It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Looks like the Left will be destroying St. Louis tonight

page: 30
31
<< 27  28  29    31  32  33 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Sep, 18 2017 @ 10:29 AM
link   
a reply to: Grambler

/yawn

We don't have the highest opinions of each other. That's irrelevant in this discussion.

Let's move on to something productive.




posted on Sep, 18 2017 @ 10:32 AM
link   
a reply to: Boadicea

I'm sure there are gambits within feints within conundrums within the sphere of machinations of The Powers That Be.

I personally just can't see "BLM" as some uniform, predictable force. To me saying that "BLM does this or that" is the same as saying "All cops/Blacks are bad."

Anyway, glad you're here in the discussion.




posted on Sep, 18 2017 @ 10:35 AM
link   
a reply to: Gryphon66

The problem is that this starting point for the discussion is all about the police acting wrong. No doubt that much of this is true and needs to be addressed.

Thde problem is that we also need to address why these actions are happening, including looking at bad behavior on the other side.

So for example, take #13 crowd control tactics.

Perhaps they have been getting worse, but it seems that protest and counter protest people on both sides have been coming more armed, with more intent to do violence.

So instead of just focusing on the police being bad here, we should look at the picture as a whole.

Ignoring facts in favor of a racial narrative that is not backed up makes the problem worse.

So when discussing ploice shootings of black areas, we must ask why its happening. One iomportant factor is that they deal with more high violence areas in some of these black communities where these shootings occur. Another is the study showing unarmed whites are more likely to be shot.

The problem will never be solved if wwe pretend its all the cops fault and they are the only ones that need to change.



posted on Sep, 18 2017 @ 10:37 AM
link   

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: Grambler

/yawn

We don't have the highest opinions of each other. That's irrelevant in this discussion.

Let's move on to something productive.


I do not have a low opinion of you. You are one of my favorite people to talk with on ATS even though we often disagree.

I think you are passionate and smart.

I just think on this issue you are allowing your passion to view this issue one sided and ignore facts.

I am not personally upset about anything you have siad.



posted on Sep, 18 2017 @ 10:38 AM
link   
a reply to: Grambler

Great. You still make me think.

Now, let's move on.

I don't care, as long as the pointless bickering stops.

ETA: Delete pointless question.
edit on 18-9-2017 by Gryphon66 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 18 2017 @ 10:39 AM
link   
a reply to: Gryphon66


So, we've identified the issues. Shall we look at ways to solve them? And things we here can do as individuals to help with the situation?


Yes! Yes! Yes!!!

But the real world is rearing its ugly head and I have to go do real life stuff... but I will respond when I have a chance.



posted on Sep, 18 2017 @ 10:41 AM
link   
a reply to: Grambler

Fine.

Looking at "the picture as a whole" then, what do you see as the biggest issues, and what can we do about them?



posted on Sep, 18 2017 @ 10:41 AM
link   

originally posted by: Boadicea
a reply to: Gryphon66


So, we've identified the issues. Shall we look at ways to solve them? And things we here can do as individuals to help with the situation?


Yes! Yes! Yes!!!

But the real world is rearing its ugly head and I have to go do real life stuff... but I will respond when I have a chance.


I'm sure we'll be here Bo. Enjoy the day!



posted on Sep, 18 2017 @ 10:42 AM
link   
a reply to: Gryphon66


I'm sure there are gambits within feints within conundrums within the sphere of machinations of The Powers That Be.


Exactly!!!

And I'm stealing that



posted on Sep, 18 2017 @ 10:54 AM
link   

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: Grambler

Fine.

Looking at "the picture as a whole" then, what do you see as the biggest issues, and what can we do about them?


The war on drugs that I do believe disproportionately affect poor and minority people.

Policing for profit policies such as civil forfeture laws.

An unwillingness for many police to call out the bad people among their ranks.

The demonization of police by some groups.

The ignoring of communities that are incredibly violent and how that affects policing.

The politicization of the police force by all sides.

All sides ignoring facts and instead acting based only on feelings.

These are some areas to start.



posted on Sep, 18 2017 @ 10:57 AM
link   
a reply to: Grambler

Agreed. Do you have a favorite on that list?

