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Most Americans live paycheck to paycheck

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posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 06:00 AM
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I say it's thanks to this insidious thing called trickle down economics.

Which is proven to be a complete lie.

What has actually happened is wealth has moved upwards into the hands of the elite instead of going down as it was allegedly supposed to (I think it worked exactly as planned but that's for a different day).

The rich don't spend their money, they don't invest their money in anything worthwhile, they merely hoard it out of the hands of the proles they spit on.

Either the state must intervene to correct this, or the people will inevitably rise up, shoot the rich and take their wealth by force since they won't be able to afford to even eat while the rich live in palaces and eat like Kings every day.

Wealth inequality in the West is worse than it was during Victorian times, it won't take long before it winds up being like Tzarist Russia.




posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 06:31 AM
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a reply to: toysforadults

My financial struggles as of late aren't due to the rising cost of living necessarily but due to some unexpected medical and legal issues that wiped out my savings and then some. I borrowed over the past two years to cover shortfalls of lost wages, medical bills (deductibles etc) and have gone back into construction/remodeling as a supplemental income to my regular 50+ hour a week job. I'm fortunate to be healthy enough at my age to do this. I'm seeing the light at the end of the tunnel.
I've never really been one to 'keep up with the Jones' although I do like nice things. I do have two teenage daughters and things get more expensive as you go along. They do work but, I try to help them where needed. They certainly don't earn enough, yet, to support themselves at 100%.
I think that one can think they are prepared (I know that I did) for inevitable and unexpected events but, when your savings gets wiped...well, let's just say that I find it stressful to not have any or not enough.
So, I'll keep on keeping on until I get back on track. It's good for me to work a lot, what would be the alternative?



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 08:15 AM
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originally posted by: toysforadults
a reply to: Edumakated

The job market demands a degree.


Yes, but that doesnt mean you need to go into debt to get one. As i stated, there are only a handful of schools worth getting into debt. Unless yiu go to one of those schools (ivy league and other peer schools), you shkuld be getting a scholarship, working, taking on minimal debt because the degrees from the lesser schools are not going to open any signifiacnt doors to justidy the debt.



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 08:35 AM
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originally posted by: Edumakated

originally posted by: toysforadults
a reply to: Edumakated

The job market demands a degree.


Yes, but that doesnt mean you need to go into debt to get one. As i stated, there are only a handful of schools worth getting into debt. Unless yiu go to one of those schools (ivy league and other peer schools), you shkuld be getting a scholarship, working, taking on minimal debt because the degrees from the lesser schools are not going to open any signifiacnt doors to justidy the debt.


I agree, but there's one part to a degree that most ignore and that's the cost of living. Even while attending college your room and board is going to make up more than 50% of your expenses and that's something people rarely look at. They see the cost of tuition is $15k, or $20k, or whatever and budget for that all the while ignoring that just living is going to cost at least as much.

I think a lot of people who are interested in college would be better served by moving to lower cost of living areas to get their education. It won't be a top name degree, but you'll still learn, and you'll save a bunch of money. Even if you do have to take loans, that loan money will go further, and you'll have the option of moving to a higher COL area to pay it back faster after graduation.



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 09:00 AM
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originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: Edumakated

originally posted by: toysforadults
a reply to: Edumakated

The job market demands a degree.


Yes, but that doesnt mean you need to go into debt to get one. As i stated, there are only a handful of schools worth getting into debt. Unless yiu go to one of those schools (ivy league and other peer schools), you shkuld be getting a scholarship, working, taking on minimal debt because the degrees from the lesser schools are not going to open any signifiacnt doors to justidy the debt.


I agree, but there's one part to a degree that most ignore and that's the cost of living. Even while attending college your room and board is going to make up more than 50% of your expenses and that's something people rarely look at. They see the cost of tuition is $15k, or $20k, or whatever and budget for that all the while ignoring that just living is going to cost at least as much.

I think a lot of people who are interested in college would be better served by moving to lower cost of living areas to get their education. It won't be a top name degree, but you'll still learn, and you'll save a bunch of money. Even if you do have to take loans, that loan money will go further, and you'll have the option of moving to a higher COL area to pay it back faster after graduation.


