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Kneeling during the anthem is honoring what our founding fathers fought for

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posted on Sep, 26 2017 @ 06:04 AM
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a reply to: enlightenedservant

The argument also exists where the term is wrongly applied and overused, same as racist. Surreal indeed.




posted on Sep, 26 2017 @ 06:16 AM
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a reply to: JinMI

Is the term wrongly applied or overused right now when we say "People here took up for literal Nazis on free speech grounds, but are attacking the players for their free speech"? Or "Trump was harsher when denouncing the NFL & NBA players than when he was talking about the literal Nazis and their supporters in Charlottesville, even though the players hurt no one while Heather Heyer was murdered in Charlottesville"?



posted on Sep, 26 2017 @ 06:24 AM
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originally posted by: Hazardous1408
Being brainwashed with the pledge of allegiance from a young age will do this to people.

It’s the equivalent of a religion being indoctrinated into a child’s mind from birth.
I include Islam in that for all the smart arses that were about to star whore because of my Faith.

At the end of the day, if you place a piece of fabric, or a chant before Humanity, you’re a weirdo of the highest degree.


Now all the armchair pundits will chastise you or deny that you served, because they have nothing else to fall back on in their brainwashed states.


Has nothing to do with your false argument. People want to watch football. Not be inundated with another form of media that is biased and pushing a political agenda.

But I do think people see the irony that individuals cannot stand out of remembrance for people that came from the same background to honor their sacrifices in WW II, The Korean War, Vietnam, Desert Storm, Iraq, Afghanistan......

People don't have to support the NFL....



posted on Sep, 26 2017 @ 06:25 AM
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a reply to: enlightenedservant

BLM killed a couple of police officers as well.

By kneeling, you're showing your support to them, right?



posted on Sep, 26 2017 @ 06:26 AM
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a reply to: enlightenedservant

Would the terms carry more weight if they were aptly applied over the past year? Longer? You already are aware of where I stand on this issue.

Switching the conversation over to Trump; he has his own stance, one I don't really agree with, but like those on the field protesting, Trump too can express his speech. Those players employers however...we'll see if anyone loses their jobs.



posted on Sep, 26 2017 @ 06:27 AM
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originally posted by: enlightenedservant
a reply to: JinMI

Is the term wrongly applied or overused right now when we say "People here took up for literal Nazis on free speech grounds, but are attacking the players for their free speech"? Or "Trump was harsher when denouncing the NFL & NBA players than when he was talking about the literal Nazis and their supporters in Charlottesville, even though the players hurt no one while Heather Heyer was murdered in Charlottesville"?


I don't think Nazis called for people to be fired from employment through freedom of speech. The Nazis literally jailed and executed individuals through the authority of the government. Stop equating the two for a false argument.
edit on 26-9-2017 by neutronflux because: Added and fixed was more specific



posted on Sep, 26 2017 @ 06:35 AM
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a reply to: enlightenedservant

True or false. Didn't trump call out and denounce all individuals that seek to cause violence in Charlottesville? On both sides? Thanks for more false arguments.



posted on Sep, 26 2017 @ 06:35 AM
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a reply to: Krazysh0t

Most of the folks kneeling now probably don't know exactly WHY they are kneeling save for the fact that they don't like our president and are trying to give him the big middle finger by what he said in his tweets.

Football players are paid to play a game. Fans aren't there to watch them demonstrate. I'm sure there are much better ways to get your message across than pissing off a major portion of this country.

I'm a vet as well and while I respect that we have the ability to say what we want, that does not absolve anyone from the consequences of what they say. The NFL being a private organization doesn't have to allow free speech. They could easily squash this whole thing and they DO have the right to fire people for going against the rules (if they chose to implement and enforce them).

There is a tremendous double-standard here. Pissing on the flag is o.k. in the NFL, but honoring fallen Dallas police officers was a no-no to Roger Goodell. Nor was honoring those killed during 9/11.

The president has every right to speak up for this country. The first amendment doesn't mean you will always like what you will hear. I'm glad he did it. Someone needed to.



posted on Sep, 26 2017 @ 06:37 AM
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originally posted by: marg6043
a reply to: Krazysh0t
Disrespecting our nation is not the same as exercising freedoms, is call anarchy..

No. Anarchy is when there is no government or law. It is not illegal to kneel during the anthem, no matter how much it upsets your stomach, and it certainly isn't anarchy. Kneeling doesn't automatically invalidate the government and laws. That's just silly hyperbole there, or you don't understand the meaning of words. I'd like to side with the former though.
edit on 26-9-2017 by Krazysh0t because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 26 2017 @ 06:42 AM
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a reply to: smurfy

Exactly. Trump breaks norms all the time that people give passes too. Yet these players kneeling during the anthem is being equated with anarchy? PUHLEAZE!



posted on Sep, 26 2017 @ 06:43 AM
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originally posted by: ParasuvO

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: enlightenedservant

#. All you have to do is watch any professional sports game. They will mention at least one or two of the players' charities at least once during the 3 hour broadcast. Not to mention the players themselves will have billboards displayed around the stadiums advertising their charities too.


Small charities like that really do nothing to fix anything.....they are small and do not expand..due to ego.

Large corporate charities limit services at a whim.

Face it..what they are doing is an absolute waste of time and does not register in any of the communities on a noticeable scale.

In other words...looks good...helps 15-20 people ans everyone can cheer about how great they are...while the other 99.99% of people get ZILCH.

Just like they will get with this pathetic effort....

