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Earth was Warmer in Medieval Times, Known As -The Medieval Warm Period-

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posted on Aug, 24 2017 @ 01:05 PM
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originally posted by: audubon
No-one is twisting your words... except you.


In plain English, you said you don't know what the best way would be to tackle climate change. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

You're half correct--I said that I don't have enough valid information to know what is the best course of action. Implied in that statement would be that I don't know the best way to tackle climate change, but that's not the only point I made in my statement.


I also pointed out that this action would be 'erring on the side of caution', whereas what you were proposing would unavoidably lead to doing nothing whatsoever. This also happens to be objectively true.

No, I wasn't leading to 'doing nothing whatsoever,' and your misinterpretation of my comment is subjective, not objective.


Now you've segued into some new argument about government interference. In other words you've gone from a matter of atmospheric chemistry to a political point (presumably about the government not impinging on corporate freedom or some such).

That's called elaborating on my stance; if you see it as an "evasive exercise," that's on you, not me. Personally, though, I don't care about this discussion anymore, because you are doing exactly what most people do in these discussions, and there's no point in debating/discussing something with people who only read what they assume is being said.

Best regards--I thought you were someone who could intelligently hold a discussion without projecting onto my comments. It's a disappointment to see that I was wrong.
edit on 24-8-2017 by SlapMonkey because: coding mistake




posted on Aug, 24 2017 @ 01:09 PM
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The funny thing is that if you look at the global temperature fluctuations you'll see that they tend to coincide with greater advancement in civilizations. This could either be because more water is put into the atmosphere and more land becomes available for growing crops, or because times get harder and people cluster together in cities more, creating more art and architecture and ideas from groups of people getting together to discuss philosophy or science. Maybe a little of both.

So... warmer temperatures might be better for humanity anyway.
edit on 24-8-2017 by Blue Shift because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 24 2017 @ 01:28 PM
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originally posted by: Blue Shift
The funny thing is that if you look at the global temperature fluctuations you'll see that they tend to coincide with greater advancement in civilizations. This could either be because more water is put into the atmosphere and more land becomes available for growing crops, or because times get harder and people cluster together in cities more, creating more art and architecture and ideas from groups of people getting together to discuss philosophy or science. Maybe a little of both.



So... warmer temperatures might be better for humanity anyway.


Try living in Vegas and Phoenix USA and you'll see that warmer temps are bad for humanity. Seriously though, if you do a climate search by country and compare it the top countries you'll find that those with cooler climates are more prosperous and modern.

Here. I just used HIgh Standard of Living, but you'll see similar results with most economic indicators, and social indicators -like education and medical care. You'll see that the ten hottest countries are all armpits of the world and the Highest standard of living are all colder nations. It can't be a random coincidence. Some of those might be debatable, like UK and you could say high unemployment etc, but compared to the list on the left it's paradise.

HOTTEST HIGHEST STANDARD OF LIVING
Mexico Finland
Somalia Canada
India Denmark
Sudan Australia
Oman Switzerland
Iran Sweden
Algeria Norway
Iraq Netherlands
Saudi Arabia UK
Libya Iceland



posted on Aug, 24 2017 @ 01:53 PM
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a reply to: amazing

Have you lived in both situations? There's not much to do but work in the North. It's like being a slave 9 months out of the year.



posted on Aug, 24 2017 @ 01:56 PM
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originally posted by: AutonomousMeatPuppet
a reply to: amazing

Have you lived in both situations? There's not much to do but work in the North. It's like being a slave 9 months out of the year.



That's not true. I have lived in the North. You get 4 seasons, instead of 5 months of over 90 to 117 degree heat. There's not much to do in that excess heat, it's too hot to go outdoors. Seriously.



posted on Aug, 24 2017 @ 01:57 PM
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a reply to: SlapMonkey

I think if the climate were suddenly too hot, we could make some adjustments.

Mixing chalk or titanium dioxide with vegetabale or other oil then dispersing across the ocean would reflect much of sunlight and cooling the plant. The cost would be in the millions, not billions.



posted on Aug, 24 2017 @ 02:40 PM
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a reply to: AutonomousMeatPuppet

I remember reading a scholarly white paper years ago that concluded that the ozone layer (and its infamous hole) is the earth's natural thermostat, opening when the atmosphere gets too hot and shrinking to warm it up.

I wish that I could find more research on that topic, because it seemed plausible at the time and could help explain why the Vostok Ice Core samples show such dramatic rises and falls (the largest sections of ozone-layer "holes" is above Antarctica). But, alas, it is just one of many avenues of climate-change drivers of which we lack a good understanding, so many theories are possible.

My point being: I'm a pretty firm believer that it will be the earth itself, and not mankind, that finds its way to appropriate climate.



posted on Aug, 24 2017 @ 03:36 PM
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a reply to: SlapMonkey

I think so too. Most places have an upper limit of 90 - 100 degrees. It would get much hotter, but more heat creates more clouds, except in deserts.



posted on Aug, 24 2017 @ 03:58 PM
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originally posted by: amazing

originally posted by: AutonomousMeatPuppet
a reply to: amazing

Have you lived in both situations? There's not much to do but work in the North. It's like being a slave 9 months out of the year.



