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The Vertical Plane by Ken Webster - Is this proof of Time manipulation and travel or just a story?

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posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 08:38 AM
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a reply to: sputniksteve

This is an interesting post. I followed the link on the podcast page to the forum for Ghost in the Machine. On that page, Gary Rowe says to understand it, read chapter 25 which is mislabeled as a second chapter 7. What is the nature of that chapter? What is being covered? I only have access to the podcast and I'm not sure what part of the podcast maps to that chapter.




posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 08:59 AM
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John Titor?

Anyways, I usually have a great gut instinct about stuff like this - and I'm feeling that the book is mostly fictionalized embellishments derived from a series of delusions.

So a guy in the 1500s gets a computer from the future that communicates with the future, without any power sources? And a guy from 2109 that's actually from another dimension (so therefore not 2109?) that feeds off something unknown (not food?) brings completely irrational messages with no actual substance or relevance at all?

Forgive me for my skepticism and for thinking this is fictional, but c'mon - none of it makes any sense or jives with the vibe of truth at all.



posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 11:30 AM
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originally posted by: inert
a reply to: sputniksteve

This is an interesting post. I followed the link on the podcast page to the forum for Ghost in the Machine. On that page, Gary Rowe says to understand it, read chapter 25 which is mislabeled as a second chapter 7. What is the nature of that chapter? What is being covered? I only have access to the podcast and I'm not sure what part of the podcast maps to that chapter.


I am not an all familiar with either Gary saying something or remembering what that chapter is about. Give me a few minutes though!!!! Chapter 25 is indeed labeled 7 again.

One thing about this book is that it has 1000x more spelling mistakes than I have ever seen. Most of them come from someone not in "1986" but it is a weird thing to not see corrected in a book. In any case on some of my Database I have corrected mispellings but some I have left. I wish I would have left all now because I started to wonder if maybe there could be something I am missing about them all. Then a coincidence like this? Just makes me more curious about that line of thought.



posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 11:50 AM
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has anyone got a link to this book anywhere ive been looking all day to no avail . i really want to read it. thanks to the OP for bringing this to my attention. I'm now like a dog without a bone haha



posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 11:52 AM
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originally posted by: inert
a reply to: sputniksteve

This is an interesting post. I followed the link on the podcast page to the forum for Ghost in the Machine. On that page, Gary Rowe says to understand it, read chapter 25 which is mislabeled as a second chapter 7. What is the nature of that chapter? What is being covered? I only have access to the podcast and I'm not sure what part of the podcast maps to that chapter.


Ok so chapter 25 is about 2 distinct events. The first is an instance of a Poltergiest where a metal pipe goes flying across the kitchen hitting Deb and leaving a bruise and holes in the wall. Both Ken and Deb were both very unsettled and upset about this as well as a very serious situation with Lukas. This leads them to a decision.

Ken and Deb decided to lie to a character they had been speaking to named "john" that claimed to be the local Sherrif of Lukas location. Somehow John was able to see "light box" or "leems" as they normally referred to it, which is confusing and never really explained. Anyway Lukas had been arrested for being possessed or helping a demon and was sentenced to death soon. They lied to the Sherrif and told him that while they weren't demons they had the power to damn his soul unless he made sure that Lukas was released unharmed.

I would assume that what Gary would be referring to would be the Poltergeist event from that, although I could imagine some weird scenario where he was speaking of the other matter I guess.



posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 11:55 AM
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originally posted by: dingdongdoodah
has anyone got a link to this book anywhere ive been looking all day to no avail . i really want to read it. thanks to the OP for bringing this to my attention. I'm now like a dog without a bone haha


I do not I am sorry. There are ways to get it if you are clever, and a bit lucky. I am in possession of it currently after all, and you know how rare and expensive it is.

All I can ask you is to please be patient. In case you aren't aware I have a google doc going with all of the communications from 2109 at least to whet your whistle. docs.google.com...



posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 11:57 AM
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originally posted by: sputniksteve

originally posted by: dingdongdoodah
has anyone got a link to this book anywhere ive been looking all day to no avail . i really want to read it. thanks to the OP for bringing this to my attention. I'm now like a dog without a bone haha


I do not I am sorry. There are ways to get it if you are clever, and a bit lucky. I am in possession of it currently after all, and you know how rare and expensive it is.

All I can ask you is to please be patient. In case you aren't aware I have a google doc going with all of the communications from 2109 at least to whet your whistle. docs.google.com...


I have been on and wet my whistle hours ago hehe I want more darn it! I love things like this



posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 12:01 PM
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originally posted by: dingdongdoodah

originally posted by: sputniksteve

originally posted by: dingdongdoodah
has anyone got a link to this book anywhere ive been looking all day to no avail . i really want to read it. thanks to the OP for bringing this to my attention. I'm now like a dog without a bone haha


I do not I am sorry. There are ways to get it if you are clever, and a bit lucky. I am in possession of it currently after all, and you know how rare and expensive it is.

