Irreducible complexity and Evolution

originally posted by: TheMZA
Yes in order to explain it atheists must make up stories about animals that don't exist. Just like in that bible thing

What does this mean???

a reply to: mOjOm

Kind of looks like a telegraphed "all scientists are atheists" fallacy. The usual beginning of "why evolution is against gods plan" fallacy. I could be wrong.

I am guessing that animals that do not exist would be the "we do not see transitory forms" fallacy too?

Basically we've either got a bad troll (an ineffectual troll) or a zombie (brain free) Creationist

EDIT: Oh its a brand new account, what a shock /sarc

originally posted by: Noinden
a reply to: mOjOm

Kind of looks like a telegraphed "all scientists are atheists" fallacy. The usual beginning of "why evolution is against gods plan" fallacy. I could be wrong.

I am guessing that animals that do not exist would be the "we do not see transitory forms" fallacy too?

Basically we've either got a bad troll (an ineffectual troll) or a zombie (brain free) Creationist

EDIT: Oh its a brand new account, what a shock /sarc

You forgot the brand new account fallacy.

a reply to: TheMZA

It is not a fallacy neighbour, the account is new. Meaning you are either new here, or an old face with new knitted hosiery

None the less you can't deny the comments I made. QED, you are either a ineffective Troll, or a Zealot with no thoughts which are origional.

Oh and no I'm not an Atheist. Yes I am a Scientist. Oh and I've worked in the field of Evolution.

a reply to: Noinden

Oh and the concept of Zero point energy shows something can come from "nothing". Quantum particles are tricksy things.

Allow me to illuminate you.

The meaning of life, the universe and everything is the evolution of consciousness.

There! now you have it.

Wasn't that hard to understand was it

This is pythagorean science, and Plato was a pythagorean as where many of the great philosophers.

Science has yet to discovered the atom. it is the smallest indivisible particle in creation and is indestructible. The monad, the single unit that makes up the stuff of all creation, not actually a string conceptually, but its behaviour during involution could make it appear that way.

Monads enter into the physical universe at every point in physical space, creation did not stop 14 billion(far far longer) years ago, it is an ongoing process, as galaxies are pushed apart, solar systems are pushed apart from a flux of particles constantly steaming into the dense physical world. The universe is filling up with the breath of brahma, as the Vedic's would explain.

Because monads arrive in different flavours, spin rate and angle are affected, as they approach this density of matter,
The combination of various states of the monad, dictate how they conglomerate and how its nucleus is formed and which noble gas will manifest.

A single hydrogen atom is composed of tens of thousands of monads. It is the laws of physics that create everything else, from the element factories we call stars.

Thus creation

Everything is conscious to some degree.

Every monad has dormant or active consciousness. the consciousness you are aware of started to become aware billions of years ago.

There are enough monads in the physical atoms of your monitor to occupy an entire galaxy, if they had all evolved to a level of awareness to manifest as biological life, which everything must eventually over trillions of years.

Humans have no appreciation for how far we have come. There are so few of us in existence and yet we are only just emerging out of the mud.

Reality check ....We are not special. We are just one of billions of conscious species throughout the galaxy and beyond all making the same journey home.

The same process of evolution happens in every planet and life exists on every planet.

The first occupants of Earth where etherial, and over eons learned to manifest, you could view the physical world as the final frontier for intelligence that has always existed in finer densities. With their science they built biological forms to occupy this inhospitable reality and is an ongoing process.

Everything is in constant flux, as streams of monads replace those in the physical world, like a conveyor belt from the finest to the coarsest shedding monads as they ascend into ever finer worlds and attracting them as they descend into the courser physical world.

Everything is matter, even our intangible minds. Conscious matter in motion, is all there is.

The remainder, science understands. The current stumbling block is our inability to detect finer states of matter that exists in our physical dimension, it is not hidden, and occupies every space and is the interface between this world and the next..

Higgs bosun is a misunderstood concept that can only be understood from the vantage point of a finer dimension. The field that gives mass to particles within the physical dimension IS the physical dimension.

The outer skin of the onion, the most outer dimension where everything slows down to gross physical manifestation. it doesn't get any denser than the heaviest elements that exist in the physical world.

The only way out of here for your consciousness, is to become objectively aware that you are not here in the first place, and that requires for you to evolve into awareness. All of us should be encouraged by the knowledge that we are at the pinnacle of awareness possible, in our human form, unless you have attained causal knowledge.