Yes, a lot of kids want to move away from home. While this is understandable, it also raises the cost of attending school. I basically lived at home when I was in college. I stayed on campus freshman year in dorms, but afterwards, I moved in with my Grandmother (she had a basement apartment) to save money. Even after I graduated and was making a significant income for a recent college grad, I continued to live with her to save money.

There is nothing wrong with going to college, but the reality is a significant number of kids would be better off without going as they don't have the aptitude for it (this is apparent as something like 50% of college freshmen needs remedial courses). In addition, many students would be better off attending cheaper schools closer to home as they aren't attending a "top tier" school so it makes no sense to spend a lot of money on the degree as employers aren't going to give it any special consideration.



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 09:02 AM
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I clearly remember the business community, CEOs, pushing college to get the good jobs for years. I guess they got enough of that money now stashed away.



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 09:26 AM
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originally posted by: MOMof3
I clearly remember the business community, CEOs, pushing college to get the good jobs for years. I guess they got enough of that money now stashed away.


The reality is that most corporate office jobs don't really require a degree. It just makes it easier to ensure that you get a somewhat smart person for the job. Requiring the degree is risk adverse.

Put it this way. A Harvard grad is more likely to get some jobs than say a community college grad. Why? On average, a Harvard grad is smarter than a community college grad. Is this always the case? No. But when you have limited time and resources and you need to hire someone, all things being equal, you are going to go with the Harvard grad. It is less risky.

This is all companies are doing when they require college degrees. When someone has graduated from college, you know that person is 1) reasonably intelligent and can learn and 2) can start and finish a task. Their degree is a signal to these attributes and thus to keeps things simple and easy, companies just say we want college grads because they don't have the time and resources to individual evaluate every last person that applies for a job.

Of course, there are always exceptions to the rule. I mean I know some Harvard grads that are certified morons, but the vast majority I've met are smarter than average. I also know some folks who didn't go to college who are extremely intelligent and hard workers, but I also know a ton who I wouldn't trust to take out my garbage.



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 09:35 AM
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originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: annoyedpharmacist
If I continue to save at this rate, and the market doesnt fall apart, I should have over 750,000 to retire on. The only trade off is that my take home is significantly less than it could be......so sometimes I do not have a huge margin for error. But I will take that, to ensure a comfortable retirement.


750k won't last you very long in retirement. You will have to work to supplement that.


It really depends on where he retires and what kind of lifestyle he wants to live. Right now, where I live, my lifestyle costs me about $25K a year. $750K would last me 30 years at that rate.



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 09:36 AM
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One change that I'd make to our tax code is the mortgage interest deduction. I don't think you should be able to write it off. Instead, their needs to be a mortgage PRINCIPAL deduction. The tax code shouldn't be encouraging people to take on more debt, but instead encouraging people paying it off. Of course, the banksters would go nuts over this change.



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 09:38 AM
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originally posted by: TNMockingbird
a reply to: toysforadults

My financial struggles as of late aren't due to the rising cost of living necessarily but due to some unexpected medical and legal issues that wiped out my savings and then some. I borrowed over the past two years to cover shortfalls of lost wages, medical bills (deductibles etc) and have gone back into construction/remodeling as a supplemental income to my regular 50+ hour a week job. I'm fortunate to be healthy enough at my age to do this. I'm seeing the light at the end of the tunnel.
I've never really been one to 'keep up with the Jones' although I do like nice things. I do have two teenage daughters and things get more expensive as you go along. They do work but, I try to help them where needed. They certainly don't earn enough, yet, to support themselves at 100%.
I think that one can think they are prepared (I know that I did) for inevitable and unexpected events but, when your savings gets wiped...well, let's just say that I find it stressful to not have any or not enough.
So, I'll keep on keeping on until I get back on track. It's good for me to work a lot, what would be the alternative?


You are the people we're talking about when we qualify our comments with "but there are some people who are legitimately struggling". You are the type of person social safety programs are supposed to support. You had savings, were living within your means, but still got into trouble. If there weren't so many idiots who abuse the social programs, there would be more money available to help people with legitimate need. This is another reason why we need bigtime reform in a lot of these programs.



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 09:43 AM
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a reply to: Edumakated

This sounds nice, but in reality it would just encourage people to buy even more expensive houses that they don't need. We already have people making 40, 50K trying to buy houses that are really for people making twice that much, and if you try to tell them otherwise you're a hater and trying to keep them from pursuing their dreams and all kinds of nonsense. We need to change people's attitudes about how they spend money and how they see their needs vs. their wants. We don't need to be enabling their bad habits even more.



