by: Lurker1
All I'm saying is I've seen enough for me to accept something more advanced than me is likely responsible for my reality.

What have you seen to convince you that there is something more advanced responsible for your reality?

ETA
I've seen nothing, I don't believe in ghosts, goblins, dragons, gods, creators, souls, or anything which is unverifiable.

With respect, I prefer not to say. This was a very personal experience for me.

Fair one, but I guess you can understand why people such as myself who have experienced nothing to draw them towards believing in gods are sceptical.

Absolutely. I was a hard-line atheist for about 30 years. I know exactly how you feel.

originally posted by: Lurker1

originally posted by: TJames

originally posted by: Lurker1

originally posted by: TJames

originally posted by: Lurker1
All I'm saying is I've seen enough for me to accept something more advanced than me is likely responsible for my reality.

What have you seen to convince you that there is something more advanced responsible for your reality?

ETA
I've seen nothing, I don't believe in ghosts, goblins, dragons, gods, creators, souls, or anything which is unverifiable.

With respect, I prefer not to say. This was a very personal experience for me.

Fair one, but I guess you can understand why people such as myself who have experienced nothing to draw them towards believing in gods are sceptical.

Absolutely. I was a hard-line atheist for about 30 years. I know exactly how you feel.

I'm not even hard-line though, I keep a totally open mind which is willing to change if any decent evidence crosses my path. I've never said 'gods do not exist' just that I've seen nothing ever to draw me towards believing they do.
I'm curious though, how do you square the circle of conflicting religious claims? Say Abrahamic compared to Hinduism or Sikhism? They can't all be true.

originally posted by: TJames

originally posted by: Lurker1

originally posted by: TJames

originally posted by: Lurker1

originally posted by: TJames

originally posted by: Lurker1
All I'm saying is I've seen enough for me to accept something more advanced than me is likely responsible for my reality.

What have you seen to convince you that there is something more advanced responsible for your reality?

ETA
I've seen nothing, I don't believe in ghosts, goblins, dragons, gods, creators, souls, or anything which is unverifiable.

With respect, I prefer not to say. This was a very personal experience for me.

Fair one, but I guess you can understand why people such as myself who have experienced nothing to draw them towards believing in gods are sceptical.

Absolutely. I was a hard-line atheist for about 30 years. I know exactly how you feel.

I'm not even hard-line though, I keep a totally open mind which is willing to change if any decent evidence crosses my path. I've never said 'gods do not exist' just that I've seen nothing ever to draw me towards believing they do.
I'm curious though, how do you square the circle of conflicting religious claims? Say Abrahamic compared to Hinduism or Sikhism? They can't all be true.

In my view, the major religions, and the minor, are irrelevant. They're constructs of men, not gods.

ETA, remember Clarke's quote. I think we're probably dealing with a highly advanced technology.

originally posted by: Lurker1
I think we're probably dealing with a highly advanced technology.

Wouldn't surprise me at all, but equally, if there is nothing scooby-doo-ish in our universe like souls, gods, ghosts etc, I wouldn't be surprised.
I've seen nothing ever to draw me towards believing in such things though.

Absolutely. I was a hard-line atheist for about 30 years. I know exactly how you feel.

I'm not even hard-line though, I keep a totally open mind which is willing to change if any decent evidence crosses my path. I've never said 'gods do not exist' just that I've seen nothing ever to draw me towards believing they do.
I'm curious though, how do you square the circle of conflicting religious claims? Say Abrahamic compared to Hinduism or Sikhism? They can't all be true.

That's because God comes near to you when you come near to God. You're probably not doing it right.

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance

Absolutely. I was a hard-line atheist for about 30 years. I know exactly how you feel.

I'm not even hard-line though, I keep a totally open mind which is willing to change if any decent evidence crosses my path. I've never said 'gods do not exist' just that I've seen nothing ever to draw me towards believing they do.
I'm curious though, how do you square the circle of conflicting religious claims? Say Abrahamic compared to Hinduism or Sikhism? They can't all be true.

That's because God comes near to you when you come near to God. You're probably not doing it right.

Doing what right? Being a questioning intelligent human being? Pretty crap god if it gives me a questioning mind yet provides zero evidence to support claims of its existence. Why would anyone believe claims that are unverifiable?

originally posted by: TJames

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance

Absolutely. I was a hard-line atheist for about 30 years. I know exactly how you feel.

I'm not even hard-line though, I keep a totally open mind which is willing to change if any decent evidence crosses my path. I've never said 'gods do not exist' just that I've seen nothing ever to draw me towards believing they do.
I'm curious though, how do you square the circle of conflicting religious claims? Say Abrahamic compared to Hinduism or Sikhism? They can't all be true.

That's because God comes near to you when you come near to God. You're probably not doing it right.

Doing what right? Being a questioning intelligent human being? Pretty crap god if it gives me a questioning mind yet provides zero evidence to support claims of its existence. Why would anyone believe claims that are unverifiable?

You only take second hand info for truth don't you. That's not so smart. You need to find subjective evidence, fast.

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance

originally posted by: TJames

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance

Absolutely. I was a hard-line atheist for about 30 years. I know exactly how you feel.

I'm not even hard-line though, I keep a totally open mind which is willing to change if any decent evidence crosses my path. I've never said 'gods do not exist' just that I've seen nothing ever to draw me towards believing they do.
I'm curious though, how do you square the circle of conflicting religious claims? Say Abrahamic compared to Hinduism or Sikhism? They can't all be true.

That's because God comes near to you when you come near to God. You're probably not doing it right.

Doing what right? Being a questioning intelligent human being? Pretty crap god if it gives me a questioning mind yet provides zero evidence to support claims of its existence. Why would anyone believe claims that are unverifiable?

