Its official: China's J-20 is officially in active military service

a reply to: mbkennel

It's optimized for an attack aircraft, I thought, since it lacks agility and thrust to weight,as an air superiority design.

a reply to: Zaphod58

Helps define the role if we know what it can do.

The F-22s were reported to be aerial scouts in Syria recently.

This sounds similar to the sensor/shooter combo you mentioned for the J-20.

a reply to: cavtrooper7

I would be cautious about declaring its role. The eurofighter, rafale, su-35, etc all have worse thrust to weight ratios. While none are fifth gen, the sample size for fifth gen is rather small as yet.

J20 story
Story from the mail today showing 4 of the J20's in flight.

What would happen with stealth fighter vs stealth fighter? Say F-22 vs F-35 vs J-20?

Assuming they wouldn't see each other on radar until close it might come down to WVR dogfighting with short range IR missiles and HMS. The mk1 eyeball might be the primary sensor like days past...

a reply to: JimTSpock
I seriously doubt the RCS of the J-20 is low enough to get into visual range before its detected by an US 5th Gen Jet even if the J-20 would (miraculously) knows exactly where those stealth aircraft are.

All things being equal, two stealth jets are more likely to just miss each other than anything else.

If you have an artifical setup of two F-22s in a 50x50nm box or something, it comes down to who gets whom first on an unfavorable angle. F-35s have an IRST capability, they probably detect each other (in this artifical box) at the same time and presumably before they detect each other on radar.

originally posted by: Woody510
J20 story
Story from the mail today showing 4 of the J20's in flight.

I have a feeling 4 is all they have
and they won't be able to keep 4 flying .

a reply to: UnderKingsPeak

There have been 8 different flight test aircraft identified, and as many as 12 production aircraft identified so far.

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: UnderKingsPeak

There have been 8 different flight test aircraft identified, and as many as 12 production aircraft identified so far.

That's about 8 more than I'm comfortable with

a reply to: UnderKingsPeak

I think a lot of people really underestimate China.

a reply to: mightmight

True the J-20 and Su-57 would probably have a bigger RCS than the F-22 and F-35, so would be at a disadvantage. The F-35s advanced DAS system might give it the edge and the F-22 has no IRST at this point, then there is the question of how radar guided missiles would perform against stealth such as the AIM-120, they may be ineffective leaving shorter range IR missiles like the AIM-9X and R-73 as the only effective option.
At this point in stealth vs stealth I'd say the F-35 would have the edge with it's advanced DAS system to get first look first shot. One thing is certain detection and engagement ranges will be much less with stealth vs stealth, certainly throws up a lot of questions.

originally posted by: JimTSpock
a reply to: mightmight

then there is the question of how radar guided missiles would perform against stealth such as the AIM-120, they may be ineffective leaving shorter range IR missiles like the AIM-9X and R-73 as the only effective option.

shouldnt be an issue, the aircraft (doesnt even have to be the launching aircraft) can guide the AAM to its target without it never going active

At this point in stealth vs stealth I'd say the F-35 would have the edge with it's advanced DAS system to get first look first shot.

DAS, EOTS and AN/ASQ-239, yes. Its all about sensors once you get your RCS down to a certain point.