I'd Guess maybe 5 Percent of those who watch the NFL stand for the Anthem. The hypocrisy is HUGE

a reply to: soberbacchus

I could care less if this 91 year old vet knelt in solidarity with the NFL players, because the vast majority of vets, active servicemen and women are outraged that people are disrespecting our flag. This entire thread is based on a false premise. Like someone already stated (even though no one seems to care) the The US Flag Code stipulates:

§171. Conduct during playing:

During rendition of the national anthem when the flag is displayed, all present except those in uniform should stand at attention facing the flag with the right hand over the heart. Men not in uniform should remove their headdress with their right hand and hold it at the left shoulder, the hand being over the heart. Persons in uniform should render the military salute at the first note of the anthem and retain this position until the last note. When the flag is not displayed, those present should face toward the music and act in the same manner they would if the flag were displayed there.

You stand for the national anthem at a public event, when the flag, or the national anthem is displayed IN YOUR PRESENCE. My late father was a retired Lieutenant in the USAF and I remembered asking him as a kid, about standing at home if the anthem was played on TV or the radio. I choose to stand at an event, when the national anthem is played because the flag is a symbol for our country. I respect my country, because I respect the vets and active servicemen and women who made sacrifices FOR MY FREEDOM AND RIGHTS. I'm all for non-violent protesting, which is your right, but not at the cost of disrespecting our flag. These athletes are the privledged few, who are paid millions to play a game. I would dare say, that there are not many other countries that pay professional athletes as much, nor give them the freedoms and rights that they have IN AMERICA. Does America have problems? Hell yeah, but that doesn't mean you disrespect your flag and country. If you're a Catholic or Christian, would you disrespect the Crucifix in any way? Have you heard of an incident where Catholics at church chose not to kneel during mass, because they're upset about something that the church did? The NFL and their players, by kneeling during our national anthem, are NOT bringing people together, they're making people angry. Whatever happened to self restraint, courtesy and respecting other people's feelings?

originally posted by: ColoradoJens
This manufactured outrage is so sad, it exposes so much hypocrisy.

The majority of people watch the game on TV. How many of you who are so outraged stand, take off your hat, and put your hand over your heart in your living room when it is played? I'd say a small minority.

If the anthem is not played on TV, are you outraged and feel the need to contact the TV networks? Are you angry when the anthem is not played at a concert or a play? Is your outrage selective like that?

I've been around a lot of football fans, both sides of the political spectrum and in 25 years have never once seen someone stand unless they are at the game. And at the game you'll notice a lot of empty seats as fans use the time to get beer and food and go to the bathroom.

Bars? Never. Even for the Super Bowl - usually people say like "Come ON! Get on with it! This is too taking too long!"

People really do like the war planes that fly over, and they love the Navy parachute guys, I'll say that.

But seriously, have you been doing your civic duty and been standing for the anthem, say when you are out shopping and the game is on tv at best buy? Do you report the employees that keep selling TV's during the Anthem? Why not? SHouldn't they be fired for ignoring it?

Do you stand in your home? If no, you need to look in a mirror and ask why you are such a blatant liar with your feelings. That is unless you never thought about it before, which I would surmise comprises 90% of you or more.

Such a weak argument and I am sick of hearing it. The anthem was intended for GROUPS of countrymen in one setting...not as a personal thing. Biggest load of bollacks I ever heard...and keep hearing. To kneel in a group setting is a big f*** Off to every fellow countryman in the group. And to say that those that don't stand at home when they are alone is an excuse.

originally posted by: Deaf Alien
a reply to: Teikiatsu

These players are acting like a bunch of ignorant petulant brats who need to man up and act professional.

That's the gist of it isn't it? To us people who moan and cry about them are the ones who are being brats and need to man up. And we don't see them as being ignorant and being childish. We see them speaking out against injustice and we understand the point. And it worked too well.

Then you see what *you* want to see and hear what *you* want to hear, not what is the truth.

There is no systemic racism. There is no institutionalized racism. There is no runaway injustice. There *is* a false narrative of rampant injustice and bloodthirsty police and that is being reinforced by a sensationalized and sympathetic media.

originally posted by: shawmanfromny
I could care less if this 91 year old vet knelt in solidarity with the NFL players, because the vast majority of vets, active servicemen and women are outraged that people are disrespecting our flag.

Do you have the data that supports this? I'd actually be really interested in seeing just how divided veterans and active duty military are or are not in comparison to everyone else.

originally posted by: 3NL1GHT3N3D1
a reply to: Teikiatsu

So people aren't calling for these players to be punished for exercising their God given rights? Be mad at them all you want but when you start calling for them to be punished that is when I take issue with it.

Make no mistake I think that the NFL should reprimand these people, but they don't need to be fire. Unfortunately the NFL has been enabling them. The parent corporation has been inconsistent with how they penalize the activities of their employees* because they think that the general populace agrees with the ignorant players.

