The transgender con ? Many transgender regret switch

originally posted by: Sheye
a reply to: Annee

It depends on the teacher , and what they would try and teach young children.
Never give a 5 year old a suitcase that is too heavy to carry. I would prefer I teach my own children at age appropriate times.

LOL. I know some 5 year old boys would strut and try to carry an heavy suitcase just to show them!

originally posted by: Deaf Alien

originally posted by: Sheye
a reply to: Annee

It depends on the teacher , and what they would try and teach young children.
Never give a 5 year old a suitcase that is too heavy to carry. I would prefer I teach my own children at age appropriate times.

LOL. I know some 5 year old boys would strut and try to carry an heavy suitcase just to show them!

Lol... that's true.. lots would try , but it ends up being too much at the wrong time.

a reply to: ReyaPhemhurth

And that is the problem with the article that it does not reference any actual link to the scientific report.

Yes, that is indeed a problem. And I have to wonder why it was not linked in the article. I actually like to read clinical studies and peer reviews! (Yes, I'm weird that way)

Consequently, all we had were the quotes from the one who did the study. And while those are limited, to be sure, it is not inaccurate or unreasonable.

And again, had you actually read my posts, no where was I explicitly arguing in favor that ALL SRS are effective I, myself, commented on the inconclusiveness noted in the 2004 study, so not entirely sure why you're misconstruing my posts.

Here's the thing: The OP is about transgender regret. There is absolutely no doubt that there is in fact and in deed transgender regret -- especially after surgery, which is permanent. Can't just cut your hair/grow your hair out. Can't just stop wearing makeup/start wearing makeup again. Can't just go back to what you were -- because your body has been forever changed. The study is, of course, incomplete, but transgender regret is a reality, and there is nothing to argue there. We can argue about what folks with an agenda are doing with that information, but that helps no one... only light can eliminate darkness.

Instead of attacking the OP and the sources, how about acknowledging the reality and addressing it for the problem it is, and talking about the solutions. "Yes, surgery is not perfect" and "Yes, surgery is not the answer for everyone" and "This is what is being done to address the problem" or "This is being researched to understand better" or something -- anything! -- practical and productive to address the problem.

It is your perception that I was being rude. I was not being rude.

Perspective is quite the bitch, eh?

However, I do note and appreciate the lack of insults and rudeness in this post.

Pointing out misrepresentation and bias is not being rude or attacking someone.

Of course not. It's how one points it out. Obviously. One can say, "I think the article is misrepresenting the findings of the study, because..." or one can say, "The author is a damn lying liar rightwing Christian nutjob just like you!"

Again, you making such assumptions is ad-homming once more. Show how I was being rude? Assumptions are not a means of proof, they are, not surprisingly, merely assumptions.

If you don't want to be rude and insulting, then it's far more practical for you to go back over your own posts to understand and reconsider your previous words and why others would consider them rude. I can't do that for you, and I'm not going to argue with you about whether your words are rude or not.

originally posted by: kaylaluv
a reply to: RainbowPhoenix

If the Christian Taliban had their way....

And if the Transgender Taliban had their way...

Damn! That was just too easy.

I'm so tired of gay and transgender question in this country. You or anybody else in America have no right telling other Americans what is or isn't acceptable. As long has any group isn't harming other people then nobody has the right to tell them how they should live there life. I'm tired of having this christian agenda shoved down my throat. Christians some how read the bible without comprehending any of it. Christians are the most judgemental people in America. Guess what christians not everybody follows your god. We have seperation of church and state for a reason.

a reply to: ReyaPhemhurth
a reply to: kaylaluv
a reply to: testingtesting

So fricking pathetic. For all your crying and whining about Christians (and others of faith), when you have two right here trying their damnedest to understand the issues and address them with compassion and empathy, this is where you go??? Mocking? Ridicule? Insults??? Just gonna throw all Christians under the same bus because it suits your purposes? Because all Christians are exactly the same??? Just like ALL transgenders are exactly the same. Yeah, right.

