The opioid epidemic has hit close to home, our 29 year-old niece almost died!

originally posted by: stonerwilliam
A doctor in Portsmouth England did just that she took 10 addicts and gave them their daily fix and all went back to work and living their normal lives , but there were mass calls from her own to sack her

To many 1% with fingers in that till

Exactly

can't have the system derailed by working actions.

originally posted by: WeRpeons
a reply to: Azureblue

How sad. It's almost like these addicts are possessed by something evil.

No different to the demon an alcoholic has, but just more potent.

We all have demons, how we deal with them is what society judges us by.

I don't know how to respond to your solutions.

My emphasis would lay within the mystic realm.
These punks have seen it all, know it all, and no one can teach them anything.
More than likely, especially when their eyes are pins, they would proselytize you
to their godless state of unbelief, never getting that it's all vanity, and vexation
of an empty soul.

Before the internet made it easy to dig up data on everything from cancer to capri slacks,
a childhood friend dropped in, unannounced. We had grown apart, and drama was usually in tow whenever we got together. Bad talk about bad situations, other persons who manipulated situations shamelessly. Sometimes things went well, but as years went by it
seemed to be going sideways. Avoidance of eye contact. Facing each other sideways, pacing, avoidance of spiritual stuff save to rip on the easy targets we had been exposed to, never mentioning dreams, or aspirations anymore, because from one to the other, these were now foolish, and often ridiculed. In fact, any get together was marred by overt manipulation, even punitive supervisory tactics, some kind of latent power trip stemming from a deep secret, and fear of exposure, all of which made control a key part of subsequent meetings.

Well, he showed up unannounced, as collars were not issued yet but you could feel them coming, the air becoming charged just over the years, like an armed enemy attack, just over the horizon. If you ride a highway where the lines are arrayed, with the towers, and the walls, and lines underground and buildings with dishes, around our necks clawing through flesh in our pocket, and also the trees, all reaching for space...you can still feel it here. Because now, it is everywhere; you cannot flee the walls of your home. This was before all that. He showed up in his early gas saver import, and all he wanted was to sleep. To lay down for a few minutes.

I watched him. I watched his lips turn blue on this warm spring day and wondered. I saw that he could breathe, and did not seem ill at ease.

I stayed near, and soon he awoke. Then he left. I don't think we talked about anything that day. But one day decades later I saw the pins and heard a screed leveled at me that would render that things would never be the same, may never be right between us, because what I heard were the words of a tortured insane person convinced of his rock hard certitudes and bound by a hatred of anything that was lofty, mystical, calmly withholding of it, and, apparently, slightly hard of hearing while under the influence, while spouting abuse I hope never to display but always to remember.

I knew this much....I knew we were done, but it was not my doing, and I waited a few more years for the other shoe to drop, for him to announce it. I was a failure because I refused to alter my days, for him, or for anyone. A growing target, but for the passing of time.

The fix seems to give a glimpse of the ethereal, but it takes and it takes and it takes.
When the coke fails, the downward pull of the opiates must be terrifying. I am sorry about that. When your relation finally decides to find God, or rather, begins to try, to nurture some seeds, or at least ask for some, of God's planting....I hope it isn't because you took down the world while trying to clean her ass up. You cannot measure nor imagine how empty, emptiness is.

# 847

originally posted by: WeRpeons

The best advice i can give you is get her away from the area fast and cut her ties with her user friends for as long as possible and see if that works

a reply to: stonerwilliam

The only problem with that is her parents can't force anything on her because she's a 29 year-old adult. The police told her parents they can't force her to do anything even though she's still living under their roof and can't hold a job. Some people told her parents to kick her out of the house and let her fend for herself. It's kind of difficult to do when you love and care about the welfare of your daughter. Who knows, if they actually did that, she may turn to crime to support her addiction and live off the streets and become a worst addict than she already is.

It's a bad situation. She's needs to recognize her problem and seek help to kick the addiction. Really, forcing her to get help doesn't necessarily mean she won't crave getting a fix. Which goes against my own idea of forcing addicts to get help.

My aunt had to kidnap my cousin out of crack house in Detroit back in the 90's. My cousin was a legal adult and the cops said their hands were tied. So my aunt my other cousin and his buddy went and kidnapped her. They dragged her into a van kicking and screaming. They held her against her will for a month. After a month my aunt said if I let you out of this room what are you going to do. She said I'm going to go get high. She left and disappeared. 2 months later she was found laying in the street dead and naked with a bullet to the forehead.