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 09:49 AM
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originally posted by: face23785

originally posted by: TNMockingbird
a reply to: toysforadults

My financial struggles as of late aren't due to the rising cost of living necessarily but due to some unexpected medical and legal issues that wiped out my savings and then some. I borrowed over the past two years to cover shortfalls of lost wages, medical bills (deductibles etc) and have gone back into construction/remodeling as a supplemental income to my regular 50+ hour a week job. I'm fortunate to be healthy enough at my age to do this. I'm seeing the light at the end of the tunnel.
I've never really been one to 'keep up with the Jones' although I do like nice things. I do have two teenage daughters and things get more expensive as you go along. They do work but, I try to help them where needed. They certainly don't earn enough, yet, to support themselves at 100%.
I think that one can think they are prepared (I know that I did) for inevitable and unexpected events but, when your savings gets wiped...well, let's just say that I find it stressful to not have any or not enough.
So, I'll keep on keeping on until I get back on track. It's good for me to work a lot, what would be the alternative?


You are the people we're talking about when we qualify our comments with "but there are some people who are legitimately struggling". You are the type of person social safety programs are supposed to support. You had savings, were living within your means, but still got into trouble. If there weren't so many idiots who abuse the social programs, there would be more money available to help people with legitimate need. This is another reason why we need bigtime reform in a lot of these programs.


If you look at subprime car loans, it points to the fact most people are just idiots financially. Typical car loan now is something like 72 months which means people are buying cars they can't afford and banks are encouraging it by extending payment terms to make the monthly payments lower. Of course, this is insane considering that cars depreciate so a lot of these people are underwater on their car loans.

I can't tell you how many hoodrats I see around my way with Dodge Challengers / Chargers sitting on big rims. Yet, these cars are parked out front of crappy apartment buildings (so they rather live in the hood with a nice car instead of buying a house while driving a modest car). You can always tell too because they often leave the dealer plates on the cars and it will always be one of the shady crappy credit car dealers too.

I work in mortgage finance. During the housing boom / bust when sub prime mortgages were big, I'd refinance people out of trouble. Help them payoff and consolidate debts and save them hundreds per month. Within a year or two, these idiots would be back up to their eyeballs in debt. Instead of taking the savings, they'd instead go right back out and spend more money on new cars, Harleys, etc. Then when it all came crashing down, the first thing out of their mouths was blaming "predatory mortgage lenders".



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 09:51 AM
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a reply to: Edumakated

We know all that now. It does not take a degree to make a smart employee. The right winging rich just wanted working people to spend money on a useless product. They lied about jobs.



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 09:57 AM
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a reply to: kyleplatinum

I know, unless the cost of living in your area is astronomical.

Certain aspects can get skewed for example growing up my family had 4 kids participating in little league baseball and softball year in year out $30 a kid. By the time my kids got of the age it was $150-$200 bucks and that was the 90's know for a fact some people wanted to but couldn't afford that much didn't play. This doesn't even get into insurance cost and later college tuitions which have also swollen to huge proportions.

That said we raised our two kids on approximately 36,000 a year, with a house and a mortgage, 2 cars and generally didn't feel like we were under too much pressure financially or want for necessities or a few luxuries. But we tried to avoid credit card debt like the plague to. Which absolutely cripples most families these days,



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 10:02 AM
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a reply to: Ohanka


A great video on wealth distribution. MOst people think that CEO's and Business owners should make alot more than blue collar workers. But the facts show that the system is not about CEO's and business owners making alot, it's about all the money.


The only way "ordinary" workers are going to make a "fair" living is by unionizing. There is no other non violent way.


.
edit on 25-8-2017 by seasonal because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 10:21 AM
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originally posted by: Aazadan

originally posted by: kyleplatinum
a reply to: toysforadults

If you make 6 figures and live paycheck to paycheck, you are definitely doing something wrong.



It depends on where you're living in the country. $125k in Carlsbad, CA for example will get you a 2 bedroom apartment with a roommate.


You can rent houses in Carlsbad for 2-4k a month, apartments for 1,500-2000 a month. Totally do-able with 6 figures.

You can also move to a more affordable location.



