Who would you remove from Power?

If you could go back in time, and remove any one from thier place of power, who would it be and why?

I put this in the "Conspiracies in Religions" forum becuase I think that we will see alot of religious leaders from the past show up in this discussion, but if the mods wanna move this to another Forum, I understand.

As far as my pick, I'd have to say I'd remove the Emporer Constantine. I'd like to see what kind of a world we'd live in, if hypothetically he had not had the power to revamp the "christian" religion as he did. By bringing his peoples pagan religion and mixing it with the christian religion, that was gaining power at the time, he virtually began a new religion which, backed by Rome and the Catholic Church, to this day is one of the most powerful influences in the world. Had he not done so, I wonder what religious practices would have vanished or sprung up in it's place.

The first monkey to use a stick to beat his neighbor. I would remove him in a bloody, fiery public display. Hopefully monkeys would have stayed monkeys and all the rest of this self indulgent nonsense we call history might have been avoided.

I would help make sure Hitler became an architect and never had anything to do with politics in germany.

mpeake.. where you get your ideas? it was BECAUSE of Constantine that Christianity was evetually accepted in the world as a major religion. in fact, he instituted many laws that follow christian ones before he was even babtized. And conveanted the council of Nicea to help clarify and unify christianity. In fact it is the first time in anceint history that Government supported and practically endorsed a religion.. all thanks to Constantine. In fact often pagen rituals were REPLACED by Christian ones in a way to help covertsion. To think there was mixing is a gross insult to any christian

Originally posted by mpeake
If you could go back in time, and remove any one from thier place of power, who would it be and why?

That would be 99% of all politicians, they are either corrupted crooks and liars or out of their minds or both.

Jehosephat
There most certainly was mixing of religions, both intentional and unintentional. The only way Rome could get the pagans to accept the new doctrine of faith was to give it to them in an easily understood, relevant-to-their-lives-way. They tried importing religion unmodified, it led to revolt and other unpleasantries. People wanted their old ways, their old festivals. The church came along and instead of doing away with festivals celebrating fertility in the spring and the like, the church adopted those holidays and even modified its dogma to give official 'historical' sanction to the holidays.

There is a huge posibility that the whole Jesus myth was created specifically for the purpose of converting the natives round the world. It was a mish-mash of old myths and modern cults, taken bit by bit and engineered to appeal to the masses. Check out the similarity between Jesus and Osiris, you'll see what I mean. The Osiris myth withstood the test of time, and was the basis for many cults around that time period, so the church took that and used it to tighten their control over the people. Why do we have a bunny for Easter? Pagan fertility symbol. Don't be so close-minded and dogmatic. The evidence is there for those with eyes to see.

where you get your ideas? it was BECAUSE of Constantine that Christianity was evetually accepted in the world as a major religion. in fact, he instituted many laws that follow christian ones before he was even babtized.

Yes, that's the version that you and most people hear. The fact is, Constantine was jsut a power hungry king who knew little of theology. He ruled over a pagan empire, but saw the rising influence and power of the christian church. Eager to rise in power himself, he seeked the backing of the christian church. But to do so would mean turning his current pagan world into the new christian world.

And conveanted the council of Nicea to help clarify and unify christianity.

Yes, he did implement the council of Nicea, but it was the councils responsibility to deem what was fit to enter and leave the current bible we have today. At that time in history there were over 600 books being used in the bible. The council removed the books that they felt were a threat to the hold of power they had.

In fact it is the first time in anceint history that Government supported and practically endorsed a religion

Constantine wanted the church and state to be very close together. The church had much power, thus he would have much power by having the complete backing of the church.

all thanks to Constantine. In fact often pagen rituals were REPLACED by Christian ones in a way to help covertsion.

Actually, much of the christian symbols and images that are used by the church are pagan in origin. For instance, today you go to church on a Sunday, but the original day of worship was to be on a Saturday. The pagan's worshipeed the "Sun God" on "Sunday", so Constantine thought he'd mask the day of worship by forcing all christian worship to be on a Sunday as well.

To think there was mixing is a gross insult to any christian

I'm a Christian, but I'm not offended, just educated

See below for a few refernces...

gbgm-umc.org...
gbgm-umc.org...
www.gospelcom.net...
www.deism.com...
davidmacd.com...
home.inreach.com...

