It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Did Islam Come From Babylon?

page: 6
7
<< 3  4  5    7 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Oct, 20 2017 @ 02:39 PM
link   
a reply to: babloyi

My Two sons are into Islam but for some reason are very hard to communicate with or even discuss some parts . They usually tell me what I believe which is usually wrong and then attack the strawman they created to justify what they believe . Its a very strange thing . I will ask them a simple question about the Quran or Islam and if they feel threatened by the question they retreat to no discussion . Part of my Christian growth has always involved questions weather my own or other peoples questions ...Them ...not so much ...Its like they are afraid to be asked if they don't have a answer already ...kind of a pre-planned response . ... strange . eta ...sorry for my misunderstanding as to what you linked to . I suppose (now) that Islam like Christianity has many versions of the Quran in English . I had thought there was only one version . Much like the differing denominations in Christianity ,Islam could be similar for similar reasons . not every one is in agreement in both our camps of faith .
edit on 20-10-2017 by the2ofusr1 because: (no reason given)
I guess there can be two ways to approach a problem ie

edit on 20-10-2017 by the2ofusr1 because: (no reason given)




posted on Oct, 20 2017 @ 04:07 PM
link   
a reply to: the2ofusr1
Sorry, I tried watching the video, but when he started talking about "dhimmdependent" and "SJW jibberish" and libtards, I got bored. 28 minutes is far too long a time for me to endure frothy youtube rantings, even if I didn't already dislike youtube videos as a medium of learning.

Can you concisely post his salient points?



posted on Oct, 20 2017 @ 08:01 PM
link   
a reply to: babloyi




Can you concisely post his salient points?
There are a few take aways from the vid . one being that certain sect of Islam with a slightly different number system for its verses that was used by the Muslim apologist to defend a position on rape of women by Muslim men . How apologist will not only misuse the verses but will also fail to quote the verses but use a Iman interpretation of a verse that has nothing to do with the subject ...Its a convoluted and deceptive process that takes someone who knows what they are doing to unwind it ... He is doing 2 more parts on the subject so its not the end of the story .



posted on Oct, 21 2017 @ 04:38 AM
link   
a reply to: the2ofusr1
Oh, thank God I didn't waste my time with that, then!

What was the context of posting it here? How does it relate to the discussion at hand?


...come to think of it, what's the discussion at hand?



posted on Oct, 21 2017 @ 09:50 AM
link   
a reply to: babloyi


I wasn't aware that I was in a debate pertaining to the corruption of the Bible. The concept that you disagree with the Quran's thesis that the Bible is corrupted is absolutely irrelevant to me.

Not true at all. You must be aware that you debate the Christian bible simply because you defend your Quran. That in itself is relevant is it not? If you are not aware of that fact then you do not believe your own posts that show your defense of Islam. The prime example is that you do not believe that the biblical Jesus died in the manner as the Christian Gospels show. You also do not believe that the biblical Jesus was and is the Begotten Son of God. So in that respect whenever you use any portion of the Christian NT you are using a corrupt source of literature. By that I mean that you cannot expect to use the NT literature to your advantage and only as you wish with contempt of the literature. That would be disingenuous to say the least.



posted on Oct, 21 2017 @ 10:36 AM
link   
a reply to: babloyi




...come to think of it, what's the discussion at hand?
In short ....How does Islam fit into Mystery Babylon ... If we have a starting point to find the answer it has to be the Black Cube that all Muslims bow towards and where they perform rituals that stem from Paganism ...Circling the Kaaba 7 times was practiced earlier then Muhammad and was related to the 7 planetary stars that had movement . So bowing down and kissing a stone ritualistically is linked to Paganism
The ending is actually a apologetic basically saying that the Jews do it so why can't we . To be fair to the Jews here we have to understand that they pray towards where they think their Temple was and where Gods presence was . So Jews of the past prayed in the direction where the presence of God was on earth . Christians know that God is in heaven so any direction will go towards God .
edit on 21-10-2017 by the2ofusr1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 21 2017 @ 04:35 PM
link   
a reply to: Seede

originally posted by: Seede
Not true at all. You must be aware that you debate the Christian bible simply because you defend your Quran. That in itself is relevant is it not?