Well you are just a pill of good will aren't you mr. pessimistic?



posted on Sep, 26 2017 @ 06:45 AM
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a reply to: Outlier13

Well. That's one of the things you fought for. The right to use rights in ways you don't approve. Should I remind you that the National Anthem occurs before the game starts? Them kneeling during it has no impact on their performance immediately following it. Saying that them kneeling is "ruining the experience" is rather melodramatic. All things considered.



posted on Sep, 26 2017 @ 06:46 AM
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originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: texasyeti




Football should not be about politics.

Tell that to the president.
He seems to have chosen to make it so. Bigly.
Where did he speechify about it? Was that a political rally? No?


Trump didn't start it. You do recall there were players taking knees before this weekend, right?



posted on Sep, 26 2017 @ 06:46 AM
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originally posted by: Phage
a reply to: Deny Arrogance



Could you please point out where in the constitution it states the POTUSA forfeits his or her right to free speech and to do so whenever or wherever they feel like it.

Did I say he didn't have a right to spout his politically driven nonsense at a political rally? Did you read the post I replied to?

No, I didn't say that. I said that he is the one who turned the silent protests of a few into a shouted political toy in order to satisfy his political base.

Clear now?


The media made sure they were not silent, before this weekend.



posted on Sep, 26 2017 @ 06:48 AM
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originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: texasyeti
Football should not be about politics.


Forcing your employees to pledge to a flag/country makes it political.



National Anthem, not Pledge of Allegiance.



posted on Sep, 26 2017 @ 06:51 AM
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originally posted by: bluesilver

originally posted by: Jersey Devil
a reply to: SudoNim

I completely understand Kaepernicks want to protest and respect his God given right to do so in this country. HOWEVER, everyone choosing to kneel during our National anthem and not recognize our flag during it has chosen the WRONG form of protest. Instead they should have been more like Dr King and organize, hold a peaceful rally, educate, be active to your concerns. But no, they took the 1 symbol, the 1 single thing that unites us all despite our differences, and unites us all as 1 AMERICANS and choose to disrespect that symbol and use it as a wedge to divide us rather than unite us under it. Whether they believe it or not they do disrespect those that have bled, fought and sacrificed for their damn right. Remember how proud you felt after 9/11 when we saw no race, no color, no difference? we were all 1, just Americans united proud to see that flag raised from the ashes. But no now they use that symbol to divide us. Again they have the right but didnt think it through and its doing the oposite of their intentions.... Or IS it???? lol did Soros organize this evil plan???? da da da dahhhhh....


Perhaps the point is that while you feel that you have a unified country, others do not. So, the way that echoes this most is by doing what they are doing.

This whole disrespecting the fallen keeps being brought up, but when you have actual serving and ex serving soldiers saying that they don't consider it an affront when they kneel, I'm not sure why you feel so right. The flag and anthem are symbols for justice and equality and freedom. They are not solely a military construct. Repeatedly saying it is an affront to the fallen is not just inaccurate, but it is just being inflammatory and based on untruths. As I said before, if serving and ex-serving military say they have no problem with it, I don't see how people (especially non-serving soldiers) can repeatedly say it is.


So they are protesting the ideals of justice, equality and freedom?



posted on Sep, 26 2017 @ 06:51 AM
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a reply to: Vroomfondel

To me. Freedom is more than the symbols that represent it. Practicing and defending freedom is infinitely more important than honoring the symbols that represent them. If that means using those freedoms in ways that people don't approve, then so be it. When you start putting symbols over freedom then THAT is when freedom dies. Ever see the Futurama episode "A Taste of Freedom"? Zoidberg eats the flag on what is basically Independence Day in the future. He is put on trial but ultimately redeemed because eating the flag is an expression of freedom. Same difference. You may not like it, but dammit they have the right to do it.



posted on Sep, 26 2017 @ 06:52 AM
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a reply to: Teikiatsu

Recently they did it because Trump made a big stink and singled out the NFL over the weekend for no reason whatsoever.



posted on Sep, 26 2017 @ 06:58 AM
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a reply to: keys2heaven

By that same regard, most of the people losing their # over the players kneeling during the anthem don't understand why the flag is important either. I've talked to a few of them over the course of this thread. It's funny how people such as yourself get this elitist mentality about understanding what the flag means yet I'm sure you don't stand when you hear the anthem at home. How about you articulate why the flag is even important in the first place? Now do the Anthem.



posted on Sep, 26 2017 @ 06:59 AM
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originally posted by: bluesilver
There are so many times where the same thing is being raised.

1. They are rich so why are they protesting.

So, what difference does being wealthy or not have in being able to protest? Are you only allowed to protest if it directly affects you rather than your fellow man? Or are you saying that your 1st Amendment does not include this right if you earn over a certain amount or if you are not directly affected? No. So why keep bring it up?


I've not heard people say "they are rich so shut up," but I have heard people say they are "rich and therefore detached from reality and have no idea what they are complaining about."

They are at work when they are on the field, under contract and expected to deliver a specific product and service. That is not the time to be protesting. How would your boss feel if you decided to get political on their dime?


2. It offends the fallen.

Does it? How? The flag represent many things, such as freedom, equality and justice and while it is used by the military, it doesn't specifically and solely represent the military. All kinds of people/groups sing it. So saying that it disrespects the fallen is totally inaccurate and deliberately inflammatory. Plus you have serving and ex-serving soldiers saying that they don't feel that they are disrespecting anyone. So why on earth do you?


I've heard service and ex-serving soldiers say they *do* feel their service is being disrespected. While they do not have the right to not be offended, that doesn't mean we can't listen to their argument and make up our own minds.

Personally I think it's stupid because it's a song about seeing a flagpole that didn't break or fall down during a fort siege. Exactly what are they protesting in that song? Just refuse to pledge allegiance to the flag and call it a day, sheesh.



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