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e U.S. Department of Commerce has clobbered aerospace giant Bombardier with a hefty 220 per cent countervailing duty on the sale of its CS100 commercial jets to a U.S. airline following a trade complaint from an American rival.
originally posted by: smurfy
It is stupid, and probably a Trumpism this time round. In any case Boeing gets tax breaks, exports and use of government funded research in NASA or defence contracts.
Boeing just doesn't like the 50/50 exchange between them and Airbus, and that row has been going on for years, with nobody none the wiser..other than what is published. It doesn't look good for a UK/US trade deal either if all that happens is that the feud goes on, while Boeing does have companies in the UK for bye. It's probably debateable that Bombardier is gaining over Boeing with their aircraft at the end of the day anyway.
The UK isn't ditching Boeing defence kit any time soon
The British government is publicly threatening to stop giving defence contracts to American aerospace firm Boeing – even though this is laughably unrealistic.
originally posted by: Woody510
Isn't a 747 actually quite economical when you take into account the weight it can transport?
originally posted by: Woody510
a reply to: F4guy
Isn't a 747 actually quite economical when you take into account the weight it can transport?
originally posted by: F4guyIt's a beast, but a fast beast with a .85-.86 Mach. If you don't mind using all the fuel at your departure point. We figure about 5 gallons/mile, or a gallon every second (3600 gallons/hour.) I'm really glad I don't have to pay for the fuel. A fill up can cost $200,000 in the US. Don't ask about Europe.
originally posted by: F4guy
e U.S. Department of Commerce has clobbered aerospace giant Bombardier with a hefty 220 per cent countervailing duty on the sale of its CS100 commercial jets to a U.S. airline following a trade complaint from an American rival.
Boeing has filed the papers resulting in the unprecedented and arguably punitive duty. They contend that Bombardier is selling Delta 125 CS100 airliners at below market price. Boeing is ignoring the fact that such deals are common between aircraft builders and "roll-out" customers, which is a term used when an airline signs up to be the first to use a new aircraft. Boeing also ignored the fact that no American manufacturer builds a competing aircraft in the 100-110 seat class. Boeing quit building its "babyjet" 717 10 years ago.
The Trump administration Department of Commerce is in violation of a 1980 trade agreement (1980 WTO Agreement on Trade in Civil Aircraft). The DoC action may turn out to be extremely shortsighted since aircraft are the number 3 US export, with $135 Billion in exports last year. Other countries can be expected to retaliate with new tariff impositions on US aircraft. And if the airlines' capital costs increase, who do you think ends up footing that bill? Passenger and freight ticket costs will rise. And since these short-haul narrowbody jets are used on routes serving smaller markets, these tickets are already high, particularly since the end of the Essential Air Service Subsidy Program.
Source: www.cbc.ca...
Boeing has filed a complaint with the International Trade Commission charging Canada’s Bombardier with “dumping” its C Series narrowbody airliner at below cost into the U.S. The charges stem from the 2016 sale of 75 CS100s to Delta Air Lines. In its complaint, the U.S. company claims Bombardier sold the airplanes for $19.6 million each, or some $13.8 million less than they cost to manufacture.
“Bombardier has embarked on an aggressive campaign to sell C Series aircraft into the U.S. market at absurdly low prices—less than $20 million for airplanes that cost $33 million to produce, based on publicly available information,” said Boeing in a statement. “Notably, it is selling the aircraft into the United States at prices that are millions lower than those charged in Canada—the very definition of dumping.”
Boeing had offered Delta the 737 Max 7, a re-engined derivate of the 737-700 that competes directly with the C Series. The U.S. company estimates that the C Series has received government support totaling more than $3 billion.
Delta’s order came six months after the province of Quebec agreed to infuse $1 billion in the financially strapped C Series program, giving it a 49.5-percent stake in a limited partnership with Bombardier. Less than a year later the Canadian federal government agreed to grant Bombardier C$372.5 million in interest-free loans for both the C Series and the Global 7000 business jet.
The CSeries starts at $79.5 million, according to list prices, but carriers usually receive discounts of about 50%.
originally posted by: F4guy
a reply to: Greven
Cost depends on the accounting. The first a
ircraft off the line to be sold are always going to be sold below cost. It cost Boeing $7 billion to get the first 777 out the door in 1995. The first 777 was sold for $258 million to United Airlines. That first aircraft was sold at a six and three quarter billion dollar loss, using Bombardier's method of accounting.
A much better accounting method computes the marginal unit cost. Although it cost 7 billion to get the first one to a customer, the second one doesn't cost another 7 billion. It costs whatever the cost is for the materials used and the labor to build it. Everything over that can go to pay back the development costs and for profit. United bought 128 777s for 22 billion, which means that the computedmarginal unit cost would be in the neighborhood of $118 million, or less than 50% of the price to United. So they could sell for half of normal market price and still be selling for more than unit cost to manufacture. I think Boeing is making a big mistake. And the stock market seems to agree. Its stock has steadily declined since its action. And it probably will lose a $5 billion sale of F18s to Canada.
originally posted by: F4guy
a reply to: Greven
Cost depends on the accounting. The first a
ircraft off the line to be sold are always going to be sold below cost. It cost Boeing $7 billion to get the first 777 out the door in 1995. The first 777 was sold for $258 million to United Airlines. That first aircraft was sold at a six and three quarter billion dollar loss, using Bombardier's method of accounting.
A much better accounting method computes the marginal unit cost. Although it cost 7 billion to get the first one to a customer, the second one doesn't cost another 7 billion. It costs whatever the cost is for the materials used and the labor to build it. Everything over that can go to pay back the development costs and for profit. United bought 128 777s for 22 billion, which means that the computedmarginal unit cost would be in the neighborhood of $118 million, or less than 50% of the price to United. So they could sell for half of normal market price and still be selling for more than unit cost to manufacture. I think Boeing is making a big mistake. And the stock market seems to agree. Its stock has steadily declined since its action. And it probably will lose a $5 billion sale of F18s to Canada.