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Illegal Immigration Is Costing This Country Billions; Taxpayers Getting Clobbered

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posted on Sep, 27 2017 @ 01:29 PM
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originally posted by: lordcomac
I'd be willing to do a lot more to enact change if it didn't mean going to prison- or being shot on the spot.

The founding fathers faced going to prison or being shot on the spot, so you are not even willing to do what they did.




posted on Sep, 27 2017 @ 01:29 PM
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originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: Bluntone22
a reply to: Krazysh0t


How does somebody without a social security number pay federal taxes?
I don't have a tax form in front of me but I'm pretty sure there is a spot for your ssn on the front page.
What do employers put in that box?
Color me confused

So you've never heard of a fake id before?



I have a hard time believing they will break this law and that law but by god they pay their taxes...lol



posted on Sep, 27 2017 @ 01:29 PM
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a reply to: avgguy

No one has proved that if they are doing anything of the sort it is in some concerted effort or in en mass. You are welcome to prove that all wrong though with a valid source other than your suspicions.



posted on Sep, 27 2017 @ 01:32 PM
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a reply to: Bluntone22

Many employers require a social security number to be hired. Even construction jobs. They may not have the best HR practices in following up beyond that, but if these people are willing to violate immigration law to better their economic options, getting a fake id manufactured to finish that dream off (probably by the same people who helped them cross the border too) wouldn't be that much more of a stretch.

Though the numbers are the numbers. You can disbelieve they do it, but there it is. These numbers are several years old too. So its not like this is brand new to the conversation or anything.



posted on Sep, 27 2017 @ 01:38 PM
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a reply to: Krazysh0t

6.5 billion estimate for the year 2000, not including Medicaid.

m.content.healthaffairs.org...



posted on Sep, 27 2017 @ 01:39 PM
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a reply to: Krazysh0t

My post was facetious, of course they're voting. The democrats said it on camera during the Veritas investigations.



posted on Sep, 27 2017 @ 01:44 PM
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a reply to: Krazysh0t

If their employers are requiring a ssn to withdrawal taxes then the only reason they would file with the government would be to get those taxes back in a return.



posted on Sep, 27 2017 @ 01:46 PM
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originally posted by: avgguy
a reply to: Krazysh0t

6.5 billion estimate for the year 2000, not including Medicaid.

m.content.healthaffairs.org...

I see you neglected some information:

Extrapolating to the nation, total spending by the undocumented is $6.4 billion, of which only 17 percent ($1.1 billion) is paid for by public sources



posted on Sep, 27 2017 @ 01:46 PM
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originally posted by: avgguy
a reply to: Krazysh0t

My post was facetious, of course they're voting. The democrats said it on camera during the Veritas investigations.

Ok. So you are lying. Gotcha.



posted on Sep, 27 2017 @ 01:47 PM
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a reply to: Bluntone22

That may be true for you or I, but it isn't true for them. For one, why are you assuming they understand our tax law? For two, filing a return puts them at risk of discovery by the IRS through audits. For three, why are you assuming they aren't just doing to not rock the boat?



posted on Sep, 27 2017 @ 01:51 PM
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a reply to: Krazysh0t

They had help getting here, they had help getting fake IDs, they had help finding jobs,
Yeah, they had help filing taxes.



posted on Sep, 27 2017 @ 01:57 PM
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a reply to: Bluntone22

That doesn't mean they are interested in filing returns. You can pontificate about what they may be doing, but the data says otherwise.
The Truth About Undocumented Immigrants and Taxes
Here is the opening paragraph. It may give you some insight into the process they do to file these taxes:

Every year, the Social Security Administration collects billions of dollars in taxes that it doesn’t know who paid. Whenever employers send in W-2 forms that have Social Security numbers that don’t match with anyone on record, the agency routes the paperwork to what’s called the Earnings Suspense File, where it sits until people can prove the wages were theirs, allowing them to one day collect retirement benefits.

Now here they explain how it works:

It works like this: Many immigrants who aren’t authorized to work in the United States buy fake Social Security cards and present them to their employers, who either don’t know they are fake or don’t look too closely. When the employer submits a W-2 form and a tax payment on those workers’ behalf to the Social Security Administration, the federal government holds onto those payroll taxes, even if the Social Security number isn’t linked to anyone on file. And then, a large chunk of that money ends up in the Social Security trust funds, from which retirement benefits are doled out to aging Americans.