Have at it. I'll be glad to respond as I can.



posted on Sep, 18 2017 @ 11:17 AM
link   
I'm real sorry If this guy was murdered and justice was not done for him. But, on the other hand, a cop has to assume everyone has a gun. Don't pack a gun in your car. Just the world we live in.



posted on Sep, 18 2017 @ 11:22 AM
link   
a reply to: Grambler

I said ALL along I should NEVER go into law enforcement .
Others might not not have any code or self control,to stop them,that are the same.



posted on Sep, 18 2017 @ 11:25 AM
link   

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: Grambler

Agreed. Do you have a favorite on that list?

Have at it. I'll be glad to respond as I can.


Well I think perhaps the easiest to solve would be decriminalizing marijuana, and ending forfeiture laws.

This is easiest because it would only require votes instead of changing the mindset of communities, and I feel it would help build a better relationship between police and the communities they interact with.

But honestly this is a problem that will never be fully solved, and so it is important to try to look at all sides and stick to facts as much as possible.



posted on Sep, 18 2017 @ 11:30 AM
link   


But, on the other hand, a cop has to assume everyone has a gun. Don't pack a gun in your car.


So gun or not, it doesn't matter. What matters is if an officer thinks you have a gun. People get shot because of the "thought" they had a gun.



posted on Sep, 18 2017 @ 11:42 AM
link   

originally posted by: MOMof3
I'm real sorry If this guy was murdered and justice was not done for him. But, on the other hand, a cop has to assume everyone has a gun. Don't pack a gun in your car. Just the world we live in.


I don't think Smith was murdered for the record. He tried to use his car as a deadly weapon. We could debate the minutiae of it, but that's the facts. However, it is the weird stuff that Officer Stockley did AFTER the shooting that makes this case stink, and adds to the tally in some people's minds of bad shootings.



posted on Sep, 18 2017 @ 11:45 AM
link   
a reply to: Grambler

Ending marijuana controls ... am I remembering correctly that, at least at the Federal level, there's already a process extant in law to provide a Federal "stamp" for it's purchase/use?

They just never issue the stamps.

Agree 100% on forfeiture laws ... that truly is legalized government theft.



posted on Sep, 18 2017 @ 11:49 AM
link   

originally posted by: roadgravel



But, on the other hand, a cop has to assume everyone has a gun. Don't pack a gun in your car.


So gun or not, it doesn't matter. What matters is if an officer thinks you have a gun. People get shot because of the "thought" they had a gun.


Interesting point, although I think a bit hyperbolic. In line with what the judge claimed in the Stockley trial though, essentially ... "we know Officer Stockley didn't plant the gun, because all 'urban' drug dealers have guns."

How do we see to the safety of our LEOs and the public? Is it possible to do both at once?



posted on Sep, 18 2017 @ 11:51 AM
link   
a reply to: Gryphon66

Even if the car was used as deadly weapon and failed, that doesn't mean he can be shot later as self defense after that threat is gone.

That seems to a popular "he deserved death" idea for some.

If society wants to go with that then let's change the laws, remove them, whatever, and get on with removing the "bad" people with instant justice. But beware of who then becomes the "bad" persons.



posted on Sep, 18 2017 @ 11:52 AM
link   

originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: Grambler

Ending marijuana controls ... am I remembering correctly that, at least at the Federal level, there's already a process extant in law to provide a Federal "stamp" for it's purchase/use?

They just never issue the stamps.

Agree 100% on forfeiture laws ... that truly is legalized government theft.


I am not sure on the stamp issue.

I will say one thing I didn't mention that is sort of a tangential issue is the horrendous conditions of prisons.

It is one of the things that causes me the most shame about this country.

I am sure you know that I am one who would suggest coddling violent offenders, but the fact that things like rape and torture in prisons can be chuckled about is appalling (not that I am blaming the joke maker, but the fact that these conditions exist).

This is even more insane when you look at non violent offenders that have to live in those hell holes.

These are problems that I feel we should all want fixed regardless of political beliefs, and I think would go a long way is helping communities impression of law enforcement.



new topics

top topics



 
31
<< 27  28  29    31  32  33 >>

log in

join