But I'm neither defending the Quran nor debating the Bible. My initial, and so far, it seems, only point that was relevant to this thread was addressing the issue of iconography. That doesn't require going into the scripture of either religion. It was simply an off-hand comment about the absurdity of comparing nazi symbolism to Christianity that some people REALLY seemed to take personally that created this digression that we haven't returned from. I'm not interested in debating the Quran with a Christian, nor the Bible with a muslim, because such debate is pointless. It is irrelevant to the Christian what the Quran says about Christianity, and irrelevant to the muslim what Christianity says about Islam. You're never going to convince a Christian that the Bible is false by using the Quran as a source, and you're never going to convince a muslim that the Quran is false using the Bible as a source.
WHEN I am participating in such debates, if I am addressing a christian, I use the Bible, and if a Christian is addressing Islam, they'd use the Quran. I might believe the Bible is corrupted, but that doesn't stop me from using it as a source when addressing Christians.

a reply to: the2ofusr1

originally posted by: the2ofusr1
In short ....How does Islam fit into Mystery Babylon ... If we have a starting point to find the answer it has to be the Black Cube that all Muslims bow towards and where they perform rituals that stem from Paganism ...Circling the Kaaba 7 times was practiced earlier then Muhammad and was related to the 7 planetary stars that had movement . So bowing down and kissing a stone ritualistically is linked to Paganism.

Since we're SPECIFICALLY addressing this point now, and we've dropped all the other stuff, then please explain how the black cube is Babylonian?
edit on 21-10-2017 by babloyi because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 22 2017 @ 11:18 AM
link   
a reply to: babloyi


Since we're SPECIFICALLY addressing this point now, and we've dropped all the other stuff, then please explain how the black cube is Babylonian?

You do make sense in that theology can never be mandated to people. Mandating actions of theology can eventually be bred into and out of the masses just as we see today. Christianity is a dyeing theology and I believe it is in shambles because of lack of uniformity and seminaries that have not taught Christianity. That along with corrupt governments will exemplify the inequality of our peers. Of course that is only my opinion and I do not expect the world to accept what I believe.

In the religion of Islam is the ritual of circumambulation of the Kaaba. We also know that this existed prior to Islam and was the practice of the worship of the moon god sin.

Quote
Muhammad's second return to the Ka'aba was the Lesser Pilgrimage negotiated through the treaty at Hudaybiyah. "The huge crowd of pilgrims in their white garments filed slowly into their holy city, led by Muhammad riding on Qaswa, and the valley resounded with their cry: 'Here I am at your service, 0 God!' When he reached the Ka'aba, Muhammad dismounted and kissed the Black Stone, embracing and stroking it, and then began to make the circumambulations followed by the whole pilgrim body."

On his next return to Mecca, he came in triumph. "He rose, performed the ritual ablutions and offered the prayer. Then, mounted on Qaswa, he rode round the Ka'aba seven times, touching the Black Stone each time and crying 'al-Llahu Akbar!' The shout was taken up by his 10,000 soldiers and soon the whole city resounded with the words that symbolised the final victory of Islam. Next Muhammad turned his attention to the 360 idols around the shrine: crowded on to their roofs and balconies, the Quraysh watched him smash each idol while he recited the verse: 'the truth has come, and falsehood has vanished'. Inside the Ka'aba the walls had been decorated with pictures of the pagan deities and Muhammad ordered them all to be obliterated, though it is said that he allowed frescoes of Jesus and Mary to remain. Eventually Islam would forbid the use of all imagery in its worship because it distracts the mind from God by allowing it to dwell on purely human symbols of the divine (Armstrong 1991).

The notion that idols are powerless by comparison with the true divine source is a very materialistic perspective. Christianity has continued to be steeped in every form of idol worship in the understanding that images of Jesus and Mary are merely metaphors for the transcendent deity. It is precisely in this sense that the idols of Sin and Ishtar and the other astral and chthonic deities were worshipped. Moreover, monotheistic religion is itself spiritually idolatrous because it thrusts compulsively one fixed image of the transcendent, particularly as a male creator with a jealous reactive ego who punishes the unbeliever and upholds a strict unchanging rule of order. Although 'the Tao that can be told is not the countless Tao', extending this truth to a tabu against forming an image of the transcendent on pain of death is idolatory of the most tryanical sort, contrasting sadly with the tradition of spiritual tolerance for which the ancient Ka'aba stands.
Of course it was easy for the Prophet with the conscious vision of isfand to portray the stone and wooden idols as inert, but to say that force of political revolution made these deities powerless is a worldly and profane argument.