The Social Security system has grown increasingly reliant on this stream of revenue, particularly as aging Baby Boomers start to retire. Stephen Goss, the chief actuary of the Social Security Administration, estimates that about 1.8 million immigrants were working with fake or stolen Social Security cards in 2010, and he expects that number to reach 3.4 million by 2040. He calculates that undocumented immigrants paid $13 billion into the retirement trust fund that year, and only got about $1 billion in benefits. “We estimate that earnings by unauthorized immigrants result in a net positive effect on Social Security financial status generally, and that this effect contributed roughly $12 billion to the cash flow of the program for 2010,” Gross concluded in a 2013 review of the impact of undocumented immigrants on Social Security.

Ironically, it was a piece of legislation aimed at curbing the hiring of undocumented immigrants that created this steady source of revenue for the Social Security system. In 1986, the Immigration Reform and Control Act set penalties for employers who knowingly hired undocumented immigrants. It was the first time the federal government had made it a crime to employ undocumented workers. Yet instead of destroying the underground labor market, this new law just made it more sophisticated, producing a thriving market for fake U.S. birth certificates, IDs and social security cards, which undocumented workers presented to their employers when asked for their papers. Undocumented workers started filling out W-2 forms, and the federal government began receiving and holding onto payroll taxes, even though the fake social security numbers didn’t match anyone in the system. The Social Security Administration sends no-match letters to employers to alert them of the problem and urge them to resolve it.



posted on Sep, 27 2017 @ 01:58 PM
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originally posted by: underwerks

originally posted by: Bluntone22

originally posted by: underwerks
Does anyone really believe you're ever going to pay less taxes?

Hate to be the bearer of bad news, but taxes are a one way street. If every illegal immigrant magically vanished from the United States your taxes wouldn't drop a dime, they'd just go toward something else.



I can live with that.

Right on.

At least you aren't trying to hide your disdain for illegal immigrants behind some economic BS.

Star for being honest.

]

Why do you support ILLEGAL immigration?

I actually want to know.



posted on Sep, 27 2017 @ 02:01 PM
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The Truth About Undocumented Immigrants and Taxes
They’re contributing billions of dollars a year to Social Security, but may never reap any retirement benefits from it.

Every year, the Social Security Administration collects billions of dollars in taxes that it doesn’t know who paid. Whenever employers send in W-2 forms that have Social Security numbers that don’t match with anyone on record, the agency routes the paperwork to what’s called the Earnings Suspense File, where it sits until people can prove the wages were theirs, allowing them to one day collect retirement benefits.

The Earnings Suspense File now contains Social Security tax forms that date back to 1937 and are linked to the taxes that were paid on nearly $1.3 trillion in wages. Some of the W-2s in it belong to people who got married and never reported changing their name. Others are people who filled out their tax forms incorrectly. As of 2014, efforts to track these taxpayers down allowed the Social Security Administration to match 171 million tax forms to their rightful owners.

But there are still about 340 million unclaimed tax forms recorded in the file, compared to 270 million nearly a decade ago. A good portion of those forms were filed by employers on behalf of some of the most unlikely funders of Social Security: undocumented immigrants. In fact, illegal immigration is considered largely responsible for the mushrooming of the file, with undocumented workers paying billions in taxes for retirement benefits they will likely never receive.







edit on 27-9-2017 by fiverx313 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 27 2017 @ 02:01 PM
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a reply to: Metallicus

I seem them as a necessary evil that we have grown to let our economy rely on and should instead of working to keep these people out be changing the system so we don't have to rely on them as much.



posted on Sep, 27 2017 @ 02:10 PM
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Oh my god, I'm so sick and tired of hearing that "illegal Immigrants pay taxes".

By the very definition, and illegal, undocumented immigrant are here illegally. They have no papers, no visa, no nothing.