Now my other cousin is doing heroin. He broke into my grandmothers house and ripped her off 3 times. He was her favorite grandchild. He stole her and my grandfathers wedding rings. He latter climbed through an upstairs window and got into the computer room. He stole a bunch of credit card info from their computer. He ended up wanted in 4 cities for burglary. He was leaving finger prints everywhere. The judge ordered him to a 2 year boot camp. If he didn't get in any trouble his record would be wiped clean. So he gets out and my uncle gave him a job working for his carpet cleaning business. My uncle had high end clientele that he spent years building a reputation with. While cleaning carpets my cousin was stealing anything not bolted down. He was shoving ipads and stuff down his pants. He got caught and the judge sentenced him to 7 years. My uncle laughed because in the courtroom my cousin fell to the ground and started crying like a baby. He just got out of prison after 5 years 3 months ago and he's back at it.

I had two close friends die from doing heroin. Like I said previously with heroin they either quit die or end up in prison for a very long time.

This girl you know is going to drain her family emotionally and financially. Heroin addicts have no soul they are nothing but zombies to that drug.

originally posted by: thesaneone
I'm happy to hear that she got a second chance, I hope she can overcome the addiction.



I do not agree with your first four ideas mainly because I believe in personal responsibility and I don't believe we should waste anymore tax dollars on the war on drugs, it hasn't worked yet.

Policing Afghanistan to protect the opium fields is part of the "war on drugs"
So we should pull all our troops out of there as well

a reply to: WeRpeons

-Any one caught dealing drugs should be given the death penalty.

I know you are upset but you need to take a step back and think about that.

Would you say this if your niece started dealing to feed her addiction?

Sorry for the blunt question but your ignorant statement baffles me, no one put a gun to her head to take those drugs, most users end up selling at one point or another even it is just small time. Most sellers are users...think about that before you start wishing death upon people...you could be wishing death upon someone else's 20 something niece going through the same # storm as you and your family.

That being said, I am sincerely sorry for what your family is going through. I hope they both come out of this okay as addiction is a never ending battle.

The county that I grew up in in rural Pennsylvania exceeded Philadelphia in opioid OD's last year (per 100,000 people). They only had 11, but the population is only 14,900 people.
It is sad for me to see that. The county was mostly just farms back when I was a kid. Cows still outnumber people there according to the last census.

a reply to: Mikehawk

I clearly said in my OP my opinion on the matter may seem extreme. I wanted to get other opinions on the matter so I'm really not offended by your statement. The death penalty may be a bit extreme, but I still feel drug dealers should be held accountable for many of these overdose deaths.

Like you and some others who are saying nobody put a gun to her head and made her take these drugs. I completely understand that, yet the other argument is true that dealers are "illegally" enabling and providing access to these drugs knowing full well it's illegal. Two wrongs don't make a right. Just because some of these dealers are trying to support their own addiction, shouldn't justify giving them any kind of sympathy for providing an easier means of access for other addicts to help carry on their addiction and continue to harm themselves. All while parents, relatives and friends are trying their best to keep the addict from gaining access to these drugs. It's clearly the addicts own fault when they steal prescription drugs from family, relatives or friends or intentionally exceed a recommended dosage for pain. However, unlike the dealer who is enabling, selling and personally handing them the drug. Knowing full well what they're selling is harmful and possibly laced with another powerful drug which can cause them to overdose and possibly result in their death!

So my aunt my other cousin and his buddy went and kidnapped her. They dragged her into a van kicking and screaming. They held her against her will for a month. After a month my aunt said if I let you out of this room what are you going to do.

a reply to: wantsome

OMG. I'm surprised she didn't say she was going to run to the police and have your aunt and cousin arrested for kidnapping! I can picture my niece threatening her parents if they did that.

It definitely sounds like these drugs have a grip on a person's soul. It sounds like this epidemic could bring a country or the even the world to it's knees. That's why my personal opinions on this matter is extreme. It's extremely difficult for these addicts to come clean, even after going through months and years of rehab! The craving for a fix is just too overwhelming.

My sympathies for your cousin's death, and lets hope your other cousin doesn't meet with the same fate. It doesn't look good my friend.

This girl you know is going to drain her family emotionally and financially. Heroin addicts have no soul they are nothing but zombies to that drug.

Everyday her parents awake with anxiety worrying that their daughter or son will get access to drugs which will cause them to lose their child. We worry about our children getting cancer or getting in a fatal car accident etc... but it doesn't even compare to worrying everyday wondering if it's going to be the last day you'll see your son or daughter alive.

a reply to: badw0lf

No different to the demon an alcoholic has, but just more potent.

Agreed, both destroy lives and families only difference alcohol is legal.

a reply to: Jubei42

I agree. I've always said cannabis is less harmful than alcohol.

If your responding about the school incident of suckers laced with the high dosage of THC, these kids were rushed to the hospital because they were unknowingly feeling the affects of the THC. School officials didn't know why so many kids were complaining about feeling light headed. So out of concern for these kids health and the possibility of coming into contact with something that was causing these ailments, they immediately rushed these kids to the hospital.

