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Top US general promises no changes in military transgender policy for now

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posted on Jul, 27 2017 @ 12:34 PM
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I didn't see this on a search (might have a different title and keywords, though)

Trump's announcement on the transgender policy apparently was NOT something that the generals or anyone who holds a current military commission and is on active duty knew about.



Top US general promises no changes in military transgender policy for now
By LUIS MARTINEZ
Jul 27, 2017, 12:30 PM ET

Gen. Joseph Dunford, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, has issued guidance to military commanders stressing that there will be no change in military policy toward transgender service members until Defense Secretary Jim Mattis receives further direction from the White House.


President Trump announced via Twitter on Wednesday what appeared to be a reinstatement of the military's ban on transgender service members.

"I know there are questions about yesterday’s announcement on the transgender policy by the president," Dunford said in a written message to military commanders, according to a copy obtained by ABC News.

"There will be no modifications to the current policy until the president's direction has been received by the secretary of defense and the secretary has issued implementation guidance," continued Dunford, the nation's top military commander.

"In the meantime, we will continue to treat all of our personnel with respect," he said. "As importantly, given the current fight and the challenges we face, we will all remain focused on accomplishing our assigned missions."
Source



Vice Adm. Robert Burke, the Navy's top personnel officer also said that no action would be taken though they would talk to Trump about what his intent was... and that they were not stopping any treatments in progress (which, if you read the news, cost far less than the military's Viagra prescriptions)

A Reuters story adds a detail that I had wondered about - though the sitting president is Commander in Chief, he ALSO has to go through the chain of command. My dad (as a Sargent) once dressed down a general (during WWII) for giving a direct order to the troops under my dad's command. He said in effect that if the general gave the order to Dad's commanding officer and that officer gave the command to Dad that HE would order the troops...but the general can't do so directly.

And Dunford just said the same thing about the military and Trump Tweetfests:


"There will be no modifications to the current policy until the President's direction has been received by the Secretary of Defense and the Secretary has issued implementation guidance," Dunford said in the message, first reported by Reuters.
Source



Trump won't be able to govern effectively until he learns how to govern as President... which is NOT the same as CEO. This lesson hasn't hit home yet.




posted on Jul, 27 2017 @ 12:56 PM
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a reply to: Byrd

Your dad was full of s*** a general can give an order to any Soldier under his command now if it's a general from an alternate command they're still legally obligated to obey the command but they can request clarification from their own command.

Jaden
edit on 27-7-2017 by Masterjaden because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 27 2017 @ 01:04 PM
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Does anyone have any idea how many Trans folk are currently serving?.



posted on Jul, 27 2017 @ 01:05 PM
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The tweet is not official direction but as your source article reports the Joint Chiefs are naturally awaiting the proper directive thru the chain of command.



posted on Jul, 27 2017 @ 01:08 PM
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originally posted by: testingtesting
Does anyone have any idea how many Trans folk are currently serving?.


That stat has been posted multiple times.

It's a tiny minority.

People say "it's a thing of economics," which is utter bull.

We the tax paying peons pay more for Trump's visits/stays to Maralago than this newfound transgenders serving in the military "outrage."



posted on Jul, 27 2017 @ 01:08 PM
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Viagra is prescribed for more than just 'hot action'.

And all the experimental drugs they test on the troops, with the Gulf War in particular, and then all they're exposed to from Agent Orange and the like, to the Depleted Uranium rounds all heavy bullets and shells etc they have them firing, how dare the lot of you spin it as if the vet's are just soaking up viagra for hot action good times on the tax payers dollar.

Every last one of you that push on that argument ought to be ashamed of yourselves.



posted on Jul, 27 2017 @ 01:12 PM
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a reply to: RomeByFire

It aint just about the costs, its about it can take them YEARS to fully recover from the surgeries and respective treatments and therapies. So why the F are they doing it when they're supposed to be active duty? MILSPEC humans the moment they get the knife they never are again when you look at all the other stuff they reject people for.