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 10:21 AM
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originally posted by: MOMof3
a reply to: Edumakated

We know all that now. It does not take a degree to make a smart employee. The right winging rich just wanted working people to spend money on a useless product. They lied about jobs.


Ummm... it is the left which is pushing everyone to go to college, not too mention wanting government to give out loans which has done nothing but inflate the cost of tuition.



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 10:21 AM
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originally posted by: Edumakated

originally posted by: face23785

originally posted by: TNMockingbird
a reply to: toysforadults

My financial struggles as of late aren't due to the rising cost of living necessarily but due to some unexpected medical and legal issues that wiped out my savings and then some. I borrowed over the past two years to cover shortfalls of lost wages, medical bills (deductibles etc) and have gone back into construction/remodeling as a supplemental income to my regular 50+ hour a week job. I'm fortunate to be healthy enough at my age to do this. I'm seeing the light at the end of the tunnel.
I've never really been one to 'keep up with the Jones' although I do like nice things. I do have two teenage daughters and things get more expensive as you go along. They do work but, I try to help them where needed. They certainly don't earn enough, yet, to support themselves at 100%.
I think that one can think they are prepared (I know that I did) for inevitable and unexpected events but, when your savings gets wiped...well, let's just say that I find it stressful to not have any or not enough.
So, I'll keep on keeping on until I get back on track. It's good for me to work a lot, what would be the alternative?


You are the people we're talking about when we qualify our comments with "but there are some people who are legitimately struggling". You are the type of person social safety programs are supposed to support. You had savings, were living within your means, but still got into trouble. If there weren't so many idiots who abuse the social programs, there would be more money available to help people with legitimate need. This is another reason why we need bigtime reform in a lot of these programs.


If you look at subprime car loans, it points to the fact most people are just idiots financially. Typical car loan now is something like 72 months which means people are buying cars they can't afford and banks are encouraging it by extending payment terms to make the monthly payments lower. Of course, this is insane considering that cars depreciate so a lot of these people are underwater on their car loans.

I can't tell you how many hoodrats I see around my way with Dodge Challengers / Chargers sitting on big rims. Yet, these cars are parked out front of crappy apartment buildings (so they rather live in the hood with a nice car instead of buying a house while driving a modest car). You can always tell too because they often leave the dealer plates on the cars and it will always be one of the shady crappy credit car dealers too.

I work in mortgage finance. During the housing boom / bust when sub prime mortgages were big, I'd refinance people out of trouble. Help them payoff and consolidate debts and save them hundreds per month. Within a year or two, these idiots would be back up to their eyeballs in debt. Instead of taking the savings, they'd instead go right back out and spend more money on new cars, Harleys, etc. Then when it all came crashing down, the first thing out of their mouths was blaming "predatory mortgage lenders".


Yeah sadly I'm in 100% agreement with you here. A lot of people just aren't smart enough with their money or they are purposefully ignorant with it because they have no incentive to change. My brother is a postman. He knows where all the government checks go. He's told me many times about the welfare checks going to crappy houses with expensive cars and full of high end electronics inside. These type of people take away money from folks with legitimate need.



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 10:26 AM
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originally posted by: kyleplatinum
You can rent houses in Carlsbad for 2-4k a month, apartments for 1,500-2000 a month. Totally do-able with 6 figures.

You can also move to a more affordable location.


125 is about 70k take home. $48k per year using your 4k figure is 5/7's of your income. That's before anything else is factored in. So yes, that gets you a roommate, perhaps a nicer apartment but still not single living.

As far as houses go, you'll only get a house for 2k if you're planning on actually using the entire 30 year mortgage (or 40 years, as California has now started doing). If you want your house paid off in a reasonable time span of 5 years, like you should be able to do with any house that's actually affordable, you're not getting anything for $2k/month.



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 10:26 AM
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originally posted by: Edumakated

originally posted by: MOMof3
a reply to: Edumakated

We know all that now. It does not take a degree to make a smart employee. The right winging rich just wanted working people to spend money on a useless product. They lied about jobs.


Ummm... it is the left which is pushing everyone to go to college, not too mention wanting government to give out loans which has done nothing but inflate the cost of tuition.


It's everyone who pushes college, when the right doesn't push it, it's because they're encouraging people to go into low skilled jobs that have no future.




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