The facts are that each temple was demolished or burned to the ground, and the priests and priestesses put to the sword. Indeed when the banu-Umahmah were slaughtered for defending dhu-al-Khalasah which stood half way to Sana, a certain woman cried (Faris 31):
Unquote
www.dhushara.com...

As I have shown in my thread, the god Allah existed long before Muhammad by many moon tribal worshipers and this Kaaba with its black rock [stone] also existed long before Muhammad was even thought of. As you have just read, and your religion tells you, the Meccah Kaaba was not built by Muhammad and served as a shrine for many gods. You can see this in the above quote that I posted.

Now when Muhammad returned the second time to Meccah and paid homage to this black stone it has shown us that it was then that he accepted this moon god and was also aware of Jesus and Mary but did not accept Christianity. There is no evidence whatsoever that shows us anything except that this ritual was known and mimicked by Joshua in his destruction of Jericho. It was a crop ritual of the god sin and originated in Ur within the second century of the post flood era. This ritual was strictly a moon god ritual that we now see Muhammad practicing.



posted on Oct, 23 2017 @ 02:01 PM
link   
a reply to: Seede
I think your jump between "Muhammad kissed the Black stone" to "He accepted this moon god" is a bit overzealous.
No muslim denies that Allah existed long before Muhammad. I've only ever seen Christians point this out as if it is some amazing expose discovery. The moon god, however, was Hubal (not Sin), and Hubal was not Allah. When Muhammad smashed all the idols, that included the one of the moon god.



posted on Oct, 23 2017 @ 05:18 PM
link   
a reply to: babloyi

Hi ... I am about half way through this lecture that I find very interesting and didn't know the history behind ancient Ismaili intellectual thought on Christology . The second Imam was actually the son of a Christian woman .

edit on 23-10-2017 by the2ofusr1 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 23 2017 @ 09:43 PM
link   
Did Islam come from Babylon? Kind of...

All of the angel names ending in "EL" came from Babylon. This includes Judaism, Islam and Christianity.

First, the angel Gabriel came to Daniel in Babylon. Later, the angel Gabriel came to Mary in Nazareth. Even later, the angel Gabriel came to Muhammad near Makka. Gabriel never mentioned his name prior to the Jewish exile. This unique name started in Babylon, along with the name Michael. No angels prior to the exile of Judah were allowed to give out their names. The Tanakh only mentions proper angel names only when they are in Babylonian captivity. This started with the Jewish prophet Daniel.

I'm not sure why YHWH/Allah started allowing angel names to be used in his sacred writings but one thing is for sure, it all started at Babylon.



The angels mentioned in the older books of the Hebrew Bible (aka the Tanakh) are without names. Rabbi Simeon ben Lakish of Tiberias (230–270) even asserted that all of the specific names for the angels were brought back by the Jews from Babylon, and some modern commentators would tend to agree. Of the seven archangels in the angelology of post-exilic Judaism, only two of them, the archangels Michael and Gabriel, are mentioned by name in the canonized Jewish scriptures, in the book of Daniel in particular, which is one of the youngest books in the Tanakh.

en.wikipedia.org...


edit on 23-10-2017 by lostinspace because: added quote from wikipedia on source of angel names

edit on 23-10-2017 by lostinspace because: Changed from Galilee to Nazareth



posted on Oct, 24 2017 @ 09:04 AM
link   
a reply to: babloyi
a reply to: Seede



I think your jump between "Muhammad kissed the Black stone" to "He accepted this moon god" is a bit overzealous. No muslim denies that Allah existed long before Muhammad. I've only ever seen Christians point this out as if it is some amazing expose discovery. The moon god, however, was Hubal (not Sin), and Hubal was not Allah. When Muhammad smashed all the idols, that included the one of the moon god.

You may have been taught otherwise and that is your prerogative to choose what you want to believe but what you believe and what the archaeological facts have discovered and presented are not as you have been taught.

What I had said was that Nanna/Sin was the high moon god in the era of Abram [Babylon] and that the Muslim religion came from this religion. There are many names and different aspects of Nanna/Sin and Hubal, Baal and Allah derived from Nanna/Sin of this Babylonian religion.

The black stone of the Kaaba in Mecca is believed by most all science to have come from the moon with nothing but tradition to declare otherwise.

What then do you understand of the Kaaba ritual?



posted on Oct, 24 2017 @ 11:59 AM
link   
a reply to: Seede
I've seen no "archaelogical facts" yet that support your thesis, and only know of facts that disprove it. Such as the documented fact that Sin and Baal, and then Sin, Hubal and Baal and Allah were contemporaneous as separate and unique deities, so they can't be the same.

