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NEWS: North Korea Admits It Has Nukes

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posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 07:35 AM
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Originally posted by Seekerof
Kim and North Korea have been on a road to implosion anyhow. There is no need to "invade" or provoke war. US foreign policy towards North Korea has been amounting to pretty much a containment policy that further allows favorable conditions for that implosion of Kim and North Korea. It s simply just a matter of time before his own people will take him out or remove him. Food is so scarce in North Korea, despite their increased agro-programs, that millions are dying of starvation. The people themselves will rid of Kim or a military coup will do it for the people. Conditions are and will continue to deteriorate in North Korea, it's simply amounts to taking a back seat and watching for that self-destruction (implosion).





seekerof


OH, man there ya go being all logical and full of real info. But what about that ICBM wreckage in the Pacific NW?




posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 07:40 AM
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Originally posted by DrHoracid

Originally posted by paranoia

Originally posted by DrHoracid

ALL diplomacy is stupid. Beat the enemy into submission. Total, complete surrender. They must be made to understand, pursue nukes and DIE.


That doesn't quite work though does it? when you talk about Nukes, the last thing you want to do on either side is "beat the enemy into submission". Oh dear.


It is the only way it works with nukes. Complete total destruction of the enemy before they can strike back. Overwhelming force. Negotiating only allows the enemy to gain strength. Kill it NOW.



It just isn't as simple as that. Firstly if you are implying the use of nuclear weapons the US just makes themselves lower than the North Koreans. Secondly, if the US was to 'glass' North Korea over millions of innocent people and their families and loved ones will die and I can assure you that a lot of people in South Korea and many people around the world would be horrified of the situation. If you give North Korea an ultimatum you risk the North launching a conventional hellfire against the South and Seoul and you also may place Japan at risk from missile attack. If nuclear weapons were used, you might place Japan at risk from a NK nuclear strike which would kill millions of innocent civilians on top of the US response that may come.

You must also consider the diplomatic ramifications of the US nuking the North (if that's what you were implying) : firstly international sanctions, the complete destruction of US reputation and condemnment at least and secondly the extent of response from China who I believe has 20 mobile ICBM's capable of hitting the US. China may just stay on the sideline or they may issue an appropriate response for attacking an ally.

Such an action may risk tearing international nuclear deterrence apart.

What the US needs to do and responsibly do is now that the North supposedly has nuclear weapons is to keep them from using those weapons at all cost. It's not about teaching nations a lesson or fighting against evil dictators its about keeping as many people alive as possible and ensuring global peace. This is the responsible and right thing to do.

Anyways I don't know if you were implying a nuclear strike or a conventional response but the best thing to do I think is keep the status quo on the Korean peninsula the same for the sake of peace and the sake of human life. The NK military, while equipped with lots of poor quality equipment, have a level of nationalistic fervour and patriotism instilled into them that has few equals around the world and they would not be an easy enemy to overcome.

thanks,
drfunk



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 07:47 AM
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as posted by DrHoracid
OH, man there ya go being all logical and full of real info. But what about that ICBM wreckage in the Pacific NW?

As much as I have come to your rescue here of late, I would think a little more respect would be warrented?
(just joking, then again.....)


And that wreckage is supposed to cause the US to invade North Korea, DrHoracid?
It does nothing but further pad and prove what we (the US) have been asserting all along, doesn't it? It serves as further confirmation, nothing more.

I thought I was a war-hawk. Sheeeesh! They might not even have a classification for your status DrHoracid, eh?




seekerof

[edit on 10-2-2005 by Seekerof]



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 07:49 AM
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As with Iran, what ever it takes to stop these "people" before WWIII does start. But nothing will happen........WWIII is coming no matter what.



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 07:58 AM
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Originally posted by phreak_of_nature
So it would seem as if the Bush policy has actually propelled North Korea into stepping up it's production of a nuclear bomb, which they now have completed.

Why in the world would you beleive the North Korean administration on that claim?



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 07:59 AM
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quote: Originally posted by DrHoracid

ALL diplomacy is stupid


Diplomacy is the art of saying 'nice doggie' while reaching for a suitably big rock, as they say.