All I can ask you is to please be patient. In case you aren't aware I have a google doc going with all of the communications from 2109 at least to whet your whistle. docs.google.com...


I have been on and wet my whistle hours ago hehe I want more darn it! I love things like this


Haha, I am sorry I should have assumed. I know how it is, once you get on this you want to devour everything available to you and not available to you. The best I can do for this very moment is offer you pictures or retyping of any specific text,chapter,or transmissions you may be curious about.

I'll ask that we please just leave it at this comment, but I promise all of you that want to get your hands on this book that you will not finish the summer in eternal disappointment. I won't reply if you ask me to be specific.



posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 12:04 PM
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originally posted by: inert
a reply to: sputniksteve

This is an interesting post. I followed the link on the podcast page to the forum for Ghost in the Machine. On that page, Gary Rowe says to understand it, read chapter 25 which is mislabeled as a second chapter 7. What is the nature of that chapter? What is being covered? I only have access to the podcast and I'm not sure what part of the podcast maps to that chapter.


I just read Gary comment on that blog. I won't lie it game me goose bumps.



posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 12:05 PM
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a reply to: sputniksteve


ive been researching the topic all afternoon. and I would love to see some photos !



posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 12:10 PM
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a reply to: sputniksteve

Gary was the physicist they called to come help investigate what was happening. He made several comments on this forum:

mercuriuspoliticus.wordpress.com/2010/11/01/ghost-in-the-machine/#comment-1441
edit on 14-7-2017 by inert because: fix link



posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 12:10 PM
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a reply to: dingdongdoodah

It would require inquiring about specific text or parts. If there are any of the 2109 communications you want context for, I think that could be the most useful at this point. Also to point out I am probably halfway through their coms I am guessing maybe more maybe less. Still lots to come If I remember correctly and most of the "good" stuff.
edit on 7/14/2017 by sputniksteve because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 12:15 PM
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a reply to: dingdongdoodah

There are some pictures here:
mysteriousuniverse.org...



posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 01:02 PM
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originally posted by: inert
a reply to: sputniksteve

Gary was the physicist they called to come help investigate what was happening. He made several comments on this forum:

mercuriuspoliticus.wordpress.com/2010/11/01/ghost-in-the-machine/#comment-1441


Gary was or still is a UFOologist at that time according to the book. He may be a physicist now though I am not aware. Is that what you are saying?

Hey you are the one that first told me about that, thanks a bunch dude. I went and read that part specifically because you mentioned it.
edit on 7/14/2017 by sputniksteve because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 01:52 PM
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Variant on a Theme: The Mandela Effect Redux

For your consideration: If precognition exists, and there is sufficient evidence to conclude it does, then human beings have a faculty which exists outside the standard time stream, and in some cases, that faculty exists in REM.

Premise: While Dreaming, the consciousness of human beings is partially isolated from the time stream of their physical body. In a sense, the consciousness and perception of the dreamer is in another "room", where the time frame can be accelerated, decelerated, or connected to an entirely different point in real time, or even alternative time lines, such as probable futures.

Instead of analyzing this from a limited myopia, saying the material evidence for this is conclusively sourced at life experience and random events leading to a confirmation bias, let us suppose for a moment that we can take it at face value: namely, that the evidence points to the existence of a true perception of real events in future timelines, both possible and actual.

We could further go on to clarify, that all future timelines are in fact, possible, and not actual, where the actual timeline is merely relative to actor perspective as it arrives. In other words, all timelines perceived are equally valid until the appropriate chain of decisions and causality unfolds, thus rendering future possibilities past opportunity costs, AKA missed opportunities.

So here's where the premise continues: If the mind of the dreamer is inside a non-local time, and thus isolated like a faraday cage from the transformations taking place in the waking world through transformations caused by a time travel technology, then it stands to reason the people upon waking from the REM, and pulling out of their isolated time frames, would return to the waking world with their original conscious memories intact, and be perplexed that their memories and intuitive experiences didn't line up with what the rest of the world experienced.

Additionally, it is also possible that while some dreamers would experience this, those that were not actually dreaming, but still sleeping, could wake up transformed like everyone else, and as a third point of consistency, any of the few people capable of conscious REM, deep day dreaming, or conscious precognition, where they appear awake, but their mind is likewise isolated and experiencing an alternative timeline through a temporally neutral cognitive space.

This would lead to many millions of people, both awake and asleep, around the world, having clear memories out of sync with the new reality.



posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 02:22 PM
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I just realized something, the reason why we don't know exactly who "one" or "john" or anyone besides Lukas or Thomas is. 2109 is most likely responsible for all the confusion on Ken and Debs part, as they are admitting to Ken and Deb that the deliberately changed some texts in order to confused or cover some things up in order to preserve something.