And nobody at all, not in science or elsewhere, believe the black stone came from the moon. The TRADITION (and scientific conjecture, because obviously, the stone won't be tested) is that it is a meteorite. You know what a meteorite is, correct? They don't come from the moon.

a reply to: the2ofusr1
Tell me if you find out something you didn't know before...I'm unfortunately not going to be able to sit through that video.
edit on 24-10-2017 by babloyi because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 24 2017 @ 07:11 PM
link   
a reply to: babloyi
a reply to: Seede



I've seen no "archaelogical facts" yet that support your thesis, and only know of facts that disprove it. Such as the documented fact that Sin and Baal, and then Sin, Hubal and Baal and Allah were contemporaneous as separate and unique deities, so they can't be the same. And nobody at all, not in science or elsewhere, believe the black stone came from the moon. The TRADITION (and scientific conjecture, because obviously, the stone won't be tested) is that it is a meteorite. You know what a meteorite is, correct? They don't come from the moon. a reply to: the2ofusr1 Tell me if you find out something you didn't know before...I'm unfortunately not going to be able to sit through that video.

I asked for sources of your belief. I have not seen your sources of your belief. Are they in your Mss or Quran or Hadith literature?

I believe I have posted much evidence that will show you the needed literature of Nanna/Sin and I find repeating this evidence is totally useless if you do not read the posts.

Conclusion

The pagan Arabs worshipped the Moon-god Allah by praying toward Mecca several times a day; making a pilgrimage to Mecca; running around the temple of the Moon-god called the Kabah; kissing the black stone; killing an animal in sacrifice to the Moon-god; throwing stones at the devil; fasting for the month which begins and ends with the crescent moon; giving alms to the poor, etc.

There are four interesting parallels with Islam here: (a) Akhenaton made the male sun-god the one and only god of Egypt, while (b) Muhammad made the male moon-god the one and only god of the Arabs. Neither god remotely resembled the God of the Bible, both being pagan deities borrowed from polytheistic religions. And there is a third parallel: (c) Though technically monotheistic, in practice Akhenaton remained a god himself. Though never calling himself a "god", Muhammad certainly accrued many of the attributes of godly power as we shall see in subsequent articles. Finally, (d) Akhenaton used as a symbol for his god the Ankh Cross consisting of a solar disk atop a Tau cross, whilst Muhammad retained for Islam the pagan crescent moon symbol of the moon-god Allah.

Is this all a fanciful, far-fetched conclusion? Is all the vast array of scholarly information available on Allah simply a conspiracy by evil Westerners to discredit Islam? Or might what you have read be the truth? Are you honest enough to continue researching the origins of Islam further? And most importantly, are you honest enough to admit that you might be wrong and that the truth about God lies elsewhere?

My purpose in this article has been simply to examine Islam's roots and to see if the "official version" is believable. May Yahweh, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, and all the biblical prophets, whose compound redemptive Name is Lord Jesus Christ, bless and you guide you in the way of truth. Amen.

The Muslim's claim that Allah is the God of the Bible and that Islam arose from the religion of the prophets and apostles is refuted by solid, overwhelming archeological evidence. Islam is nothing more than a revival of the ancient Moon-god cult. It has taken the symbols, the rites, the ceremonies, and even the name of its god from the ancient pagan religion of the Moon-god. As such, it is sheer idolatry and must be rejected by all those who follow the Torah and Gospel.

The religion of ancient Israel was based on revelation; the Old Testament says that God appeared in diverse places and spoke to the Patriarchs; there they raised altars of undressed stones, called Beth-el—or House of God. Man's sensual imagination soon led him "to collect his gods in the dust and fashion them as he pleased," imagining that God resided in these Stones. Thus it became Beth-aven or House of Vanity. Beth-el abounded in Chaldea, Asia, Egypt, Africa, Greece, in remote parts of Europe, among the Druids, Gauls, and Celto-Scythians, and in North and South America.

In the Hebrew language, stones fallen from the sky are called Bethel (Heb. "House of God"). After dreaming of a ladder reaching to heaven, Jacob called his stone pillow a Bethel-stone (Genesis 28:10-22).

