North Korea: What would a war look like ?

a reply to: eriktheawful

WE can SHOW PICTURES of ourselves in Korea then?

originally posted by: odzeandennz
before war can happen, legally, per the un, there must be an act of declaration of war...

a country cannot attack another country because they are developing a missile or nuke system. NK knows this and are not part of the iaea or any nuclear proliferation or treaty with any nation.

the sanctions are not even legitimate.

Trump would have to show or demonstrate what NK has done to America, how many warships do they have on us borders to provoke an attack, have they done any damage on us or allied soil.

so far all NK has done is develop a weapon which the US has the second largest stockpile and is the only government which deemed it necessary after one attack from the Japanese... (why other military actions weren't taken or exhausted...) the Japanese are putting their fears in the wrong basket, and they still owe us ' 2' ( I know a lot feel that way from my stint there)

Well by declaring a war and having it approved through the legislative branch may be the better way to do things, that's not always the case.

The President can authorize strikes and "wage war" for several weeks before taking it to congress for approval. Again not calling it best practice, but it's within the executive office's power. Of course there's political fallout. But you get that with everything. This being more serious than trivial things though.

As for the sanctions being legitimate, I think that falls on whether you agree that the U.N. can place sanctions under international law. Because that's where most of the sanctions come from, U.N. resolutions in my understanding. There are other international treaty violations as well, although I believe that any NK was a signatory in, they have withdrawn from over the years. ( Believe me, I'm not a fan of the U.N., at all. Just stating the thought.)

Sanctions that the U.S places on them unilaterally are different of course. Although I find it hard to believe they are illegal. Countries deemed hostile to others are routinely sanctioned in various ways by many countries around the world. Anyone of course could argue the legitimacy and morality of the sanctions, because it depends on whether you consider NK a threat. Many do, others do not.

Just my thoughts, as I enjoy and follow your posts on this topic.

originally posted by: WeRpeons
a reply to: gortex

I agree South Korea will be the most vulnerable if the U.S. would decide to attack North Korea. That would be Kim's first response. It would take less than a minute to launch a barrage of artillery towards the south. I think that has been the major sticking point with many U.S. presidents. Is Trump going to take responsibility for the death of millions of South Koreans because of a decision to attack North Korea? What does North Korea have to lose by launching their nukes if they come under attack?

It's really a dangerous situation and not as clear-cut as Trump makes it out to be. Unless the U.S. has some secret weapon that can destabilize North Korea's launchers and wipe out all their artillery along the DMZ, South Koreans are sitting ducks.

Definitely not clean cut, and if not for the complexities of Seoul's location, as well as others such a the proximity of China... well I'd bet we would been in at least a limited war some time ago. Again, right or wrong depending on your beliefs.

a reply to: cavtrooper7

I don't see why not. I could post more, but they'd just be of a 10 - 12 year old kid acting goofy.

Here is me with my Dad when I was 12 at the DMZ at Panmunjom:

a reply to: eriktheawful

I just tried to upload me ...I'll try again...
AH...yeah, mine would be in uniform,didn't work anyway.

Utter Insanity ( kim Nope the Human race )
Asteroids - Sun flares . Gama ray burst
And every ATS faveret Alien invasion .

A 1000 ways to die and we add more .

I am pretty confident there will not be a war. China will not allow it. War would result in the end of North Korea and the reunification with the South, something China (and Russia) are keen to avoid. The North may attempt to provoke a response, but they have been doing that for decades.

While Trump is being pilloried for his war of words, he has managed to get China to impose sanctions, something other US leaders have failed to do.

a reply to: flatbush71

Didn't mean for it to come off like that :/

THey did train much harder than we did. We did a 40 mile road march in full battle gear once a year. They did that type of training routinely. A routine March for us was 10 miles. Doesn't sound like much until you consider the terrain. Lots of hills that are like small mountains or as the locals call them "yamas". We used to joke that the Yamaha motorcycle name means laugh at the hill

originally posted by: paraphi
I am pretty confident there will not be a war. China will not allow it. War would result in the end of North Korea and the reunification with the South, something China (and Russia) are keen to avoid. The North may attempt to provoke a response, but they have been doing that for decades.

While Trump is being pilloried for his war of words, he has managed to get China to impose sanctions, something other US leaders have failed to do.

Reunification is one of many outcomes of a war, and I believe less probable than most. I'd think a regime change in NK with a government leader China could work with would be more likely. As you think and most everyone agrees, China and Russia don't want any type of democracy or U.S. influence on their borders. They like and enjoy the buffer.

