God, the biggest threat to mankind

More humans have died in the name of God, or a god, than any other cause in the history of mankind. Why is this? Isn’t the belief in a supreme power enlightening and wholesome? How could people, who have dedicated their beliefs and ideals to a power that is the definition of love and kindness, kill each other by the millions and millions?

Its simple: Humans aren’t perfect and humans created God. Thus “God” isn’t perfect.

God is a belief created by man to answer questions that cannot be answered. God is the answer (at least for now). God is a tool people use to feel comfortable with things or events out of their control. Or seemingly out of their control. God is like divine super glue. God sticks all the pieces together that people seem to have trouble doing themselves.

Is this a horrible thing that people have this belief? Not at all. If it works for you then go with it. The problem with God is, the people who believe in him think that everybody else MUST believe in him. And not just believe in him, but believe EXACTLY what you believe. This is such a strong feeling among believers, they actually think that 100% of people who do not share their belief will go to a horrible place called Hell when they die. Its not even good enough that you believe in God, you must believe in their God.

Some people, will even KILL you for not sharing their exact belief. This has caused more deaths than any other single cause in the history of man. “God” is the worlds #1 terrorist recruiter.

Disturbing isn’t it? But its all true. Or so I think anyways. But that’s part of my point. I am “going to hell” because I don’t believe in a God. But am I really? Does a mans actions determine his fate? Or his beliefs?

For example: I am a nice guy. I am kind and polite and I have no criminal record. I walk old ladies across the street and I say things like “please” and “thank you”. I smile and do what I can to be pleasant. I have a wonderful wife and son. But I don’t “believe” so I am going to hell. Am I getting it right so far?

Now get this: A man of the cloth, or representative of God can rape young boys by the dozens. The whole hierarchy above him can cover it up and make it go away but they all believe. But these people, because they believe, will be forgiven and will go to heaven. A man can brutally murder an old women in her home to steal $10 from her. And so long as he finds God before he dies he will be saved. This makes sense huh?

Do you know why all this is like it is? Its because people are terrified of not knowing answers to big scary questions. People have developed things like religions to help cope with these questions. And people are so scared of these things, they have programmed themselves into a frenzy of believing. Everybody must believe this, as it justifies their own beliefs. To the point of murder is some cases. It gets to the point that everything that they cannot easily explain in their life is “Gods will”. BAH!!!

Gods will, kills.

Do you know in some ancient cultures they had many gods? They had a god for everything that they couldn’t answer. The Greeks, Incans, Egyptians all had many gods. There was even a Sun god. They believed in their gods as heartily as you believe in yours. If an ancient Incan was in front of you debating their belief in the Sun god, they would be as passionate as you are about your god. But any modern believer knows there is no Sun god, that’s just silly right? But is it?

Incans had no explanation for the Sun. The Sun was everything and all important. A very powerful influence in their lives. But they didn’t know why, so it must be a supreme being. It was the only answer, believe it or die!!! But guess what? They were wrong and religions that worshiped the Sun are no more. Because today we all know what the Sun is and we understand how it effects our lives. No more Sun god.

See where I am going with this? Today there is only one god in all the main stream large scale religions. Why? Because all the “silly” stuff has been explained away. But why is there still any belief at all? Two major reasons:

#1 People are scared to believe anything else. People kill people who don’t believe.
#2 There is still 1 huge scary question that has not been answered. The biggest of all.
-What happens to me when I die?

Because there is no proven answer for this question, the biggest, scariest question of all, people still need something to help their psyche’s cope. As long as this is still up in the air, God will always “exist”.

I know I will get flamed for this next remark, but some weaker people even think that God controls things like passion and desire. Hate and love and emotions in general. This is all bunk. They blame crimes on the Devil and their successes on God. God and the devil are just easy solutions to their weak wills and lack of control over their very HUMAN desires.

One day, when our mothers and fathers stop forcing their kids to believe one thing or another based on their own fears, humans will shed themselves of the plague known as religion. It’s a psychological virus that is the scourge of all mankind. Someday it is quite possible that belief in a God will end humans existence. Not by “Gods” hand, but by our own fears of the unknown. People kill people who don’t believe. Period.