"The Pagans imitated the Beth-el of Jacob and consecrated them with oil and blood, making them gods, calling them Betyles (betylus, baetyl, betyles). In classical antiquity a stone, either natural or artificially shaped, venerated as of divine origin, or as a symbol of divinity. There were a number of these sacred stones in Greece, the most famous being on the omphalos at Delphi. Likewise there were the so-called animated or oracular stones. "Strabo, Pliny, Helancius (Hellanicus) or Beth-al-Jupiter, Cybele, Venus, Mithras). The greater part of the natural Betyles were the black meteorites or fire-balls fallen from the heavens and regarded by the Sabeists as heavenly divinities. These meteorites were the Cabiri, and the Pelasgi—whose most noted worshippers were wandering or dispersed men" (The Trail of the Serpent, by Inquire Within, Boswell Publishing Co., Limited, London (1936) p. 10).

Meteorites-cults are common in Greco-Roman civilizations. According to the religious historian Mircea Eliade, the Temple of Artemis (Diana) at Ephesus contained a squat statue of the mother-goddess, carved from a meteorite that fell from Jupiter (Acts 19:26-35). The Palladium of Troy and the conic black stone or (Baetyl) of Elagabal in Emesa, Syria, are believed to be of meteoric origin. Likewise, the Phrygian mother goddess Cybele worshipped in Pessinus (later Rome) was a stone; doubtless a meteorite. A further example is the meteorite of Pessinunt in Phrygia, which was worshipped as "the needle of Cybele," brought to Rome in a powerful procession after the Punic war on advice from the Delphic oracle; there the meteorite was worshipped as a fertility goddess for further 500 years.

Hadschar al Aswad"The most famous of all of the stone fetishes of Arabia was, of course, the black stone in the sanctuary of Mecca. The Kabah was, and still is, a rectangular stone structure. Built into its Eastern corner is the black stone which had been an object of worship for many centuries before Mohammed appropriated the Kabah for his new religion, and made the pilgrimage to this holy place one of the pillars of Islam" (Mohammed: The man and his faith, Tor Andrae, 1936, Translated by Theophil Menzel, 1960, p. 13-30; Britannica, Arabian Religions, p. 1059, 1979). The "Hadschar al Aswad" in the Kabah is the most well known example of meteorite worship in newer times. Despite the prohibition of portraying God and adoration of objects, pilgrims to Mecca kiss this "Hadschar al Aswad" (black stone) which, according to the prophet is "Yamin Allah" (the right hand of God), supposedly a divine meteorite or Bethel-stone predating creation that fell at the feet of Adam and Eve. It is presently embedded in the southeastern corner of the Kabah. Muslims touch and kiss the black stone during Hajj. moongod.htm

Further information: thoroughly study the links in this file and also in The Cult of the Moon God The True Origin of 'Allah': The Archaeological Record Speaks The Vatican and Islam A History of Islam its Origins, its Rise and its Decline.

source - www.biblebelievers.org.au...

Read the source and it will give you the information that so many know is very true.



posted on Oct, 25 2017 @ 02:11 PM
link   
a reply to: Seede
My sources? Common sense, archaelogical and historical consensus (and not "biblebelievers.org.au's opinion on another religion...I mean, seriously?
) and contemporary sources. And I don't need to create fanciful conspiracy theory connections to have it all make sense.



The pagan Arabs worshipped the Moon-god Allah by praying toward Mecca several times a day

Every part of that sentence is wrong, and that's just the very first sentence, so I'm not sure how to proceed. You seem to have a fundamental lack of understanding of Islam, and then with getting snippets of info, seem to believe you got some great amazing insight, when in fact it is an incomplete picture that takes bits that are absolute basic common knowledge, and marries it with fantasy. I understand that my statements may sound condescending and belittling, but honestly, I have no idea how else to say it.

The Pagan arabs acknowledged Allah as the most-high god/head of the pantheon (certainly not the moon-god, who already existed and is documented as a separate entity), they just didn't believe in monotheism. Muhammad's mission was never to introduce them to some new religion, it was to remove all the extraneous nonsense. The creed of Islam isn't "Convert to Islam and follow Allah", it is "There is no god but God, and Muhammad is his messenger". Heck, in fact, pre-islamic (and even post-islamic) Arab Christians and Arab Jews had only one way to refer to God- as Allah. It's even like that in the pre-islamic arabic bibles. Thus you have names like "Abd Allah" (servant of God) among Christians and Jews as well. And these are documented inscriptions.