If they can keep that buffer, while being rid of the Kim regime, it might be palatable enough for them to stay on the sidelines. I'm sure neither is happy with the increased U.S presence in the area. After things settled, they could strengthen their argument that the U.S. should remove or lessen troops on the peninsula. It would be a hard to defend against that, if there was a different leader of NK that was less aggressive and gave up nuclear ambitions. NK could then slowly work itself back into the world economy, normalizing over the course of several years,and presumably do more for their people.

a reply to: Mike.Ockizard

Whole lotta FUN doing PT on them around Cp Stanley and the damn HONEY trucks too.
Then we started the "Thunder Run "in 86...where we road marched to soul.

a reply to: gortex


I understand your point about SK, but I can't put my family, my job and my country in second place. I wish the best for SK. Blame Obama and all last 3 presidents for let this grow out of proportion.

a reply to: Mike.Ockizard

I was responding to your very first post, not the others.

Sorry for the confusion.

Buck

a reply to: Kandinsky

Maybe in the end for the psychopathic megalomaniac self-preservation and victory aren't as important as the body count and levels of destruction inflicted on his "enemies"?

originally posted by: ausername
a reply to: Kandinsky

Maybe in the end for the psychopathic megalomaniac self-preservation and victory aren't as important as the body count and levels of destruction inflicted on his "enemies"?

We can hope.

I suspect the stats on psychopaths will show they only abandon self-preservation after incarceration.

Our opening salvo is going to teriffy the world. Russia and china both know of a particular weapon we have and they dont want any part of it. Theyre all talk and they know it. North korea is on its own. Their entire nuclear capability will be gone in less than a minute their artillary will be gone within a half hour. They have zero defense against us. Think im kidding. You dont know what i and a few other members know about just how ready we are and just how scary some of our stuff is. Weve been preparing for decades to annihilate north korea. We have the means and the will. Like i said before people should read up on the greek tale of proteus. Its pretty illuminating. Also watch out for sudden fog banks.

originally posted by: 727Sky

originally posted by: kelbtalfenek
a reply to: gortex

The only thing I think they got wrong was the body count...I think the first 2 days would be in the millions, not the hundreds of thousands. I also think that Un would go nuclear before his military reserves/logistic train ran out.

I am considering the possibilities that if a war with NK ever starts (for whatever reason) it will be over except for a mop up and humanitarian operation in just about 15 minutes or max of 30 minutes..

I do believe at this time in history, America will unleash the big dogs of war and will instill a real fear into their future opponents that will not soon be forgotten.. No brag .... just listening to the rhetoric from both sides reminds me of two young bucks doing the monkey dance before the fist start to fly.. ... Let us all hope sincerely that my scenario or any real war does not happen..

What you are forgetting is the THOUSANDS of artillery pieces bunkered and pointing at Seoul even as we speak. All those commanders are waiting for is a little light to come on and tell them to shoot, reload and shoot again until they are out of ammo or destroyed.

What are the "big dogs" you refer to? Nukes? MOAB? There is absolutely no way that a single, a dozen or even a hundred bomb strikes are going to end the war in 30 minutes. These people view him as a god walking, or they get strapped to the business end of an AA piece and blown to bits, then those bits are driven over by tanks until they're part of the ground.

Sorry, I'll believe the experts on this one, hope you don't mind.

Basically were deciding if the usa should let one particular cat out of the bag weve been hiding. Were going to gain a lot of enemies, and fear from even our allies that day but nobody and i mean nobody is going to get in our way. Like i said we have some very very scary stuff.

a reply to: kelbtalfenek

Theyre not experts. They had jobs but they are ignorant of a lot of stuff we have. Stuff i doubt even obama was let in on. Bush knew about it and so does trump. Were not screwing around when mattis says were confudent we can annihilate north korea before they could even launch a single artillary round. Like i said we have some illuminating stuff. 511 problems but artillary aint one.

originally posted by: BASSPLYR
a reply to: kelbtalfenek

Theyre not experts. They had jobs but they are ignorant of a lot of stuff we have. Stuff i doubt even obama was let in on. Bush knew about it and so does trump. Were not screwing around when mattis says were confudent we can annihilate north korea before they could even launch a single artillary round. Like i said we have some illuminating stuff. 511 problems but artillary aint one.

I can't (for obvious reasons) confirm what are you saying although I always add commentary such as this to my RUMINT pile. My analysis will stick to open source weapons systems.

The main bulk of the war, the nuclear portion, would be over in relatively short order. At worst a random/rogue North Korean missile commander would launch after C2 fell. I'm assuming that Chairman Kim is working off the use or lose principal given his lack of proper secondary strike options or a triad.

Once the war starts in earnest the North would launch their operational arsenal. If they haven't already they would unleash their biological weapons. Chemical missiles/shells would rain upon Japan and South Korea. Likely a North Korean EMP would launch over East Asia covering 900 km. Such a launch depending on the resiliency of the Japanese/South Korean electrical grids would leave both nations without power for a year.

The United States would launch counterforce strikes of its own against the North. Many targets would be ground targets and radiation would spread in the region.

Hard to say what the total death rate would be, really that depends on where specific missiles land, EMP, the biological program etc.

a reply to: NuclearDamocles

Were going to preemptivelly strike this time. Also not the first time weve done it. We sent north koreas nuclear program back ten years over a decade ago with a preemptive strike. They didnt do shyt then instead they made up Ludacris excuses.