This might not make a lot of sense yet, but I am certain in the podcasts they discuss the fact that Ken, Deb, and Peter are at one point asked for all transmissions going to Lukas, as there was somehow 2 of them "running around in your house" according to 2109. They then had to do something to all communications that Lukas recieved. They claimed that if the 2 of them met each other it would basically explode the entire universe and time and everything. Seriously. I am not even hyperbole this.

What if the poltergeist are a second Ken, Deb, and Peter? And that is why 2109 was able to eventually stop it from happening. They altered all of the information they recieved without them knowing in order to correct the problem caused by knowing true names or something like with Lukas. That is my suggestion.

2109 are ultimately just Time Cops, paying a Demon, playing a Time cops!



posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 02:40 PM
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Let me spit ball for a second. In order to physically time travel you must basically switch places simultaneously with someone else. Like preserving balance on a scale.

If sleeping is Physically time traveling then maybe it requires doing it while sleeping and taking the place of another dreaming person. If the consequence or result of not doing it correctly is somehow kicking the original out while you take the place and when you leave they return but have a copy how could that be done while sleeping? When Deb would travel in her sleep, or sleep so that words could be passed or items then they are obviously connected. But when Deb first traveled she manifested in the fireplace I believe and was able to communicate with Lukas. So does that hurt my current line of thought or help it?

Let me go really far out on a limb because it came to me for some reason but how could this be related to dying? Would dying and reincarnating later be time travel if you remembered your first life? Was someones place taken when one died and another was born? In a linear world it wouldn't make sense that the person whose life is switched in the future would then live in the past except we don't live in a linear reality so it's doable theoretically maybe considering this is all fake. If you were dying and people were beckoning you to come to them would they have incentive to help you if they worked for a time travel corporation and needed to insert someone where you were?

I don't know



posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 02:49 PM
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I want to share a single passage that I was adding to the DB that got the last 2 posts going as I was typing. I have no idea at this point if it is viable or not I just didn't want to lose it before I had the chance to digest it. I think this is the most interesting stuff personally.

2109-

Peter You are, without any exageration, a clever and causious man whom have thought with great care your words. The use of the word “dimensional” has more relevance than you are given to believe-but we can see you care not for ‘beating about the bush”, you want to know only facts, we can understand yoar fear that communications with us may jeapardize your authenticity of this phenomena and consequently the language of Thomas Hawarden,- but you still must have some facts!. Understandable! Yes, is a straight enough ansewer, we have misslayed what evidence we could, but you will come across more than you have already. Some facts excepted in our time: 1. If a person is to physically travel in tyme then they must take the living place of a person at the point of destination and vise versa= imagine a set of scales, balanced perfectly, with eg. Pebbles. To remove a pebble from one dish to the other and keep this perfect balance you must, instantaniously, remove a pebble from the other and replace them in reverse order. You may move a couple a pebbles already in the dish but the vital balance is still kept. If someone is brought in from another dimension then again the same procedure applies. 2. Matter will not, as we know, ever travel in time (This is not a contradiction to above info.) 3 We are not in control of this experiment. 4. Thomas is a person living in the 16th century, but, unknown to him, he is not quite what he seems to be. Ken is there a possibility that you may persuade Thomas to call up this chap “one” tonight as it is imperative that we speak to him immediately. -2109

Mods I don't know how to quote this properly but I am most certainly not trying to plagiarize. Spelling mistakes are verbatim.



posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 02:58 PM
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Could the green portal be the matrix itself and brought fourth the "future" in the form of a light box, to the 1500s to one person named Lucas?

The future 2109 actually created the light box for Lucas to use and try to communicate to the present (1986) through the early word processor (computer?)

Sounds interesting.

Almost as if the future knew what happened, then created what is supposed to happen, without trying to break time and space.

Like a switch of information from 2109 to 1500 to 1986? So the future goes to the past in order to communicate with the present?
edit on 09/04/1994 by luciferslight because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 14 2017 @ 03:01 PM
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originally posted by: luciferslight

Like a switch of information from 2109 to 1500 to 1986? So the future goes to the past in order to communicate with the present?


Wow Wow Wow. Very interesting experiment.
edit on 7/14/2017 by sputniksteve because: (no reason given)


Ok now. This is implying things I am uncomfortable expressing. This instance is 1986, last one was 1941. A future entity reaching out to those specific dates is funny. I wish we knew if "we are not fully responsible for this experiment" means we are piggy backing someone else's experiment or this is a natural occurrence that we are observing and participating in.
edit on 7/14/2017 by sputniksteve because: (no reason given)



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