There's no conspiracy by evil westerners to discredit Islam. There's only desperate and sad attempts by religiously-motivated Christians to try their level best to deny a blatant and indelible truth: Historically, literally, etymologically, Allah is the same God as the God of Abraham and Moses and Jesus etc.
RELIGIOUSLY Christians may deny that, and sure, their Bible certainly does give them some footing in that, but you're not saying that Allah is not the God of the Bible because I believe the God of the Bible is trinity or whatever. You're saying "Nonono! It's historically Babylonian!" and that's just hilariously misguided.

I'm honestly not sure how I can help you without appearing condescending and belittling. Perhaps you can start here, and look at the references provided:
en.wikipedia.org...



posted on Oct, 25 2017 @ 07:51 PM
link   
a reply to: babloyi


My sources? Common sense, archaelogical and historical consensusText




My sources? Common sense, archaelogical and historical consensus (and not "biblebelievers.org.au's opinion on another religion...I mean, seriously? ) and contemporary sources. And I don't need to create fanciful conspiracy theory connections to have it all make sense. -
--------------

I had no idea that this thread created fanciful conspiracy theories and have shown much material that is not religious bias. If you are implying that the only authentic material is your common sense or that of Islamic sources then please do post that source. That is what I have asked you to do repeatedly. Common sense is a very contestable factor to present as evidence. We do need reliable sources but if the rules are that we cannot use Christianity then that also applies to Islamic sources as well.

I can give you a very good source [The Origins Of Sin and the Queen of Heaven] which I hope you will read with understanding.
Source - www.dhushara.com...



The Pagan arabs acknowledged Allah as the most-high god/head of the pantheon (certainly not the moon-god, who already existed and is documented as a separate entity), they just didn't believe in monotheism. Muhammad's mission was never to introduce them to some new religion, it was to remove all the extraneous nonsense. The creed of Islam isn't "Convert to Islam and follow Allah", it is "There is no god but God, and Muhammad is his messenger". Heck, in fact, pre-islamic (and even post-islamic) Arab Christians and Arab Jews had only one way to refer to God- as Allah. It's even like that in the pre-islamic arabic bibles. Thus you have names like "Abd Allah" (servant of God) among Christians and Jews as well. And these are documented inscriptions.


I do understand why you called those who acknowledged Allah as a most high god as pagans in your very first sentence. That is exactly what they were. They were polytheistic pagans. And also you are close to the truth when you say that Muhammad’s mission was not to introduce a new religion. His purpose was to embrace the Kaaba and a rock as the primary god of his choice.


Which now leads me once more into the question as to the origin of circumambulation of a shrine and a rock. Where, when and how did this start? Please give your historical source and explain if you can. I cannot find any of this most important part of Islam in the Quran and wonder why it is not important enough to be in the Quran yet important enough to overshadow all other rituals of Islam.

Historically [by reputable independent historians] I find nothing in the Jewish literature to verify this as the teachings of any Hebrew prophets of the Hebrew texts. Perhaps you may be able to reveal this to those of us that have not this source.

edit on 25-10-2017 by Seede because: correction of a word that could be offensive



posted on Oct, 25 2017 @ 11:52 PM
link   

originally posted by: babloyi
a reply to: Seede
...Heck, in fact, pre-islamic (and even post-islamic) Arab Christians and Arab Jews had only one way to refer to God- as Allah. It's even like that in the pre-islamic arabic bibles. Thus you have names like "Abd Allah" (servant of God) among Christians and Jews as well. And these are documented inscriptions.

It makes perfect sense that bible translations in Arabic and other languages use “Allah” as an equivalent for “God”, since the word “Allah” (derived from Arabic) is not a personal name but a title meaning “God.”

God has just one personal name. It is written יהוה in Hebrew and is usually rendered “Jehovah” in English (some Hebrew scholars favor the rendering “Yahweh” for God’s name). Through his prophet Isaiah, God stated: “I am Jehovah. That is my name.” (Isaiah 42:8) This name appears about 7,000 times in ancient Bible manuscripts​—far more frequently than any other term for God or, indeed, anyone else’s personal name. A shortened form of the divine name, “Jah,” appears about 50 times in the Bible, including its use in the word “Hallelujah,” or “Alleluia,” which means “Praise Jah.”​—Revelation 19:1; American Standard Version; King James Version.

Although the Bible refers to God by only one personal name, it uses many titles and descriptions for him.

There's a list here:

How Many Names Does God Have?