There are probably dozens more that will support much of what I say, but inthe end, it's a matter of personal conviction. I think we'll just have to agree to disagree on this one

Do I have to narrow it down to only ONE? History is replete with evil doers who deserved what they finally got. THAT HAVING BEEN SAID, CONSIDER THIS. You really can't undo history, since nobody can know who the bad guys are until they do something bad. Here's my best "fer instance."

If I went back in time and drove a Dusenburg on ole Hitler's head, sure time would change. But then the Headlines would suddenly read, "Poor Wallpaper Hanger (Only Living Son Of Adolf and Marta Hitler) Killed By Rabid Duse Driver."

Suddenly, I'M the bad guy!

Is this coming out right?

[edit on 8-2-2005 by Toelint]

I guess I should have made myself a bit more clear. You don't necessarily have to theoretically kill the person, just state who you have removed from power and influence during thier time and why.

Of course, if you wanna say you'd drive a bus over Hitler, then I'm all for that too

mpeake, weren't they suppose to be making a Boondock Saints 2? Waiting for it.

Anyways, I would remove all those damn popes. I swear, they lead the crusades, witch trials, inquisitions, created the dark ages, turned what may have a been a advance civilization into a hell hole. Went from Rome being a great power with advance technology to hell on earth where middle age was 8 and lucky to have 1 of your 50 kids live. Also helps stop the slaughter of the Indians for being heathens, for the christians would exist, making the Indians not heathens.
Also, the Carthagians were trading with the Indians of South America, maybe. Painting things on walls in Peru and such show ships that have the same look/style of Carthagian ships, men wearing Carthagian type clothes, and explains how certain metals/fabrics appeared in the areas that they shouldn't be in.(Old Carthagian coins in Peru, so forth) So saying well, the carthagians/romans would have called them heathens and killed them doesn't work for they were freindly with them.

Back to the garden of Eden, hungry mongoose in hand, and plant him right beside that tree for when Apophis shows up.

No more boogeymen.

Originally posted by James the Lesser
mpeake, weren't they suppose to be making a Boondock Saints 2? Waiting for it.

You and me both bud All I see on the website'sroduction diary says "More news on the progress will be following soon....."

www.boondocksaints.com...

Get on with it already

I would go back in time and bitch slap Carl Marx and make sure he never made the Communist Manifesto

Originally posted by Croat56
I would go back in time and bitch slap Carl Marx and make sure he never made the Communist Manifesto

Communism is in it's essence a good thing. What politicians have done with it is not.

Originally posted by MiTo


Communism is in it's essence a good thing. What politicians have done with it is not.

Thats true if it wasnt for humans communism would be perfect.

Originally posted by Croat56

Thats true if it wasnt for humans communism would be perfect.

LOL good one, can I quote you on that one ?

If it wasn't for humans everything would be great. I swear, we screw everything up. Look at religon, christianity is peaceful, but humans took/take it and use it to kill millions, kill science which then kills more for something like plumbing or medicine is satanism and therefore bad. Or Islam, peaceful religon, but then people get ahold of it and turn it into the terrorist religon. Democracy, great idea, but then republicans get ahold of it and corrupt it.

Christopher Columbus. I would mutiny, burn the ships, toss a bottle in the ocean with a note that read 'Oh God save us all, the Sta. Maria just fell over the edge of the Ocean into the Stars and We are next!'. Then I would build cabanas, pull out the beach chairs, and drink palm beer with the Natives until the Gulf of Mexico freezes over.

Why? Because he brought a holocaust to the People of the Americas in the name of the Church.

[edit on 8-2-2005 by Chakotay]

Originally posted by MiTo

Originally posted by Croat56

Thats true if it wasnt for humans communism would be perfect.

LOL good one, can I quote you on that one ?

go for it

Originally posted by Croat56


Thats true if it wasnt for humans communism would be perfect.

I think your right it does seem to work good for ants. They got true communism down pretty good.

George W(aka Dumbya) Bush would be my first choice.
He is the worst US president ever, it will take many many years to reverse the damage he is doing.
Second choice would be Joseph Stalin.
Killed millions over his unsubstantiated paranoia. Picked almost at random. Turned neighbour against neighbour.

[edit on 8-2-2005 by SeeQ]