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 08:15 AM
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This is all #ed. The south korean gov has been trying to calm it's people while saying there are no weapons while then giving money to poor old NK so they can get better....this is total bull #. Then our president go and talks a load of # torwards NK and doesn't expect them to try something. We should have shut those facilities down years ago. Six man navy seal teams could secure the facilities while a massive troop deployment could have secured the penninsula. This should have been the target of Bush not iraq. The threat is not from the muslim nations but from the communist nations. Anyone notice something errie about Russia wanting to form a Economic Union?



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 08:20 AM
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This is one of the best setups I have ever seen.

The Main reason, (not the only one) we went into Iraq for was to get rid of their WMDs. We didn't even know for sure if they had them, but we thought "hey, if they do, that isn't a good thing for us."

Now, Iran which is a million times worse than Iraq actually has WMDs, and North Korea, whose leader is just about the craziest Dicator since Hitler, admits to having Nukes.

Even I have to admit that we are in for a ride now. This is not looking good. Its one thing to say, OK North Korea, keep your Nukes for self defense. I just don't believe it, I think they will go after South Korea and we will have to intervene. Why we have to I'm not sure. I guess because we don't want another dictator taking over half of the world.

Iran having Nukes is just too scary to even talk about. If we decide to go in there because of this, I wouldn't send a single troop, it would be all bombs, MOABs.

All of this does go to show how useless the UN is though, doesn't it?



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 08:21 AM
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Bush’s tone was in stark contrast to three years ago, when he branded North Korea part of an “axis of evil” with Iran and Iraq, raising hopes of a positive response from North Korea. From MSN




Correct me if I'm wrong, but an "axis of evil" would imply that these countries would be talking, plotting, share similar goals for the destrustion of "their common enemy, the coalition," Right? That wasn't true a year ago and that is not true now, regardless of our brave and noble decimation of Iraq.



North Korea’s "nuclear weapons will remain (a) nuclear deterrent for self-defense under any circumstances," the ministry said. "The present reality proves that only powerful strength can protect justice and truth." from MSN


Since we all have been to North Korea and know Kim well enough to firmly state his insanity, let's take a look at the crap we know has come out of his mouth. The interesting part of the above quote is where it implies North Korea has "justice and truth." Now, I personally, knowing Kim as well as I do, will not vouch for his embodiment of either of those qualities. But neither can I vouch for the adverse either.

The only way I can make any kind of judgement on a world leader of any kind is through their respective public relations.

Which do I believe, the one who says he's good or the one says he's bad?

Neither. I choose to take a look at the statement above where it says," protect justice and truth." Two guesses on who else hears that and how much more they have heard that than we have. The Korean population probably contains the same rift of opinion on their leader that the U.S. does. The difference is that our President has lied, either from omission, ignorance, or intention. Our President has stuck himself on the top shelf with no way to get down. Their leader only needs to point and cry foul(the concern of Bush's increasingly more aggresive nature and subsequent fear); he is justified in that sense, regardless of anything else.

Now, because we all here have such extensive experience with the media's portrayel of world events and their subsequent players, why don't we treat our impressions like logic statements? Why don't we pick apart the sentences that comprise our intake of information and use our discerning minds? Because the knee-jerk reaction has lead us into a quick branding of every other nation as below the wonderfully good intentions of our obviously great nation.....Come on, even Condy wasn't surprised and she just recently sat at the table...............



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 08:22 AM
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speaking of troops, the best diplomatic coup North Korea could pull off is covertly capture Osama Bin Laden and parade him on TV to the world. Could you imagine what would happen at the white house and in the US if this would happen?

thanks,
drfunk



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 08:28 AM
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Originally posted by Seekerof

as posted by DrHoracid
OH, man there ya go being all logical and full of real info. But what about that ICBM wreckage in the Pacific NW?

As much as I have come to your rescue here of late, I would think a little more respect would be warrented?
(just joking, then again.....)


And that wreckage is supposed to cause the US to invade North Korea, DrHoracid?
It does nothing but further pad and prove what we (the US) have been asserting all along, doesn't it? It serves as further confirmation, nothing more.