And by the way, it's not only rude and insulting to discuss others this way, it's against the T&Cs.

originally posted by: Bcs8484
I'm so tired of gay and transgender question in this country. You or anybody else in America have no right telling other Americans what is or isn't acceptable. As long has any group isn't harming other people then nobody has the right to tell them how they should live there life. I'm tired of having this christian agenda shoved down my throat. Christians some how read the bible without comprehending any of it. Christians are the most judgemental people in America. Guess what christians not everybody follows your god. We have seperation of church and state for a reason.

That's your perspective. I feel the LGBTQ communities are at times shoving their ideologies and beliefs unto us.
We're just saying whoooaaa there ... lets back up a bit and take an over all look with different aspects of knowledge and wisdom.

That's what I'm saying, anyhow 😏

originally posted by: Sheye
a reply to: Annee

It depends on the teacher , and what they would try and teach young children.
Never give a 5 year old a suitcase that is too heavy to carry. I would prefer I teach my own children at age appropriate times.

Wouldn't that apply to anyone?

Point is - - Equal Rights in Employment is Federal. Would not matter if person was LGBT.

However, there is ZERO Federal protection for non-Federal LGBT to be hired. There are only state laws.

a reply to: Boadicea

Who said anything about all Christians being the same? I know plenty of good Christians who fully support people with gender dysphoria doing what they need to do to make their lives a little bit better. But just like there is a Taliban in the middle East that wants to control everyone according to what they think is right, there is a comparable group right here in the good old U.S.A that wants to legislate their own beliefs onto everyone else. I don't know about you, but I don't want to give them anymore leeway than they already have.

The article linked in the OP is nothing but religious right wing propaganda, pure and simple. All the mainstream medical professional organizations say the best treatment for gender dysphoria is to encourage living as the identified gender. How far that goes will depend on the individual, and is between that individual and their healthcare professional. It's no one else's business. Period.

The 2015 U.S. Transgender Survey tells us exactly what many trans people feel is their biggest problem -and it ain't regret that they transitioned. You can say that the largest transgender survey of its kind is fake and you can say that all the mainstream medical organizations are all wrong and that only these small fringe religious right wing groups have it right, but the rest of us know which ones to believe.

I have to be honest here. I have worked at a center that performed the surgery, taken care of kids with gender issues, and have a couple of coworkers that completely transitioned.

My coworkers, I know them quite well and both are very happy with their choices. Legitimate TG reassignment is not a spur of the moment, sorry I got a little too drunk at the bar, decision. It invokes a process that can last years, involves psychiatric assessment and signoff, living as their chosen sex for quite a while before you even go see the surgeon.

If anything its society lack of acceptance and some of the attitudes/prejudice that has many regretting the choices made.

a reply to: Boadicea

That's what they do. In every thread. Team up and gang on anyone with an opposing view with ad homs and insults. They call anyone that doesn't think like them bigots, which makes them bigots themselves, but I don't think self awareness is their strong suit. They aren't here for an honest discussion, they are only here to stifle any opposing views. It's a waste of time trying to have a civil discussion with them, trust me, I learned the hard way.

They will condemn Christianity, and in the same breath defend Islam and scream islamophobia. Double standards and hypocrisy everywhere you look.

They have all made up their minds and there is absolutely no changing it, no matter how civil your approach is and no matter how rational your concerns are.

Nope, you're just an ignorant bigot.

a reply to: Abysha

Yes, those with "more scientific knowledge of studies and reports" do understand the topic better than you. People who have dedicated their lives to study something understands that thing better than you. People who have lived experiences on a subject understand that thing better than you. It's how it works!

I know you didn't address this to me, and I'm not trying to speak for the OP, but I would like to respond...

I have been screwed over ten ways from Sunday by doctors who are too arrogant to recognize their own ignorance -- and more than once, it almost killed me. That's my confirmation bias.

I have also noted that many clinical studies are geared to produce a very narrow desired result, which is not necessarily wrong, but certainly doesn't address the big picture. And too often the desired result serves the best interests of the one doing the study... not the best interests of the patient.

My daughter, my mother, and I have all suffered mightily from hormone-related health problems. In each and every case, we have been misdiagnosed -- sometimes repeatedly. I have done a great deal of research into our issues, and I understand that hormonal issues are not well understood -- much less appropriate and/or effective treatments for these conditions. While gender dysphoria is not one of our issues, I still understand all too well the absolute hell hormonal imbalances (or something) can wreak in one's life -- physically, mentally and emotionally. So please believe that I do have tremendous empathy for anyone living with that hell.