How many people reading my dissertation here will “pray” for me? How many people reading this will wish me to hell for my sacrilege? How many will reply with an attempt at “saving” me? How many will plot to kill me as a heathen?

Well everybody, I don’t need saving. I am content in my own beliefs and I sleep well at night believing them. My failures and successes are my own and I am a very nice, good person with many loving friends and relatives. When I die I am dead and that’s Ok. I also don’t have an issue with people believing in religion per say. After all, if something you believe in makes you feel good then wonderful! But please, please don’t try to infect me with your beliefs, as mine are just fine.

Remember: People that don’t believe in God, rarely care about your belief IN God. You don’t see non believers killing people of religion in an attempt to convert you to non belief. Its because we aren’t scared anymore. Wait, scratch that. We ARE scared. Of YOU, as God has killed more people over belief than any other cause of death in history…

Eloquently put. [voted for above]

The old argument though is always "religion doesn't kill people- people do." despite religion being reliant of masses of people. Round and round we go. I agree with everything you have said.. and share the same fear of believers believing that little bit too much.

Heres to humans respecting the creation and not the deadbeat dad!

[edit on 7-2-2005 by riley]

Im kind and polite and am nice and love doing good works, but you see I was never like that until jesus taught me that, and I still fall into selfish sin.


Ask yourself how you learned to act in a good manner, trace back to who taght you, and who taught the one that taught you and you will see it prbably came from christ or a christian virtue.


Only his grace makes us good, without which we would most likely be filled with selfishness. This is the problem today and its pride. people consider that they are the reason for their own
goodness, not realizing that it is God who taught us this virtue.


Even Jesus says in scripture to someone who called him good.


" why do you call me good, for it is one alone who is good and it is my faher in heaven "


I would never be good without his grace, and I wasnt before I knew his words, but even now that im a little good, I still have selfish sins im still battling.




One thing I do agree on is that people who kill in the name of God on their own judgement, is not following the will of God. Jesus clearly says "blessed are the peace makers".

Truth,

Whos God is real, yours or the Incans Sun God?

Why?

You will find that the american sungods can be traced back to babylon.

The same religion that was held in babylon was carried away from the events at the Tower of Babel.

It was satans creation to lead people away from God. It was after that event that God called Abraham and established his covenant with him in order to provide salvation to the human race.

That religion at babel , the worship of the sungod, traveled out when God scattered the people over the face of the earth. It is the same relgion we saw in Assyria, Egypt, Persia, Greece, Rome, Norse, the RCC, as well as the americas.
Only the names have been changed

The research on this is rather laborious and I have only skimmed the Inca.
I have completed the Navajo and Mayan however, so I will present you with those

If you already know the story behind Ester, Ishtar, Isis, and Semiranmis, then you are ahead of the curve on this one.

In Genesis we learn
[QUOTE]Gen 10:8 And Cush begot Nimrod: he began to be a mighty one in the earth.
Gen 10:9 He was a mighty hunter before the LORD: wherefore it is said, Even as Nimrod the mighty hunter before the LORD.
Gen 10:10 And the beginning of his kingdom was Babel, and Erech, and Accad, and Calneh, in the land of Shinar.
[/QUOTE]
Nimrod grew to be a powerful man. A mighty one in the earth. He was a mighty hunter before the Lord. Some take that literal, some take it to mean he hunted/enslaved people. The word "before" is also crucial here because of its many meanings, one of which suggests that Nimrod lifted himself up as God.
When Nimrod died, his wife was found to be with child.

The Tower at Babel was being built to keep people together, in one place, under one rule. One world religion, one world government. The Tower was not to be literally high enough to reach heaven, but rather, the center of religion, with Nimrod at the top, as God, over all people.
Emperor worship is common in history, and this was the first case.

Keep in mind, when Noah disembarked, God gave the command
[QUOTE]ASV) And God blessed Noah and his sons, and said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth.

(CEV) God said to Noah and his sons: I am giving you my blessing. Have a lot of children and grandchildren, so people will live everywhere on this earth.