I thought I was a war-hawk. Sheeeesh! They might not even have a classification for your status DrHoracid, eh?




seekerof

[edit on 10-2-2005 by Seekerof]


I am a non-combatant differal.....a pacifist........everyone knows it too. Teddy R had it right with "speak softly and carry a big stick". Ok so I leave out the speak softly part...........

Back on subject...Why would Kimmy Poo make this announcment?



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 09:22 AM
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MIND CONTROL
The problem in PRK is that Kim has everyone believing that the west along with Japan have some sort of perfidious plan of enslaving all the Koreans by "Western Capitalists" and that it is better to die with hunger than to live in servitude. We have to break this myth and show them that it is in all our best interests that they adopt the democratic model of peace, prosperity and dignity.
Its not that they can't see that this is true because their are so many N. Koreans trying to seek asylum in Japan, S.Korea and other neighboring countries. We shouldn't blame the people of N.Korea, they live in a country ruled by an oppressive dictator who will go to any length to ensure his power even if means that his country slowly dies in the process.

I don't think that if we leave things the way they are the people will somehow stage a coup and oust KIM because he has the whole country in his palm and even his generals who have considerable power are scared of him, moreover the system there in N.Korea isn't even a proper Communist country-that’s just a facade to please the Chinese- its more like cult based family operated criminal enterprise, from one egocentric supremacist to another, generation after generation.


We need a democratic voice in N.Korea, a voice that is ready to do anything for the sake of freedom and prosperity. Through them lies our best chance of liberating those people from their misery. It shouldn't just a tactical move for the US but also a humanitarian move that will end suffering and give hope to those people, in that way we gain good will+saftey, which is the best outcome. Our military is doing all it can to clean up the mess that the world has turned into due to our complacence, we must now try a different approach- one that the intelligence community should take the leading role, you can't just send in marines to solve every problem because we don't have enough of them!! Heck! If we can turn the USSR we can do it in the PRk as well.

Then comes the problem with China, the dark lord waiting for the right opportunity to come out of the shadows and light the fuse [cliche!
]
But don't you think that it is kind of weird that even when the international community tries its best to coerce N.Korea to come clean it still manages to hold out. I am sure that the Chinese were the ones who gave the N.koreans the nukes in the first place and helped them along the way.
The N.Koreans must have ties with powerful Chinese politicians and must be conducting all their nefarious activities through china. N.Korea earns most of its national income from a economy of drugs, counterfeiting, prostitution, missile sales etc.
The Chinese have seen to it that the PRK gets WMD and make sure that they can hold off any potential American attack. If we remember our history we know that during the Korean war the Chinese supported the north and still do to this day. The real evil here is China, once we string China by the neck then we would have solved much of the nuclear proliferation problem.

Chinese & North Korean Nuclear Nexus
www.rcnetwork.net...
news.bbc.co.uk...



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 09:27 AM
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You have voted IAF101 for the Way Above Top Secret award. You have one more vote left for this month.

Very well done...........



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 09:49 AM
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China is a neutral state that does want North Korea to support buidling nuclear weapons. Just because the two states are communist, does not mean there is a "conspiracy" between the two. Secondly, i can see China has become a popular topic throughout ATS in the last months. Are the Americans jealous that another country will take over from them?? whats wrong?? jealous that China will be the next superpower??? AWWWWWW poor America...

China is a peaceful nation that will not cause any threat to America. The US propapganda, which is be aimed at China, is perthetic. I cannot see China attacking the US in the future or being the "dark player" in the world. I am put up an offer to any member of ATS to prove to me, with actual facts, that China is planning to or going to attack America.

Finally, do you really want a war with North Korea?? this is a country that does not give a damn if they get destroyed. All this is, is an attention seeking game by the North Koreans to gain international attention. Bush probably doesnt want a war with North Korea, only if its last option, due to the fact that it would envolve Nulcear weapons and the loss of life would be beyond words.



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 09:56 AM
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Originally posted by DrHoracid
N Korea has nukes now. They also have a very large standing army. They need to be "stopped" before they can do anymore damage. If that means crazy Kim alone or the entire population it needs to be done and soon.

Anyone else see the irony in the moronic yahoo using the phrase "crazy Kim"?