*Headphones and sports gear from competitors = bad! Honoring police = Bad! Remembering 9/11 = BAD!! Disrespecting the nation and military, well... okay....

a reply to: Teikiatsu

There is no systemic racism. There is no institutionalized racism. There is no runaway injustice. There *is* a false narrative of rampant injustice and bloodthirsty police and that is being reinforced by a sensationalized and sympathetic media.

Sure you're not the one who is buying into the false narrative?
BTW I don't think anyone really believes what you said. We're just talking about some racist cops.

a reply to: FraggleRock

DATA? There are COUNTLESS of articles online, including clips on YouTube, made by vets, servicemen and women. When you check these articles out, read the comments, or check all the thumbs up clicked for the video clips on YouTube. The outrage is VERY real, but I guess you wouldn't notice these articles much if you're reading, or watching Liberal news sources.

a reply to: shawmanfromny

So no actual data then. I was simply curious since you made such a bold claim. I thought maybe you had something more concrete than upvotes and comments on comment sections on social media sites.

Though I have seen a select few on either side of the issue. As well, I have family and friends who are veterans and/or active duty and they all support the rights of those who kneel. But my anecdotal evidence is hardly representative of the whole. Which is why I was so curious to see a better representation for how those who have served and/or are currently serving feel about this issue.

a reply to: Teikiatsu

Some people in other countries see the American flag as a sign of war and oppression.

My point is the flag can mean different things to different people, who is anyone to tell someone else what they should believe something represents?

Just because some dude a few hundred years ago said the flag represents "this" does not mean that everyone believes the same or should. If you want to dictate to others what they should believe then that makes you a dictator. Do you want to be seen as a dictator?

America: where free speech is fine until you disagree with it.

a reply to: FraggleRock

"A select few" yeah, whatever you say. I'll stand on the side that supports and respects our flag, country, vets and servicemen and women. You can do whatever and believe whatever you want. Just remember, for every person who supports the rights of those who kneel, there are those who are offended. This whole protest act involving the disrespect of our flag and national anthem has divided our country. It isn't uniting our nation to make it better...it's tearing people apart. Once again, believe and do what you want...makes absolutely no difference to me.

a reply to: fencesitter85

It's not about free speech...it's about respecting your country, vets and servicemen and women.

a reply to: shawmanfromny

Actually, it is about free speech and it has nothing to do with vets or servicemen.

But see Texas vs. Johnson if you really want to get pissed off about free speech.

originally posted by: shawmanfromny
a reply to: fencesitter85

It's not about free speech...it's about respecting your country, vets and servicemen and women.

that's why the kneeling, to show that respect.

since you're big on collecting anecdotal evidence, my active servicemember husband is fine with it. as the spouse of an active servicemember, i support it.

originally posted by: soberbacchus

originally posted by: ThirdEyeofHorus

originally posted by: soberbacchus

originally posted by: ThirdEyeofHorus
We will see if the OP also believes the fans should show solidarity with the players.

Wouldn't that depend on the particular Fans?

Asking fans to kneel or lock arms or anything else is the same as asking people to stand and cover their hearts.

Let people do as they do. No mandated, fake patriotism. To each their own.
That is the American way.

No it is NOT the same as one is a national tradition of respect and the other is based on an SJW expectation of protest against said tradition.

Hmmm...

So you would DEMAND that everyone stand with hand over heart during the anthem?

Have you ever seen parades in North Korea?

Not interested.

Political Protesting is as American as Apple Pie..Hell, it's how America was born.

Eff anyone that DEMANDS displays of blind allegiance.

That was Hitler's gig..That is North Korea's thing..

Here is a pic for you..

91 Year old WW2 vet Kneeling in Solidarity with the Players.

. Nope I never said that. A bit of hysteria and hyperbole from the Left Wing coming from you though. I'm just pointing out the difference between a tradition and some SJW activism.

originally posted by: ThirdEyeofHorus
Nope I never said that. A bit of hysteria and hyperbole from the Left Wing coming from you though. I'm just pointing out the difference between a tradition and some SJW activism.

you know what else used to be tradition?

segregation

originally posted by: fiverx313

originally posted by: ThirdEyeofHorus
Nope I never said that. A bit of hysteria and hyperbole from the Left Wing coming from you though. I'm just pointing out the difference between a tradition and some SJW activism.

you know what else used to be tradition?

segregation

Actually, it was the law.

In Alabama.

Where Trump gave his speech.


Coincidence?

originally posted by: Phage
Coincidence?

careful, you're gonna get this moved to the conspiracy forum

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: soberbacchus

Core authoritarians come out in droves for a good Flag sermon. Like flies on fecal material.

Liberal Fascism by Jonah Goldberg explains pretty much what's going on.

originally posted by: fencesitter85
America: where free speech is fine until you disagree with it.

You do realize the concept of free speech must apply to all equally right?

That means the protesters are allowed to do their thing, and people are allowed to criticize, the Fed is not supposed to punish them for their speech though.