That's not true. I have lived in the North. You get 4 seasons, instead of 5 months of over 90 to 117 degree heat. There's not much to do in that excess heat, it's too hot to go outdoors. Seriously.


That's my experience, there's not much to do when it's 10 below zero and dark for 7 months of the year. Hot and humid is also a burden, but would you rather go to Bermuda in the summer or Canada in the winter? Plenty of people go to the beach, pool, Disneyland or whatever even if it's hot.



posted on Aug, 24 2017 @ 04:00 PM
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originally posted by: amazing
Seriously though, if you do a climate search by country and compare it the top countries you'll find that those with cooler climates are more prosperous and modern.

At the moment. I'm talking historically, from the rise of Sumeria and Egypt to the Renaissance and the Industrial Revolution. And I would also bet that many of the prosperous nations are that way because they benefit greatly from goods and companies that were created during colonial expansion in much warmer climates.

EDIT: And while it might seem counter-intuitive, a higher global temperature with more water in the atmosphere might actually make the American southwest much more tropical and less dry. And they wouldn't have to fight over that Colorado River water.
edit on 24-8-2017 by Blue Shift because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 24 2017 @ 05:23 PM
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originally posted by: AutonomousMeatPuppet

originally posted by: amazing

originally posted by: AutonomousMeatPuppet
a reply to: amazing

Have you lived in both situations? There's not much to do but work in the North. It's like being a slave 9 months out of the year.



That's not true. I have lived in the North. You get 4 seasons, instead of 5 months of over 90 to 117 degree heat. There's not much to do in that excess heat, it's too hot to go outdoors. Seriously.


That's my experience, there's not much to do when it's 10 below zero and dark for 7 months of the year. Hot and humid is also a burden, but would you rather go to Bermuda in the summer or Canada in the winter? Plenty of people go to the beach, pool, Disneyland or whatever even if it's hot.




I'm telling you. Excessive heat puts a damper on civilization. Go back to my lists of top hottest countries and top 10 standard of living countries. They are completely different and should give you a warning. There's a reason humans don't thrive in the heat.

Nobody exports anything from Syria or Iran or Iraq or Somalia or the Sudan. The only reason we export from India and mexico is because they live in poverty and our corporations can pay them pennies to produce clothing and electronics. But make no mistake they aren't thriving down there or over there.

There's a reason that there's an Illegal Immigration problem from Mexico and not to Mexico. It has to do with Heat.
edit on 24-8-2017 by amazing because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 24 2017 @ 06:47 PM
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originally posted by: amazing
There's a reason that there's an Illegal Immigration problem from Mexico and not to Mexico. It has to do with Heat.

I submit that it has more to do with politics and lack of water (in the North) than heat. Some parts of Mexico are in the mountains, and not that hot. Other parts are dry deserts. All of it, however, is run by only four major families who work hard to limit opportunities for the rest of the population.



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 02:21 PM
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originally posted by: AutonomousMeatPuppet
Mixing chalk or titanium dioxide with vegetabale or other oil then dispersing across the ocean would reflect much of sunlight and cooling the plant. The cost would be in the millions, not billions.


It might be cheap, but it could be catastrophic. At face value, wouldn't this plan effectively stop surface evaporation from the oceans and bring the water cycle to pretty much a screeching halt? Not to mention obstruct the transport of oxygen into the seas and kill off nearly every living marine organism?

From memory, this is the plot in Drought, a novel by J.G. Ballard. It might cool down the Earth to the advantage of some sapient species that could arise in the future, but it wouldn't do us a lot of good (to put it mildly).



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 10:59 PM
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So the earth is getting hotter and we ultimately can't decide why. Then why would we add to the problem?



posted on Aug, 25 2017 @ 11:25 PM
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originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: seasonal

So if CO2 doesn't warm the atmosphere like you seem to think then why is Venus so damn hot, even hotter than Mercury by several factors?


Mercury, VENUS, Earth, Mars, etc..

Other than size Venus does not even compare to earth.

There is 96% carbon dioxide in the atmosphere of Venus. That mixed with the other gasses and being closer in proximity of the sun caused a runaway greenhouse effect.

Now how exactly does that compare to Earth?
www.google.com...=https://www.space.com/18527-venus-atmosphere.html



posted on Aug, 28 2017 @ 06:45 AM
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a reply to: liejunkie01

So if CO2 doesn't warm the atmosphere like you seem to think then why is Venus so damn hot, even hotter than Mercury by several factors?


There is 96% carbon dioxide in the atmosphere of Venus. That mixed with the other gasses and being closer in proximity of the sun caused a runaway greenhouse effect.



Now how exactly does that compare to Earth?

Lol. How indeed.
edit on 28-8-2017 by Krazysh0t because: (no reason given)



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