It's some kind of ironic that ye supposed champions of the non-binary trans movement spin this whole thing as if its just a plain black & white (yes BINARY) issue where all the sense is in favor of trans you your team and everyone else are just bigoted scumbags.



posted on Jul, 27 2017 @ 01:13 PM
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a reply to: RomeByFire

Oh I agree it shouldn't even be an issue seeing they spend so much on viagra, it is purely to either deflect from something or Mike Pence making Trump do it.
All the BS excuses some here are touting are just that BS If you heard of all the Trans troops making mistakes all the time maybe look into it but by all accounts they do the same job as anyone and as well.
I expect If booted out the trans folk will be fighting this in court I dunno If they could sue but I would If they threw me out not due to my ability but because of bigotry because no matter the excuses that is the underlining reason.



posted on Jul, 27 2017 @ 01:19 PM
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originally posted by: whywhynot
The tweet is not official direction but as your source article reports the Joint Chiefs are naturally awaiting the proper directive thru the chain of command.



I wonder how much respect the "real" military has for the "tweeter in chief"?



posted on Jul, 27 2017 @ 01:22 PM
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posted on Jul, 27 2017 @ 01:22 PM
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originally posted by: IgnoranceIsntBlisss
a reply to: RomeByFire

It aint just about the costs, its about it can take them YEARS to fully recover from the surgeries and respective treatments and therapies. So why the F are they doing it when they're supposed to be active duty? MILSPEC humans the moment they get the knife they never are again when you look at all the other stuff they reject people for.

It's some kind of ironic that ye supposed champions of the non-binary trans movement spin this whole thing as if its just a plain black & white (yes BINARY) issue where all the sense is in favor of trans you your team and everyone else are just bigoted scumbags.



ye supposed champions of the non-binary trans movement spin this whole thing


According to ignorant resident ATS members, I am a liberal, I support Hillary, I'm a SJW, and no I'm a champion of the non-binary trans movement

Continue the ad Homs, I enjoy the projection



You guys act like war is full of unicorns and rainbows lol



posted on Jul, 27 2017 @ 01:23 PM
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originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: RomeByFire

I like this statistic.
Transgender people are twice as likely as the general population to serve in the military


Fake news bro

0/10 not enough dank ass memes

/s



posted on Jul, 27 2017 @ 01:23 PM
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It's not really a surprise that high-ranking military sources say there has been no change in policy...in response to a tweet.

Is it?




posted on Jul, 27 2017 @ 01:24 PM
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a reply to: IgnoranceIsntBlisss

I worked in pharmacy for a few years. During that time I had exactly one person prescribed Viagra for non-sexual reasons. Surprisingly it was a female and despite our best efforts I don't think we ever got the insurance to pay for it.

So while Viagra does have uses outside of being an ED medication it is extremely rare for it to be prescribed for those reasons.

I'll also mention that a decent number of the men with Viagra prescriptions had their insurance through Tricare. So it's not like I wasn't getting vets picking it up.



posted on Jul, 27 2017 @ 01:24 PM
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a reply to: Krazysh0t

Since there's only about 5,000 trans inhe military, does that mean all the drama in this nation the past year has been over 2,500 people???




posted on Jul, 27 2017 @ 01:25 PM
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a reply to: IgnoranceIsntBlisss

Surprising Insider Realities Of Being Trans In The Military

Here's What it's Like To Transition While A Soldier

Jerry is a transgender man serving on active duty in the Navy. He pointed out that, first, the military isn't exactly in the business of paying for extensive surgery. "Military policy is to at least cover pharmaceutical and mental healthcare. Anything else requires serious motivation and luck ... I paid for my top surgery alone, when there are thousands of guys posting [on Reddit] every day how they didn't pay a dime for their surgery, and they're, like, baristas. (Nothing against baristas, it's just insane that I've gotten PTSD as a souvenir from overseas deployments and can't get something that someone who goes home every night smelling like delicious coffee and pastries can get with a fraction of the effort.)"
↓ Continue Reading Below

He points out that if a soldier does transition while on active duty, they're bound by very strict rules as to when they can do it: "Commanders are less likely to approve you getting surgery if you have to deploy -- which makes sense, and should be the case."