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 09:59 AM
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So now everyone wants to deal with North Korea. Their public declaration now has world leaders scrambling to bring North Korea back to the multi-nation talks. And I'm betting this is exactly what North Korea wants. A publically acknowledged nuclear North Korea is now a force to be taken seriously, and carries more weight in negotiations.

Recently Kofi Annan, Jack Straw, Condoleeza Rice, and the Chinese and Russian Foreign Ministers have all urged North Korea to return to negotiations.

If I were a gambling man, I would expect North Korea to continue to shun negotiations for several more weeks, and then appear to reluctantly agree.


news.yahoo.com
Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice said the North had no reason to believe the United States would attack.

"The North Koreans have been told by the president of the United States that the United States has no intention of attacking or invading North Korea," Rice said in Luxembourg. "There is a path for the North Koreans that would put them in a more reasonable relationship with the rest of the world."

In London, U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan also urged North Korea to rejoin the talks, and he asked the other five nations to help.

"I expect that with efforts by the other countries involved, North Korea could be brought back to the table," Annan said following talks with British Prime Minister Tony Blair and Foreign Secretary Jack Straw.

Russia's Foreign Ministry criticized North Korea's statement and strongly urged it to return to the negotiations.

North Korea's move "can only cause regret," the ministry said, adding that Moscow respects Pyongyang's concern about its safety but believes "that the problem should be resolved through negotiations rather than arms race, especially nuclear arms race."

The Chinese Foreign Ministry's chief spokesman, Kong Quan, said in a statement on the ministry's Web site that Beijing hopes the six-nation talks will continue.

"We consistently advocate the denuclearization of the Korean peninsula and the preservation of the peninsula's peace and stability," the statement said.



Please visit the link provided for the complete story.



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 10:02 AM
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China has Wal-mart, so we won't be invading anytime soon.

As far as NK, the only thing that scares me is the missle part found in Alaska. You could envision a Pearl Harbor 2005/2006 if we pushed too hard in NK. The thought a country we are currently pissing off has access to our West Coast (could that be the deterent that keeps us from invading ?) with nuclear weapons is more than a little scary. I say pull all our troops in SK (shich we have been doing) and leave it to China and Russai to sort this sh#t out.

I am waiting for a nuclear test in Iran this year also just to spice things up.



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 10:04 AM
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Originally posted by infinite
China is a neutral state that does want North Korea to support buidling nuclear weapons. Just because the two states are communist, does not mean there is a "conspiracy" between the two. Secondly, i can see China has become a popular topic throughout ATS in the last months. Are the Americans jealous that another country will take over from them?? whats wrong?? jealous that China will be the next superpower??? AWWWWWW poor America...

China is a peaceful nation that will not cause any threat to America. The US propapganda, which is be aimed at China, is perthetic. I cannot see China attacking the US in the future or being the "dark player" in the world. I am put up an offer to any member of ATS to prove to me, with actual facts, that China is planning to or going to attack America.

Finally, do you really want a war with North Korea?? this is a country that does not give a damn if they get destroyed. All this is, is an attention seeking game by the North Koreans to gain international attention. Bush probably doesnt want a war with North Korea, only if its last option, due to the fact that it would envolve Nulcear weapons and the loss of life would be beyond words.

Allow me to play Devil's Advocate for a moment... and allow me to preface my statements by saying that I don't completely disagree with your statements.

BUT

China will most likely not engage in direct warfare with the US, the same way the USSR never directly engaged in warfare with the US, but during the cold war the US and USSR did fight a couple of proxy wars.

The possibility of an upcoming roe over Tawain may wind up being yet another proxy war.

Just something to think on.

EDIT: Additional thoughts.
If China sees the US as becoming too involved in the Taiwan situation, they may well decided to discretly back North Korea.

Although I like to think that at this point China is operating with Good Faith on the North Korea issue.

[edit on 2/10/2005 by phreak_of_nature]



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 10:37 AM
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lets just go bomb those stupid sons of @#$%$#



posted on Feb, 10 2005 @ 10:58 AM
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North Korea claims it has nuclear weapons.

Even if true..... that now makes a nuclear conflict ok because?



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