(ESV) And God blessed Noah and his sons and said to them, "Be fruitful and multiply and fill the earth. [/QUOTE]

In the preflood world, man was of one language and in one place, and corruption was easily spread. Gods command was for people to go and fill the earth.
What was Nimrods idea?
[QUOTE]Gen 11:4 And they said, Come, let us build us a city, and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven, and let us make us a name; lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth. [/QUOTE]
Just the opposite. Now it was too late. The seed had been planted. So God took action. He made many languages out of one, and scattered man over the face of the earth. Then He further separated the continents.
More about that can be found HERE

[QUOTE]Semiranmis, queen of Babylon, after her husband's death, was found to be with child. It was declared that this child was the product of divine conception. Nimrod, the sun god was the father via a special ray of the sun. Semiramis named her son Damu which later Babylonian language became Dammuzi. In the Bible it is rendered "Tammuz". Of course any son with such a claim to his conception was deified. Semiramis also deified herself as the mother of god (since only a god can beget a god) and installed herself as "The Queen of Heaven" pictured in the constellation Cassiopeia.

The story was invented that she was a virgin sprung from the sea, and therefore a gift from the gods. Her name was later hellenized to "Sammur-amat" or "gift of the sea." Most goddess worship as well as sun worship can be traced right back to Samiranmis.

This one woman had such a lasting impact upon world history that the land from which civilization arose, (lower Mesopotamia) was known as the "Land of Sammur" or when translated into Hebrew becomes "the land of Shinar".
[/QUOTE]



Now lets talk about the Navajo

[QUOTE]The Navajo creation story involves three underworlds where important events happened to shape the Fourth World where we now live.
[/QUOTE]
Many creation stories of peoples in the americas, deal with multiple 'underworlds'.
I believe these underworlds are mentioned in the bible.
1. Pre-flood earth
2. Post flood earth
3. Babel, when the world went dark
4. Current, post babel, post separation earth

[QUOTE]The Navajo were given the name Ni’hookaa Diyan Diné by their creators. It means "Holy Earth People" or "Lords of the Earth"[/QUOTE]
Now the bible
[QUOTE]Gen 1:28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.
[/QUOTE]

-
[QUOTE]According to the Diné, (the name that Navajo call themselves) they emerged from three previous underworlds into this, the fourth, or "Glittering World", through a magic reed.[/QUOTE]

The bible
[QUOTE]By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house;... [/QUOTE]

-

[QUOTE] First Man ('Altsé Hastiin), and First Woman ('Altsé 'Asdzáá), were two of the beings from the First or Black World. First Man was made in the east from the meeting of the white and black clouds. First Woman was made in the west from the joining of the yellow and blue clouds.[/QUOTE]

The bible teaches that the presence of God is accompanied by clouds as shown in the babel/peleg thread linked above.

The garden was East of Eden.

-

[QUOTE]Once in the Glittering World, the first thing the people did was build a sweat house and sing the Blessing Song. [/QUOTE]

the bible says the first thing Noah did was worship the Lord
[QUOTE]Gen 8:18 And Noah went forth, and his sons, and his wife, and his sons' wives with him:
Gen 8:19 Every beast, every creeping thing, and every fowl, and whatsoever creepeth upon the earth, after their kinds, went forth out of the ark.
Gen 8:20 And Noah built an altar unto the LORD; and took of every clean beast, and of every clean fowl, and offered burnt offerings on the altar.
[/QUOTE]

-

Now we jump to babel when the people were scattered to the 4 corners of the earth

[QUOTE]In this hogan, the people began to arrange their world, naming the four sacred mountains surrounding the land and designating the four sacred stones that would become the boundaries of their homeland.[/QUOTE]

In the babel/peleg thread you learned
[QUOTE]Isa 24:1 Behold, Jehovah maketh the earth empty, and maketh it waste, and turneth it upside down, and scattereth abroad the inhabitants thereof.

Job 12:24 He taketh away understanding from the chiefs of the people of the earth, And causeth them to wander in a wilderness where there is no way.
Job 12:25 They grope in the dark without light; And he maketh them to stagger like a drunken man. [/QUOTE]
-

The next thing the Navajo tell us is

[QUOTE]The "Holy People", put the sun and the moon into the sky [/QUOTE] Which suggests that the time of the 4 directions was one of darkness. Incredible likeness to what scripture tells us.

-

[QUOTE]The Holy People continued to make the necessities of life, like clouds, trees and rain[/QUOTE]
The bible tells us that after the flood, the earth was desolate. The people watched as plant life began to emerge for seemingly the first time. The so called, 'Holy people' took credit for it.