Transitioning can have a significant impact on a soldier's physical capabilities. Harriet transitioned while serving in the National Guard, and she definitely noticed a difference: "When I started hormones, my strength and speed both changed considerably! Hormones affect everyone differently to a degree, but higher testosterone absolutely makes it easier to build and maintain muscle, and unless I wanted to live and sleep in a gym, I simply wasn't going to maintain the kind of fitness levels I had as a 'guy.'" Harriet shared her Army Physical Fitness Test Scorecard. Overall, her run time for two miles has increased by about six minutes, and she did significantly fewer push-ups and sit-ups, although her overall scores are "respectable, but nothing spectacular."

But the changes brought on by transition cut both ways. Jerry, our active-duty Navy trans man, said, "Exercising has gotten loads easier! I rarely train for the running part of the physical fitness test now, and I pass just fine. In the past, if I didn't run every day, my scores would be lower than average. I can lift more, I can run faster, push-ups are a breeze. I'm training for a badge run competition called the 1,000 Lbs Club: bench, squat, deadlift must equal 1,000 pounds. Females have the 600 Lbs Club. Without any serious training, I've already matched the 600-pound standard. One downside, however, is the weight gain. I've easily gained 27 pounds since starting [testosterone]. Can't lose it -- I've tried!"

The most important fact to note about soldiers transitioning while on active duty is that it's incredibly rare. This RAND study estimates between 25 and 130 surgeries per year among active-duty personnel. Between 10 and 130 soldiers per year could experience "reduced deployability." There are currently more than 50,000 active-duty soldiers who are undeployable. The vast majority of these soldiers have short-term injuries, like torn ACLs from a basketball game gone bad. If you're worried about military readiness, pick-up football games are probably a more pressing threat than transgender people.

It's ALMOST like the military has been dealing with this for some time now and Trump is just stirring # or something, but that couldn't be the case right? Trump wouldn't just # # up without understanding what he is doing right?
edit on 27-7-2017 by Krazysh0t because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 27 2017 @ 01:27 PM
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originally posted by: IgnoranceIsntBlisss
a reply to: Krazysh0t

Since there's only about 5,000 trans inhe military, does that mean all the drama in this nation the past year has been over 2,500 people???


Your math sucks. "Twice as likely" is a multiplication problem, not a division problem. But even then your wording here makes zero sense and suggests you didn't understand that statistic even slightly. But I can see how it would be funny for you to show how ignorant you are.



posted on Jul, 27 2017 @ 01:29 PM
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Trump supporter here.

To me, the OP shows that once more Trump has a bad roll out for a policy.

He should have had his people let military leaders know this was coming before he tweeted about it.

The fact that they can't even answer what will happen to active duty trans with this policy is ridiculous, and appears very amateurish.



posted on Jul, 27 2017 @ 01:30 PM
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a reply to: Krazysh0t


But about one-fifth of the transgender population in the US are veterans of the military — meaning that transgender people serve in the military at approximately twice the rate of the general population, according to a 2014 report by researchers at the UCLA School of Law.


Argh.

Haste.

5000 supposedly active.

Conventional stats say only .7% the total population of trans.

Numbers in your source still seem fishy.
edit on 27-7-2017 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 27 2017 @ 01:31 PM
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originally posted by: Jonjonj
It's not really a surprise that high-ranking military sources say there has been no change in policy...in response to a tweet.

Is it?



Not particularly, especially when one considers that apparently Mattis only knew about the "decision" the day before. Doesn't leave much time to plan for implementation.




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