You only take second hand info for truth don't you. That's not so smart. You need to find subjective evidence, fast.

I'm easy with my evidence, but say I saw a Jesus type figure walking on water or something I'd want a mate to witness it as well to be assured I wasn't tripping or losing my mind.
What 'evidence' have you experienced?

originally posted by: TJames

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance

originally posted by: TJames

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance

Absolutely. I was a hard-line atheist for about 30 years. I know exactly how you feel.

I'm not even hard-line though, I keep a totally open mind which is willing to change if any decent evidence crosses my path. I've never said 'gods do not exist' just that I've seen nothing ever to draw me towards believing they do.
I'm curious though, how do you square the circle of conflicting religious claims? Say Abrahamic compared to Hinduism or Sikhism? They can't all be true.

That's because God comes near to you when you come near to God. You're probably not doing it right.

Doing what right? Being a questioning intelligent human being? Pretty crap god if it gives me a questioning mind yet provides zero evidence to support claims of its existence. Why would anyone believe claims that are unverifiable?

You only take second hand info for truth don't you. That's not so smart. You need to find subjective evidence, fast.

I'm easy with my evidence, but say I saw a Jesus type figure walking on water or something I'd want a mate to witness it as well to be assured I wasn't tripping or losing my mind.
What 'evidence' have you experienced?

I'm not a wizard you know. Ask God.

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance
I'm not a wizard you know. Ask God.

So you got nothing then?
Got a number for your god I can send a text? Which god anyway? Many to choose from, Eros seems nicer than the old testament monster.

originally posted by: TJames

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance
I'm not a wizard you know. Ask God.

So you got nothing then?
Got a number for your god I can send a text? Which god anyway? Many to choose from, Eros seems nicer than the old testament monster.

You make me look good on this forum.

TJames,

You mentioned Scooby-Doo. That was funny. I watched that as a kid in the 70's.

My experience was not funny though. It was very profound and deeply frightening.

It left me thinking we are closely observed, but not by a benevolent entity. Indifferent at the most and, in my view, highly sadistic.

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance

originally posted by: TJames

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance
I'm not a wizard you know. Ask God.

So you got nothing then?
Got a number for your god I can send a text? Which god anyway? Many to choose from, Eros seems nicer than the old testament monster.

You make me look good on this forum.

I'm unsure what on-topic opinion you are attempting to share here?
How do you communicate with the god/s you apparently believe in? Which god is your gig? I repeat, Eros would be my cup of tea if I believed in such things. Which one is yours?

originally posted by: Lurker1
TJames,

You mentioned Scooby-Doo. That was funny. I watched that as a kid in the 70's.

My experience was not funny though. It was very profound and deeply frightening.

It left me thinking we are closely observed, but not by a benevolent entity. Indifferent at the most and, in my view, highly sadistic.

Again I'll say I wouldn't be surprised, and I keep an open mind to anything. For sure if the old testament god was real it seems a right scary horrible controlling bastard.

a reply to: TJames

Regarding religious texts, I don't doubt that they contain some element of truth. I think they're highly stylized accounts of things that were inexplicable to people during the times they were written.

At this point in time, I don't think they even vaguely resemble the original texts. Too much time has elapsed.

When someone tells you that you don't understand a text unless it's explained to you by "an expert", you know it's bulls**t.

The same is true in the art world. I don't need a PhD to tell me that modern art is crap.

a reply to: Lurker1

I like some modern art, and I've seen nothing ever that makes me think any religious texts are true.

originally posted by: TJames
a reply to: Lurker1

I like some modern art, and I've seen nothing ever that makes me think any religious texts are true.

The only thing I respect about organized religion is the Buddhist belief that moderation is key and, I suppose, some of the Ten Commandments.

The thing about both though is they aren't necessarily religious. They're a product of countless centuries of human experience.

No gods need apply.

originally posted by: Out6of9Balance
That's because God comes near to you when you come near to God. You're probably not doing it right.

How do you explain people that were doing it right, but are now atheists?

I did not become an atheist lightly, or overnight.

In fact I practically begged the Lord for a sign at one point, because all other proofs of his existence fell short. There is an assumption (not saying you're making it) sometimes that atheists must have a grudge against God, or that they never truly sought the Lord. Treated like they must not have really had their hear in it. We always hear how God reveals himself to those who seek to find him. I am here to tell you from experience, that is not true.

I love the stories about atheists crying out for a sign, only to have some seemingly miraculous sign from God or even an experience with God. They are hailed has as examples of a loving God. Yet people like me, who were part of the flock, who truly honestly believed in his majesty, get nothing when we cry out to the same God. Instead of it being evidence to suggest their God doesn't exist, it is evidence that we never really tried to know God.

Please....

Maybe it takes a pair to claim atheism. I can put my money where my mouth is.

originally posted by: TJames
Same here, I was born without any knowledge of 'faith' then taught by my parents to believe in the Christian god, grew up, started questioning things, then realised there was zero evidence to support claims of gods. It's why it's called faith, there's nothing to support the belief aside from imagined assertions.

I agree, mostly. The part I am not sure about is that there is nothing but imagined belief to support it. As far as specific religious narrations go, sure. But I think, there is "something".. whatever that even means.. lol

I don't think there is a God or such behind it.. But I can't deny that my mother has an interesting track record with what she feels God tells her. Actually, it isn't even that. It would be more apt to say, how she feels God is guiding her. Nothing fantastical. Typical stuff. You know, contemplating a big move.. pray about it. If it feels right, go for it. If not...

And the times she ignores the 'doesn't feel right' it never ends well.

Like I said, I don't believe a God is behind that, or even anything supernatural. I kind of feel my mom's faith tunes her intuition..

Just my two cents.



eta:

Oh and this would be supportive evidence, in a subjective way. At least to the practitioner!