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How Those Opposed to Military Transgender Ban Can Really Make A Difference!

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posted on Jul, 28 2017 @ 12:49 PM
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a reply to: Grimpachi

Sure most agree with that. That isn't banning Trans people though.




posted on Jul, 28 2017 @ 12:56 PM
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originally posted by: JinMI
a reply to: ErrorErrorError

Technically, he is serving now.



This is just like all the people who "almost served". You either did or you didn't.



posted on Jul, 28 2017 @ 01:14 PM
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originally posted by: projectvxn

originally posted by: JinMI
a reply to: ErrorErrorError

Technically, he is serving now.



This is just like all the people who "almost served". You either did or you didn't.

He is serving though, as Commander in Chief.

He didnt go through basic so he doesnt count as military? In all technical ways he is serving, so salute you shorts if you dont like it?



posted on Jul, 28 2017 @ 01:15 PM
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originally posted by: luthier
a reply to: Grimpachi

Sure most agree with that. That isn't banning Trans people though.


The reason I think they were banned is because of stupid legislation that approved the operations and hormone therapy.

Trump couldn't override what was already passed. If the legislation is rolled back then the ban will probably be rolled back.



posted on Jul, 28 2017 @ 01:24 PM
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a reply to: Grimpachi

He couldn't communicate that?

Your OK with him using soldiers as political bait ?

IN ANY CAPACITY.

And no it was a directive not a bill.

Hormones who cares they are cheap. If the person is already on them and passes the requirements there are plenty of equivalent medical costs. It should be about the job. Particularly if they are gifted at positions needed.

Didn't think about that I bet.

The reality that they could be literally the best at their job. Like that seal Trans lady. Kristen.


If the hormones and not being able to have them administered is a severe threat more than other allowed things then sure. Like if your pinned down or not able to get to a supply. There are lots of different positions in the service however.



posted on Jul, 28 2017 @ 01:26 PM
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originally posted by: Butterfinger

originally posted by: projectvxn

originally posted by: JinMI
a reply to: ErrorErrorError

Technically, he is serving now.



This is just like all the people who "almost served". You either did or you didn't.

He is serving though, as Commander in Chief.

He didnt go through basic so he doesnt count as military? In all technical ways he is serving, so salute you shorts if you dont like it?

NO he isn't serving and you are dead wrong for saying he is. The military in the country is setup to be ran by a civilian commander. So that means Trump is NOT serving right now no matter what you say.



posted on Jul, 28 2017 @ 01:46 PM
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a reply to: luthier

I probably have a different view because I served and know that a soldier isn't even qualified to go through basic if they need constant medical such as hormones.

Didn't know that did you?

The military needs people that are fit without issues so they can train them to do the jobs necessary. All soldiers need to pass their basic training and when I was going through basic we were not even allowed to have tylonol or aspirin. A trainee going through basic that needed their hormone or any medicine would need to go to medical every day.

Your argument about them being already on them and passing requirements goes against the requirements. If they can pass basic just like everyone else without special needs then they should be able to serve as many already have.



posted on Jul, 28 2017 @ 01:49 PM
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a reply to: Butterfinger

Trump is serving in the military the same way NK Kim is serving his military.

Neither trained neither are held to a code of conduct and neither know what they are doing.



posted on Jul, 28 2017 @ 01:55 PM
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Ok this is not about PFC Trump, take it elsewhere

I posted a funny clip earlier because I had nothing usefull to add but I did some thinking.
So this is about transgenders in the army. And the main concern raised here is that these transgenders are going to cost the militairy alot of money. So how are transgender creating extra costs when compared to the regulars? I've heard the sex change operation being mentioned but surely these procedures are not covered, why would they? Look, I can imagine a boob job that reduces the size due to back problems. They only get smaller or get removed completely if you're unlucky. But thats the only kind of boob job that gets covered I hope.

I mean the militairy has gays right? They don't need special treatment. If you want to join the army as transgender you're just going to have to settle for gay untill you are ready to leave the militairy. I think that sounds reasonable



posted on Jul, 28 2017 @ 01:57 PM
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I really can't believe I have to post this link in the thread, but I have now corrected two people in this thread with poor civics knowledge that thinks Trump is currently serving in the military because he is President.
Why Civilian Control of the Military?

Civilian control of the military is so ingrained in America that we hardly give it a second thought. Most Americans don't realize how special this relationship is and how it has contributed to the country.

The framers of the U.S. Constitution worked to ensure the military would be under civilian control. They did not want to emulate the European experience. The colonies had just fought a war for freedom from Britain. The king controlled the British military, and the framers had no interest in duplicating that system.

When they wrote the Constitution they separated the responsibilities for the military, placing the responsibilities firmly in civilian hands.

Article I, Section 8 of the Constitution states that Congress shall have the power "to raise and support Armies …" and "to provide and maintain a Navy." In addition, Congress must provide for the state militias when they are called to federal service.

Article II, Section 2 states, "The President shall be the Commander in Chief of the Army and Navy of the United States, and of the Militia of the several States when called into the actual Service of the United States."

Congress has the power to declare war and to make the rules for governing the military.

So the framers spread responsibilities for the military around. The president and Congress had to work together to use the military.



posted on Jul, 28 2017 @ 02:01 PM
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a reply to: Grimpachi

Really? Maybe you should read the list of what is allowed? Anything that is a daily dose allowed.

Maybe you served when flat feet disqualified you?