So while I know damn well that I don't have all the answers, I also know that the medical community doesn't have all the answers either.

And, yes, I do believe with all my heart that too many doctors see dollar signs -- NOT cures -- when diagnosing and treating patients.

Now, having said that, I must also say that I firmly believe that each and every one of us is the final authority on what treatments are best for ourselves, and that it will vary from person to person, depending on the totality of their circumstances and condition.... But they deserve to have all known information on all available treatments -- the good, the bad and the ugly -- so that they can make the best decision for themselves.

For some, that may very well be surgery.

But I will also say loud and proud that it breaks my heart that anyone has to feel like they have to change themselves to be "okay." And in an ideal world, that wouldn't be necessary... but, alas, we don't live in an ideal world. We live in the real world.

a reply to: FredT

If anything its society lack of acceptance and some of the attitudes/prejudice that has many regretting the choices made.

Then why didn't they seriously look at how societies lack of acceptance would affect them as they were being screened.
You want to be brave enough to be something, then be brave enough , and don't let the naysayers get to you.

This is why I compared this to being a Christian for some... lots of people treat us as lesser humans, to be poked fun at, mocked... do people give a crap how we feel ? Nope.. Do we commit suicide because of it ? well maybe some that get extremely bullied.. I've heard of young Christian kids taking their lives because of extreme bullying from peers and even their parents.

a reply to: knowledgehunter0986

You don't know how hard I rolled my eyes after you said we would defend Islam. I hate both Christianity and Islam equally.
Nice way of bringing Islam into this conversation.

I've actually been civil to Sheye most of the time. I've understood her point clearly.

a reply to: Deaf Alien

You're right, you have atleast put the effort into trying to understand, so I apologize to you, but you're also not immune to the ad homs and insults.

I did use a large brush, but there are people in here that have defended Islam. I only brought it up to bring awareness to those that fail to see their own hypocrisy and double standards.

originally posted by: knowledgehunter0986
a reply to: Deaf Alien

You're right, you have atleast put the effort into trying to understanding, so I apologize to you, but you're also not immune to the ad homs and insults.

I did use a large brush, but there are people in here that have defended Islam. I only brought it up to bring awareness to those that fail to see their own hypocrisy and double standards.

It's hard not to retort to ad homs and insults when you are so passionate about this topic and you see posts coming as hateful. We just want to defend LGBT folks as being human beings without people calling them mentally ill or other names or with insults. And of course I would defend transgender children's rights. I understand Sheye's and your passion as well. Don't worry about that. I completely understand.

a reply to: kaylaluv

The 2015 U.S. Transgender Survey tells us exactly what many trans people feel is their biggest problem -and it ain't regret that they transitioned.

I just looked it up and will read it. (Perhaps again -- I have read many surveys and clinical studies. Probably including this one.)

ETA: Here's the link for anyone else interested in reading it: 2015 U.S. Transgender Survey

You can say that the largest transgender survey of its kind is fake and you can say that all the mainstream medical organizations are all wrong and that only these small fringe religious right wing groups have it right...

I have never said any such thing, never thought any such thing, and therefore would never say any such thing.

...but the rest of us know which ones to believe.

Surveys definitely have their value; but surveys are subjective, not scientific... hence the need to "believe" rather than "know."

a reply to: Deaf Alien

Is it hard? I endured 40+ pages of me vs the posse, and I may have let my emotions get the best of me only one time. The moment you lose your cool and resort the ad homs, any honest discussion dies with it. But what we are seeing now, people are not even upset when they throw their insults, it's now the first thing they go to, which tells me they aren't here to discuss, but rather to stifle.

The only way to have and open and honest discussion, is to be open and honest to all opinions, not just ones you want to hear.

Let people discern for themselves what they will at the end. Don't force opinions, present them.

Remember you don't demand change, you inspire it.

a reply to: knowledgehunter0986

Remember you don't demand change, you inspire it.

May I quote you from time to time?

a reply to: Deaf Alien

Go ahead, I'm always dropping gem's in the form of little quotables. Pick them up at your own leisure.