But perhaps more interesting in light of recent discussions in this thread, is the message from Jehovah to all mankind in Isaiah chapter 45:



Psalm 83:18 King James Version (KJV)

18 That men may know that thou, whose name alone is Jehovah, art the most high over all the earth.

American Standard Version
That they may know that thou alone, whose name is Jehovah, Art the Most High over all the earth.

New World Translation
May people know that you, whose name is Jehovah,

You alone are the Most High over all the earth.

edit on 26-10-2017 by whereislogic because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 26 2017 @ 12:18 PM
link   
a reply to: Seede

originally posted by: Seede
I had no idea that this thread created fanciful conspiracy theories and have shown much material that is not religious bias. If you are implying that the only authentic material is your common sense or that of Islamic sources then please do post that source. That is what I have asked you to do repeatedly. Common sense is a very contestable factor to present as evidence. We do need reliable sources but if the rules are that we cannot use Christianity then that also applies to Islamic sources as well.

I can give you a very good source [The Origins Of Sin and the Queen of Heaven] which I hope you will read with understanding.
Source - www.dhushara.com...


Are you serious? You're saying that's a "very good source"? That looks like a loon-site. He's talking about Yahweh and his wife Asherah and their secret fertility religion, and that Judaism, Christiantiy and Islam are fictitious fallacies. Do you believe that stuff? I tried googling Chris King, and I find nothing. No publications, no background info, just a weird site and a bunch of strange videos like this one that give off a culty feeling: www.youtube.com...
I didn't say MY common sense, I said common sense. And contemporary sources, yes, most of which are Islamic. If you have a contemporary source that is not islamic, then feel free to share it. I wasn't being facetious when I linked the Wikipedia article on "Allah". Check it out and go through the references provided. Notice how they're actual scholars and historians?


originally posted by: Seede
His purpose was to embrace the Kaaba and a rock as the primary god of his choice.


Was it now? The primary god of Islam is the kaaba and a rock? Interesting world you live in
.


originally posted by: Seede
Which now leads me once more into the question as to the origin of circumambulation of a shrine and a rock. Where, when and how did this start? Please give your historical source and explain if you can. I cannot find any of this most important part of Islam in the Quran and wonder why it is not important enough to be in the Quran yet important enough to overshadow all other rituals of Islam.

Circumambulation is the most important part of Islam so as to overshadow all other rituals? According to who? You do seem to jump to conclusions!
And I'm not sure what you're suggesting. Are you saying circumambulation is Babylonian? Because it is practiced both in Judaism and Christianity as well.

edit on 26-10-2017 by babloyi because: (no reason given)

edit on 26-10-2017 by babloyi because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2017 @ 11:49 AM
link   
a reply to: babloyi


Circumambulation is the most important part of Islam so as to overshadow all other rituals? According to who? You do seem to jump to conclusions! And I'm not sure what you're suggesting. Are you saying circumambulation is Babylonian? Because it is practiced both in Judaism and Christianity as well.


Not sure as to how you can read and misunderstand what you read. I did not say that - "Circumambulation is the most important part of Islam so as to overshadow all other rituals".

What I did say as a question is - "I cannot find any of this most important part of Islam in the Quran and wonder why it is not important enough to be in the Quran yet important enough to overshadow all other rituals of Islam."

Which now leads me once more into the question as to the origin of circumambulation of a shrine and a rock. Where, when and how did this start? Please give your historical source and explain if you can.



I find that quite realistic as it is taught to the Muslem faith that they are obligated to practice this ritual at least once in their lifespan and in order to do so must spend a lot of money and much time on this event.

So as to clarify what I wrote on this matter let me reiterate that question. I cannot find any of the ritual of circumambulating a shrine and rock of Islam in the Quran and wonder why it is not important enough to be in the Quran?



posted on Oct, 27 2017 @ 02:37 PM
link   
a reply to: Seede

"circumambulating" 7 times was pagan related to the number of star planets . I wonder if there is a relationship in the story of Jericho some how . "Jericho's name in Hebrew, Yeriẖo, is generally thought to derive from the Canaanite word Reaẖ ("fragrant"), but other theories hold that it originates in the Canaanite word for "moon" (Yareaẖ) or the name of the lunar deity Yarikh for whom the city was an early centre of worship.[18]
Jericho's Arabic name, ʼArīḥā, means "fragrant" and also has its roots in Canaanite Reaẖ "



new topics

top topics



 
7
<< 3  4  5    7 >>

log in

join