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originally posted by: Teikiatsu
originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: Teikiatsu
So you agree that White Supremacists/Nationalists/Nazis support Trump. Good.
As to the rest ... /shrug
I've never said otherwise.
I've also said that Antifa, La Raza, Black Panthers and other racist/leftist/statist groups support moderate Democrats. That does not necessarily make those moderate Democrats become racist/leftist/statist.
originally posted by: madmac5150
I stated this in another post, but it bears repeating:
The Nazis were Socialists... says so right in their name...
(National Socialism (German: Nationalsozialismus), more commonly known as Nazism)
Socialists are Leftists.
Progressives are Leftists.
Socialists and Progressives would seem to be birds of a feather... and Nazis.
originally posted by: Gryphon66
originally posted by: Teikiatsu
originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: Teikiatsu
So you agree that White Supremacists/Nationalists/Nazis support Trump. Good.
As to the rest ... /shrug
I've never said otherwise.
I've also said that Antifa, La Raza, Black Panthers and other racist/leftist/statist groups support moderate Democrats. That does not necessarily make those moderate Democrats become racist/leftist/statist.
It's not about left right, Teikiatsu. Or Democrat Republican.
I'm going to assume you know that, and merely indulge in the game as I do.
If not, I feel sorry for you.
Best.
originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: Teikiatsu
Yet you use the nomenclature of party politics. Obviously then you believe that "one side" is authoritarian and "the other" supports civil rights.
Very well ... it is more than obvious that the group we refer to as White Supremacists White Nationalist and Nazis are NOT supporters of freedom or civil rights.
And they believe that Donald Trump supports them, and he has made it clear that belief is not unfounded.
originally posted by: abeverage
originally posted by: madmac5150
I stated this in another post, but it bears repeating:
The Nazis were Socialists... says so right in their name...
(National Socialism (German: Nationalsozialismus), more commonly known as Nazism)
Socialists are Leftists.
Progressives are Leftists.
Socialists and Progressives would seem to be birds of a feather... and Nazis.
I always wonder why people think NAZI's where leftists is it to try and brand them as liberals? Because they are vastly different. And socialist doesn't mean what you think it means. As they are Fascist , they included Socialist because they knew they needed the working class support. And interestingly enough Neo-NAZI are the topic not the WWII losers they wish to emulate...
But nice try!
originally posted by: Gryphon66
a reply to: Teikiatsu
I'm sorry, I find your description of parroting the media screed from the "right-wing" faction as "complex" a tad humorous.
The "case" in Charlottesville is that a bunch of out of town White Supremacist/Nationalist/Nazi thugs decided take advantage of the right to assemble and "protest" merely to stage the invasion of a small town to a) attempt to CONTROL a situation that was of no concern to them and b) announce that they consider themselves a force to be reckoned with.
A handful of the actual residents of Charlottesville stood up against these invaders and as it turns out they had help from other counter-protesters (who were, by the by, also taking advantage of their Constitutional rights to assemble.) that stood up and defended them.
The UTR folks have made it clear that they actively promote an agenda of hatred and stand against equal rights and are glad to enforce their will through violent actions.
Did some of the ANIFA folks "come for trouble" ... yes, they did. Whereas the credo of the Nazis is racial purity and hatred, ANTIFA's, flawed though it may be, is to stand against those ideologies when they become translated into action.
I don't need to show anything to counter your opinion.
Trump had one of the softest softballs a President could ever have (to condemn Nazis and White Supremacists) and could have knocked it out of the park, and instead, he caught it and lobbed it gently back at them ...
doing just what David Duke told him to do.
The individual rights to free speech and expression arise from a) the common or perhaps natural law and b) the US Constitution. They are LIMITS on what government can do in this country, they are not licenses to cause whatever harm one can.
I hope you're not confusing that.
originally posted by: Gryphon66
My first argument is that "right and left" is merely another of the several false dichotomies used to control the masses.
That said, the terms do have some contextual meaning, and as the American use of the terms evolved alongside the European usage, it's absurd to claim that they're two completely different "systems."
That's merely more peanut-gallery rhetoric.
The concept of any American politician being against "Big Government" is nothing more than warmed-over Reaganism.
Both the Republican Party and the Democrats love them some big government so they're more similar than they are different in fact.
"Big government" however, is nothing more than another platitude. Any meaningful distinction between right and left focuses on the action and the intent of action.
There are a thousand ways to analyze these terms to complicate matters; however the essence is painfully clear.
If an action is intended to control what others do it's a right wing action. (Violence is inherently right wing; so is government).
If an action focuses on ensuring freedom to allow the most people to act and live as they choose it's a left wing action.
Right wing actions are authoritarian.
Left wing actions are liberal (or libertarian in the original sense).
Defending against violence is a fundamental right, a natural right.
That's it. From the Estates General all the way to the local property owners' association.
No "complexity" needed.
The Washington Post Fact Checker published a document in an earlier fact-check showing that counter-protesters had indeed acquired an official permit for Saturday, when the Unite the Right march was scheduled.