All of us are on our final steps towards the next natural kingdom. Good and evil is a necessary painful step on the journey toward evolutionary enlightenment. This event is cyclical and is called ascension, which is still millions of year away.

Our scientific knowledge will become the vehicle for the accelerated evolution of humanity, as we approach the end of our journey in this density. To give you some idea of the time this takes, it is said, it requires around 150,000 human manifestations to pass through the human kingdom, Most of us have exceeded 100,000 human lives.

So chin up, chaps, we still have a way to go. Every one of us, are going to know this when we die, it really is business as usual.

Imagine the suffering that will be spared to humanity, when science figures this out, we are waiting for you people, but you have filled up libraries of incorrect information. Not that it matters beyond the suffering, which is illusory and the time it takes for you to evolve to the point, where you can objectively measure the size of a single monad with its source (49) ever finer dimensions away.

in a nutshell, science and all of its intelligence will never understand reality, until scientists themselves have evolved to be able to objectively see, ALL the dimension we reside in, and when you become 'that aware' you will be omniscient.

The best science can hope to achieve at our level, is intellectually agreed subjective understanding.

Quantum physics could be correctly renamed as the the physics of consciousness, because that is what you are looking at.

Scientific understanding of the physical laws, brings you technology, cool! makes life fun but ultimately useless.

There is nothing science can invent, that your consciousness wont manifest once you have evolved.

Medicine is blind, in the working of the human body and hasn't even started to understand the mind.

And don't gloat about modern medicine. How much suffering has been subjected onto conscious entities while pharmaceutical companies experimented on them.

They create compounds that re-channel energies in parts of the body, to affect a change. Just pinch off a part energy flow and there!, you feel much better now don't you.

Oh! and they didn't discover this by applying intellect, they did it through trial and error, on beings, who are destined to be human one day.

The degree of suffering we cause through our ignorance, is a barrier to our growth because all energies must balance and the more suffering we cause the more we experience.

Your information is so incomplete, but it is all you have. Even atom smashed in a collider, produce tennis ball size particles comprised of millions of primal atoms (monads).

Please read this knowledge for yourself.

It is taking a long time to disseminate this knowledge, simply because people are not ready.

READ THIS introduction and then study Laurency, then you will know.

You will find it intellectually challenging. The entire work is many thousands of pages.

As a tenable working hypothesis of TOE, it is peerless and is a treasure of knowledge.

So NoInden, go too it, if you think you are up to the challenge.

a reply to: kennyb72

Kenny are you trained in science? Because all I am seeing is that you are hostile to it, and ignorant of it.

a reply to: Noinden

Kenny are you trained in science? Because all I am seeing is that you are hostile to it, and ignorant of it.

If that is ALL you are seeing, I suggest you re-read what I have explained and attempt to break through your mental barrier that is stopping you from seeing reality.

You are ignorant of the reality of life and that is not your fault, I am not hostile to science AT ALL, it is an incremental process of discovery using the intellect we have developed and is honourable pursuit.

We still have a way to go.

What I am hostile against is the assumption that we understand life and THAT assumption is causing suffering.

This assumption is inextricably linked to the human ego and the ego will dominate until we evolve.

I know far more about science and evolution in a lay-mans terms, than you understand about our super physical existence.

Study the material and test your own intellectual limits,

The very process will assist your evolution.


There are no more quick one liner debunks in this argument, all of you are coming from the same place of ego. If any of you have the courage to swallow your prides, you will see the truth with your own eyes.

a reply to: kennyb72

Neighbour, you seem to be having the mental blocks. I'm an occultist and a Scientist.

You however are just throwing some pop words around, and trying to seem as if you are an expert in these things.

So no matter how much you try to make it about me. The fact remains, you do not understand that ID, and CI are not things. They are pseudosciences.

I have done more than "quick one liners" to debunk you. You did not address those points, hence I will not engage in depth.

QED.

a reply to: kennyb72

Also old bean, do you no what a noinden is? Don't anglicize it eh.

I've also not brought my understanding of the occult and mystical (thus spiritual world) into this for a couple of reasons.

(a) We are talking science, and only science. Thus I will talk to that
(b)There are people hostile to my spiritual path here, and for the *ghosti of ATS I will not engage into that fight.

a reply to: Noinden

Neighbour, you seem to be having the mental blocks. I'm an occultist and a Scientist.

