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Antifa Violence FINALLY Covered On MSNBC.

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posted on Aug, 28 2017 @ 11:43 PM
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The thing is, you are stereotyping all liberals and claiming we all have it coming. Like apparently this reporter, I protested Bush Jr. for the Iraq War. i've even worked on legitimate social justice projects and activism. However, I've also pushed back against the ascendancy of more extreme identity politics views and divisiveness. Not all of us people "for justice" are supporting extremists or not calling out "sjws." In fact, many of us think they are harming the cause. a reply to: loam




posted on Aug, 28 2017 @ 11:50 PM
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a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14


You sound like a "classic" liberal. I respect and love you all. You're being silenced as well.



posted on Aug, 28 2017 @ 11:53 PM
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originally posted by: Wookiep
a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14


You sound like a "classic" liberal. I respect and love you all. You're being silenced as well.


"Classic liberalism", by that I mean liberalism, is now a conservative position. Liberalism itself is under attack by a variety of sides and those with the conservative instinct, myself included, need to defend it.



posted on Aug, 29 2017 @ 12:09 AM
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Well thank you for that. There is some truth to that. All of these definitions are getting warped by modern discourse.

I do agree with some that these identity politics folks are going off the rails, and ironically while claiming the mantle of progressivism they are attacking classical enlightenment principles such as free speech, rationalism, debate, empiricism, etc, things that to me are the bedrock of not only progress but determining truth and effective solutions, let alone scientific research.

It's true that we are being silenced, under the establishment corporate wing of the Dems now we are being called "racists" or "privileged" for supporting such concepts, when ironically many of us are calling out corruption, division, corportatocracy, etc. But this silencing is because establishment powers have found identity politics to be a useful way to divide people and distract people from looking at the real oligarchic powers.

By the way, I saw Bernie Sanders speak tonight in NYC, and he was amazing. He really is a *real* unitive classical liberal, not an establishment crony. He had standing ovations the whole time.
a reply to: Wookiep


edit on 29-8-2017 by Quetzalcoatl14 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 29 2017 @ 12:10 AM
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a reply to: TheTory

Exactly. The only reason that has happened tho, is due to the extremists. The media ran with it. But the democratic party will cease to exist unless people like you take it back.



posted on Aug, 29 2017 @ 12:16 AM
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I think it depends on whether you mean economic liberalism or social, although the two aren't mutually exclusive. Economic liberalism actually and ironically is what conservatives now propound, i.e. deregulation and free market capitalism. That's why right wing economics are often called "neo-liberal." However, that doesn't necessarily compute as "liberal" in the way we think of the term regarding socially liberal. Strangely, many right wingers excepting libertarians often focus on non-free concepts of personal behavior, sex, drugs, religion, and go for heavy government regulation of such and an obedience to tradition, rather than personal freedom or personal interpretation. This is why all of these terms get dicey and cease to have meaning after a while. It might be fair to say that modern day "liberals" want to regulate business and environment but have basically libertarian personal freedom, where at times it seems conservatives want the opposite. a reply to: TheTory


edit on 29-8-2017 by Quetzalcoatl14 because: (no reason given)

edit on 29-8-2017 by Quetzalcoatl14 because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 29 2017 @ 12:28 AM
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originally posted by: Quetzalcoatl14

Well thank you for that. There is some truth to that. All of these definitions are getting warped by modern discourse.

I do agree with some that these identity politics folks are going off the rails, and ironically while claiming the mantle of progressivism they are attacking classical enlightenment principles such as free speech, rationalism, debate, empiricism, etc, things that to me are the bedrock of not only progress but determining truth and effective solutions, let alone scientific research.

It's true that we are being silenced, under the establishment corporate wing of the Dems now we are being called "racists" or "privileged" for supporting such concepts, when ironically many of us are calling out corruption, division, corportatocracy, etc. But this silencing is because establishment powers have found identity politics to be a useful way to divide people and distract people from looking at the real oligarchic powers.

By the way, I saw Bernie Sanders speak tonight in NYC, and he was amazing. He really is a *real* unitive classical liberal, not an establishment crony. He had standing ovations the whole time.
a reply to: Wookiep



The problem is there is no method to the madness, which is a testament to the fact that there is no principles at work underneath. They are really neither left nor right, but mostly authoritarian, even extremist. They are immediate threats to our liberal democracies, regardless of politics.



posted on Aug, 29 2017 @ 12:32 AM
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a reply to: Quetzalcoatl14

That's all very true. But by liberalism I mean in general the values of the enlightenment. Liberalism has a different connotation in the US, I am well-aware.



posted on Aug, 29 2017 @ 12:36 AM
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I think that I can agree that any force trying to undermine rationalism, free speech, logic, respectful discourse, the merits of arguments not just identity, etc, is an existential threat. These ideas are a bedrock to modern society, the scientific method, empiricism, and so on.

I disagree with you that there is no method to that madness however. There are elements of post-modernism, critical race theory, sociology, and even anthropology in the identity politics discourse. It's this idea that there is no truth and only identity and one's place within the hierarchy of oppression defines the truth of one's arguments. I don't agree with it, but there is a whole philosophy to it.

This is worth reading. observer.com...

a reply to: TheTory


edit on 29-8-2017 by Quetzalcoatl14 because: (no reason given)



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