Were there drone operators or Intel analysts?

What medication is allowed at basic?

If the medication disqualified them it would disqualify them. I agree and explained that as best I could. Of they allow similar medical conditions in terms of needing medication then there is no arguement.


edit on 28-7-2017 by luthier because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 28 2017 @ 02:01 PM
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originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: Butterfinger

originally posted by: projectvxn

originally posted by: JinMI
a reply to: ErrorErrorError

Technically, he is serving now.



This is just like all the people who "almost served". You either did or you didn't.

He is serving though, as Commander in Chief.

He didnt go through basic so he doesnt count as military? In all technical ways he is serving, so salute you shorts if you dont like it?

NO he isn't serving and you are dead wrong for saying he is. The military in the country is setup to be ran by a civilian commander. So that means Trump is NOT serving right now no matter what you say.


Ok, chill out I'm not trying to steal anyone's glory.

Seems like its semantics at this point.

He is the Commander in Chief of the military, a Civilian Commander in Chief, but still Commander in Chief.

What happens if you dont salute him while on active duty?

What happens if you dont salute say, Hillary?

If you get trouble for not saluting someone with the title "Commander in Chief" , I'd say he essentially is a part of the organization.



posted on Jul, 28 2017 @ 02:06 PM
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originally posted by: Grimpachi
a reply to: Butterfinger

Trump is serving in the military the same way NK Kim is serving his military.

Neither trained neither are held to a code of conduct and neither know what they are doing.


But why would anyone choose that haircut? It has to be mandatory, even for a God



posted on Jul, 28 2017 @ 02:12 PM
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a reply to: luthier




Really? Maybe you should read the list of what is allowed?


Depends on which branch Army, Navy, Airforce, Marines. They all have their separate basic and AIT.



Maybe you served when flat feet disqualified you?


Maybe. I didn't know anyone who had flat feet.



Were there drone operators or Intel analysts?


Doesn't matter, ALL have to pass basic and AIT before becoming either.



What medication is allowed at basic?


None when I went through. If a person needed medication then they were not fit to go through basic.



posted on Jul, 28 2017 @ 02:12 PM
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a reply to: Butterfinger




He is serving though, as Commander in Chief.


The military is subservient to civilian leadership.

He's not now, nor was he ever a soldier.

Period.

You want that title? #ing earn it.



posted on Jul, 28 2017 @ 02:17 PM
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originally posted by: Grimpachi
a reply to: luthier




Really? Maybe you should read the list of what is allowed?


Depends on which branch Army, Navy, Airforce, Marines. They all have their separate basic and AIT.



Maybe you served when flat feet disqualified you?


Maybe. I didn't know anyone who had flat feet.



Were there drone operators or Intel analysts?


Doesn't matter, ALL have to pass basic and AIT before becoming either.



What medication is allowed at basic?


None when I went through. If a person needed medication then they were not fit to go through basic.


Then in that scenario I would agree with you.

However, I assume since there are pretty large numbers already in they are qualified.

If the medication disqualifies them it should be done like you would high blood pressure or diabetes once I the service and you can retire.

If it is similar to other allowed things it should be allowed. That is my point. If it's not it shouldn't.

Being open about your identity should be fine of your stable and able to do your part. I don't see it as any different any other thing people don't like, say a particular religion. If the duty can't be performed it can't be performed and that is the reality. If it can it can.

The rest is politics.
edit on 28-7-2017 by luthier because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 28 2017 @ 02:17 PM
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a reply to: Butterfinger




Seems like its semantics at this point.


It's about putting in the work and earning the title Marine, Sailor, Soldier, Airman.




What happens if you dont salute him while on active duty? What happens if you dont salute say, Hillary?


That is inconsequential. Protocol and regulations state that the C in C will be saluted. Doesn't make him or her a soldier.




If you get trouble for not saluting someone with the title "Commander in Chief" , I'd say he essentially is a part of the organization.


All well and good. But until he's forged at Sand Hill, Fort Benning(or relevant training school), he's just another civilian with legal power.
edit on 28 7 17 by projectvxn because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 28 2017 @ 02:32 PM
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a reply to: Butterfinger

It's not a trivial semantics point. It is a VERY serious issue that the framers of the Constitution clearly defined for reasons they considered very important.

Also, saluting has nothing to do with someone being in the military. You salute the flag for crying out loud. The requirement to salute is a military directive not a sign that the person is in the actual military organization.



posted on Jul, 28 2017 @ 05:30 PM
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originally posted by: incoserv
Then once you've been through the ringer, your opinion would count for so much more.

Translation; Once you have killed sufficient numbers of humans, destroyed enough homes and environment, learn how not to think (but they prepared you for that in grade school and beyond) for yourself and just follow orders, your opinion will mean so much more, among others of similar ilk, anyway!


Let me know when you sign up so that I can give you an ATTABOY. (or ATTAGAL, or ATTA-WHATEVER-THE-CASE-MAY-BE.)

No, that was a joke, but I'm serious. Do it. DO IT!!!!!

It's not nice to tempt peaceful people into insanity! Joining the military is the biggest mistake of most people's lives (unless you are already a robot killer)!
No, that was not a joke, I'm serious. Don't do it. DON'T DO IT!!!!!



posted on Jul, 28 2017 @ 05:34 PM
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a reply to: incoserv

Why would becoming a soldier mean your voice would matter more??

It certainly didn't matter for all the Trans people who have and are already serving in the military now did it???



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