You however are just throwing some pop words around, and trying to seem as if you are an expert in these things.

So no matter how much you try to make it about me. The fact remains, you do not understand that ID, and CI are not things. They are pseudosciences.

I have done more than "quick one liners" to debunk you. You did not address those points, hence I will not engage in depth.

I just see ego, and hard earned ego at that, I won't bother to communicate with you again unless YOU do some research.

At least we will be on the same page . You may be an occultist but you know nothing about esoterics and yes compared to your knowledge of it, I am an expert.

Knowledge always goes from general to specific, you are very good with specifics, its just that your general is incorrect.

Double post

a reply to: kennyb72

You say ego as if it is a bad thing. To work science, or magic, one needs to have ego.

You also parrot words back at me. Which is the obvious sign of a weak debater

I don't talk very often here about my esoteric knowledge. You would not understand it I am thinking.

Now lets get to your own ego.

"You are an expert".

Yet you did not know what noinden stands for (waits for you to try to google it). How about:

An Fhirinne?
Dluth?
Dan?
Sli?
Coir?
Oineach?
Bealach d'aimhleasa? Does this lead to Diach?
Dúile vs the 4 classical elements vs the earth sea sky trinity? Where is the place to put Imbas/Awen?

Whence comes Bua? and whence comes Bri?

What is the realtionship between:

Coire Goriath, Coire Ermai, and Coire Sois, with the 7 major Chakra?

How about how many correspondences are there to each fid? What use do the forfeda have?

Shall we continue?

a reply to: Noinden

Without studying your religion (I have enough fictions to contend with) I think I can safely say that it bears the hall mark of all religions, It is watered down ancient knowledge, philosophies and ritual. All of which originated from the same source. There is only ONE reality of life and if you devoted the time to study it you will see perfectly how your occult beliefs fit into that framework and more importantly why.

a reply to: kennyb72

But wait you are the "expert" in esoterics here... you say so!

Prove that it is all from the same source neighbour. Go on, show how that is the case. Or will you continue with your little intellectual masturbation, which really is the way you try to gas light people

There are many spiritual paths, and they all do not come from the same place. This is the gnosis which I propose. Unless you can bring eídein to bear, then you can not prove it. You can only beat your chest.

However this thread is based on the pseudo science which is called Irreducible complexity. This is a pseudoscience due to the fact it sets itself up to be non-falsifiable. Just as Creationism.Intellegent Design does. QED it is not an alternative to evolution. You can not experimentally confirm or deny it. Thus evolution is the answer still.

a reply to: Noinden

I will tell you quite clearly and very loudly so as to elucidate your very confused mind.

The truth can NEVER be falsified The very concept is laughable.

I actually gave you more credit than you deserve, your manner is uncivilised, although I am sure you are more evolved than you appear.

a reply to: kennyb72

Sigh and thus you demonstrate that Science is an anathema to you.

Falsafiability (aka refutability) is a central idea in Science. You don't understand why. It is clear. You need to be able to test it. The inability to refute it (or attempt to) is non-falsafiability. Which is not scientific.

Truth is a non-scientific idea. Your idea of truth is subjective not deductive.

Once again, you are confusing gnosis with eídein. One you feel ("its the truth") the other is something you can quantitate (its 1.84 m long, and weighs 50 kg).

You suck at this.

a reply to: Noinden

LOL, goodby Noinden, I have given you a treasure and so I have done my little part in helping YOU to evolve.

The path is there for you in the linked PDF, it is an introduction, I am still on my journey of growing awareness as are we all. When you finally realise that we are the same, your perspective will change.

I quite like you! I hope you make something of it.

a reply to: kennyb72

There is that ego again neighbour. You have not given me anything. You are on Bealach d'aimhleasa most certainly. Also your Palpatine impression needs work.

My path is separate from yours, and you still have not proven all paths are the same. I'm waiting bee boy.

Slan leat (don't let the door hit your arse)

a reply to: Noinden

You are so rude, lol

God bless you mate!

a reply to: kennyb72

Neighbour, I've not been rude yet. I've been forthright.

Like I said, you are on bealach d'aimhleasa. You are persisting in something (attempts to explain science, using your ideas, which are not scientific, and the ideas of pseudosciences) which you have no tallent for. It appears from the feavered nature of your posts, you are getting diach from it.

Which deity would be blessing me bee boy?