Having no papers, no visa, no nothing, they DO NOT QUALIFY to work at a legitimate business, nor do they qualify for a temporary social security card for tax purposes. So tell me, how do they "pay all these billions in taxes" when they aren't even legally able to? Oh, that's right, The IRS is working with them to allow the use of stolen SS numbers to file returns in other people's names.

www.washingtonexaminer.com...

So the only way to get all of these taxes, are through fraud and felony. Seems like a legit cause to back, and a good democratic platform.

I swear, you can't make this stuff up.



posted on Sep, 27 2017 @ 02:11 PM
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a reply to: Krazysh0t

I don't blame anyone for being sceptical of ANY information source. I'd like to add a few more sources, though...

Please note, the bottom article refers to 2010 dollars; 2017 numbers would certainly be higher, don't you think?

In 2010, the average unlawful immigrant household received around $24,721 in government benefits and services while paying some $10,334 in taxes. This generated an average annual fiscal deficit (benefits received minus taxes paid) of around $14,387 per household. This cost had to be borne by U.S. taxpayers. Amnesty would provide unlawful households with access to over 80 means-tested welfare programs, Obamacare, Social Security, and Medicare. The fiscal deficit for each household would soar.



Over a lifetime, the former unlawful immigrants together would receive $9.4 trillion in government benefits and services and pay $3.1 trillion in taxes. They would generate a lifetime fiscal deficit (total benefits minus total taxes) of $6.3 trillion. (All figures are in constant 2010 dollars.)

www.heritage.org...

From 2016:


In contrast to lawful immigrants, unlawful immigrants at present do not have access to means-tested welfare, Social Security, or Medicare. This does not mean, however, that they do not receive government benefits and services. Children in unlawful immigrant households receive heavily subsidized public education. Many unlawful immigrants have U.S.-born children; these children are currently eligible for the full range of government welfare and medical benefits. And, of course, when unlawful immigrants live in a community, they use roads, parks, sewers, police, and fire protection; these services must expand to cover the added population or there will be “congestion” effects that lead to a decline in service quality. In 2010, the average unlawful immigrant household received around $24,721 in government benefits and services while paying some $10,334 in taxes. This generated an average annual fiscal deficit (benefits received minus taxes paid) of around $14,387 per household. This cost had to be borne by U.S. taxpayers. Amnesty would provide unlawful households with access to over 80 means-tested welfare programs, Obamacare, Social Security, and Medicare. The fiscal deficit for each household would soar.

amac.us...

From August, of this year:


Deporting the country’s estimated 11 million illegal immigrants would cost nearly $125 billion, but allowing them to remain in the U.S. could cost taxpayers far more, according to a new report being released Thursday by a think tank that wants to see stricter immigration limits. Steven A. Camarota, research director at the Center for Immigration Studies, crunched the numbers and found that the current population of illegal immigrants will drain nearly $750 billion from taxpayers over their lifetimes — amounting to six times the deportation costs.



A report last year by the National Academy of Sciences helped put a dollar figure on the lifetime costs and benefits of immigrants, based on levels of education. Mr. Camarota adjusted that study for illegal immigrants and concluded that those with advanced degrees are a $424,000 boon to the U.S. over their lifetime, but those who dropped out of high school are a $173,000 drain. Overall, it works out to a net cost to taxpayers of nearly $63,000 per illegal immigrant.

www.washingtontimes.com...

In summary, I don't think the original article was off in its conclusions. Your entitled to your opinion, though.



posted on Sep, 27 2017 @ 02:11 PM
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a reply to: Krazysh0t


Let's say your right and they pay taxes.
Your copy and paste above says they paid 13 billion into social security.

Well they cost a record 135 billion.

www.washingtonexaminer.com...

They cost ten times more than they paid.

Hell double that amount for sales taxes and they still cost 8 times more than the pay.

Sorry, they need to go. We have to many homeless in our country to waste money on illegals.



posted on Sep, 27 2017 @ 02:14 PM
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a reply to: shawmanfromny

I mean backing up your source with a Heritage link is like adding more baloney to a baloney sandwich. You haven't really enhanced the flavor any. You just have a lot of baloney.



posted on Sep, 27 2017 @ 02:15 PM
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a reply to: shawmanfromny

American children in illegal households, so american citizens. Why are they being counted in the other group? That is dishonest.



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