I personally had friends in high school who smoked pot. Many no longer smoke it, but a few went on to harder drugs like coc aine. I think some people who like the feeling that marijuana gives them will sometime try other drugs thinking they can handle the harder drugs just as easy. Unfortunately for some, it ends up with a strong addiction to more dangerous drugs.

a reply to: FyreByrd

The fear has to come from inside them, has to be their decision.

The only problem is the addiction is stronger than the fear of losing their life. Case in point - my niece. Two minutes from losing her life yet she still has no concern heading down the path of drug addiction. I know my ideas on this seem extreme, but I honestly haven't heard many successful recovery stories.

I blame the doctors. My brother was addicted to Vicodin for 20+ years. His pill bottles were about half the size of a soda can and he'd take handfuls at a time.

When I tried to reason with him he was absolutely vicious.

No doctor should prescribe that amount and no pharmacist should fill it.

We're not sure what killed him as he had a number of serious health problems, but I'm sure it contributed.

a reply to: WeRpeons

-Any one caught dealing drugs should be given the death penalty. How many people have these dealers supplied drugs to that have ended up dead because of an overdose or drugs laced with another dangerous drug? They're as responsible for those deaths as much as someone who has committed 1st degree murder. They know what they're selling and they know it can cause someone to die. Maybe if drug dealers knew there was an extreme price to pay if they got caught dealing drugs, the money to sell drugs would be much less attractive.

"They're as responsible for those deaths as much as someone who has committed 1st degree murder."

And the 1 person that holds even more responsibility above all else is the user.

-Known addicts should be forced into rehab, no matter what their age. Once rehabilitated, they would be responsible to make monthly payments to cover all medical costs.

They force criminals into jail.

What percentage of people that go to jail get rehabilitated compared to people that become repeat offenders?

Forcing rehabilitation onto anyone isn't rehabilitation.

So ATS, what are your ideas on combating the opioid addiction problem in this country?

I agree with what many other have proposed, those many others are people that have lived the lifestyle, either being police and spending quite a bit time battling narcotics and its effects on society or being on the other side of the fence and being addicts themselves.

The solution, which will benefit society more so than most can imagine is to decriminalize all illicit substances and create a legal market.

Issues with substance abuse will be there, legal or not.

The issues are easier dealt with when the issues are legal and in the open.


Anyway, I wish your niece all the best and hope she can recover along with her brother.

It takes the person themselves to make the choice to change, forcing change on someone with these issues only will lead to a much darker reality for the person suffering and for those that want to help.

I have mixed feelings.

Part of me is sympathetic and the other part of me just dgaf anymore. Some people are going to make stupid decisions with their lives. I just don't get how anyone uses that stuff knowing what it does to you. It isn't like they don't know the results...

I read about some local government that basically said they aren't reviving three time over dosers. They drain the system too much and so they've finally just put their foot down.

I live in a very wealthy and very liberal community. We border one of the worst Chicago neighborhoods. It really is odd. You go one street over and it is Mogadishu with daily gang violence and our community is tree lined streets, Frank Lloyd Wright houses, cute shops, and homes regularly sell for $1 million.

Anyway, we've been having issues with heroin zombies begging and committing petty crimes. We had an overdose at our public library (junkie went into restroom to shoot up). It has gotten so bad, our liberal government actually put a social worker at the library.

The junkies drive me crazy because it is the same MoFos everyday. I know people have rights, but unless we forceably take them off the streets, what can the public do? The services we provide just encourage their behavior.

I am sick of taking my kid to the park and seeing these lice infested zombies coming out the bathroom at the playground high.

a reply to: Azureblue

The drug problem exists because someone wants it to.

I agree. We have a lot of problems in the U.S. and the world because of this. It makes me angry to think innocent people are being used for some evil agenda. I'm sure it won't happen in my lifetime, but I wait for the day when people around the world rise-up and say enough is enough!

I think it should be decriminalized and and the resources we use to jail people put towards rehabilitation.

originally posted by: NthOther
a reply to: rickymouse

It's also a product of equivocating morality with legality.

If it's legal, it must be ok.

That's what happens when you've brainwashed an entire generation into worshipping the state.

That is very true.

a reply to: CriticalStinker

But 90% of the world's supply comes from Afghanistan....

Its estimated that about 90 or so percent of the Illegal heroin trade comes from poppies grown in Afgan.

However, the majority of legal growth and sales of poppies to pharmaceutical companies comes from Tasmanian (A state in Australia) farms.

In Melbourne, Australia, there is one of only 8 companies in the world that manufacture these opioid drugs that are sold legally.

a reply to: WeRpeons

personal responsibility - it's a beautiful thing

You need to YOUR family if there's a problem

and... you can't legislate morality - quit suggesting trying all of our past failures again