-

Now, in a time when the population of man is growing, and when a climate has changed so drastically, what would happen when the more powerful of the animal kingdom started running low on food?

[QUOTE]Everything was as it should be when the evil monsters appeared and began to kill the new Earth People.[/QUOTE] We see the Navajo tell us of the dinosaurs

[QUOTE]But a miracle happened to save them, by the birth of Ever Changing Woman[/QUOTE]
Now we have the introduction of Ester, Ishtar, Isis, and or Semiranmis. They are one in the same, and known as Ever Changing Woman to the Navajo.

[QUOTE]She married the Sun and bore two son, twins, and heroes to the Navajo people. They were known as "Monster Slayer" and "Child-Born-of-Water". The twins traveled to their father the Sun who gave them weapons of lighting bolts to fight the dreaded monsters.[/QUOTE]
In this case she has twins, whom the sungod taught how to slay monsters.
They were great hunters
Like Nimrod, whos hunting prowess was legendary when on earth. You will remember that Nimrod went on to become the sungod.
One of those dinosaurs was called "Monster who Sucked in People"

-

[QUOTE]For her husband, the "Sun", to visit her every evening, Changing Woman went to live in the western sea on an island made of rock crystal.[/QUOTE]

Remember what we learned about the first "Queen of Heaven"?
[QUOTE]The story was invented that she was a virgin sprung from the sea, and therefore a gift from the gods. Her name was later hellenized to "Sammur-amat" or "gift of the sea." Most goddess worship as well as sun worship can be traced right back to Samiranmis.
[/QUOTE]

-

[QUOTE]During the day she became lonely and decided to make her own people. She made four clans from the flakes of her skin. These were known as the Near Water People, Mud People, Salt Water People, and Bitter Water People. When these newly formed clans heard that there were humans to the east who shared their heritage, they wanted to go meet them.
[/QUOTE]

Recent DNA testing has revealed that some tribes in the americas can be traced to the people of Indonesia - Australia area. The migrated to the americas in boats , following the coast line. This information can be found in google.

-

The parallels with history and the bible are too numerous to ignore.

I will follow with the Maya

The following is the Maya version of creation side by side with the bible version


[QUOTE]Gen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
Gen 1:2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
Gen 1:3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.[/QUOTE]
“Everything was quiet and in suspense; nothing moved, the sky was empty. There were no men or animals, fish, trees, stones, caves, canyons, or forests. Only the sky existed, there was no surface of the earth. The sea and the sky were calm…the darkness was still and quiet. Only the creator, Tepeu Gucumatz and the progenitors were in the water surrounded by light.

Notice in both accounts there is light without sunshine.


[QUOTE]Gen 1:9 And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so
.Gen 1:11 And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so. [/QUOTE]
The words of the gods were raised by magic and prodigy, the earth emerged from the water: “Earth, they said, and it was made instantly”. The mountains and the trees followed, and lakes and rivers were formed.


[QUOTE]Gen 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.[/QUOTE]

Then the Creators said: “Let’s now try and make some obedient, respectful beings that will feed and support us, and worship us “. And so they created man out of mud.

the mayan account says that the men made of mud fell apart, so they made new men out of wood

[QUOTE]Gen 6:13 And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence through them; and, behold, I will destroy them with the earth. [/QUOTE]
They looked like man, they talked and reproduced like man and populated the surface of the earth, but they didn’t have a spirit, they didn’t understand and they didn’t remember their creators. They didn’t have blood or moisture or flesh; they were dry. They didn’t remember Heart of the Sky and so they fell from grace.


[QUOTE]Gen 7:10 And it came to pass after seven days, that the waters of the flood were upon the earth.
Gen 7:11 In the six hundredth year of Noah's life, in the second month, the seventeenth day of the month, the same day were all the fountains of the great deep broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened.
Gen 7:12 And the rain was upon the earth forty days and forty nights. [/QUOTE]
flashback
[QUOTE]Gen 2:10 And a river went out of Eden to water the garden; and from thence it was parted, and became into four heads. [/QUOTE]

Then Heart of the Sky caused a great flood that destroyed the stick men.
“And then, the waters arrived, all at once. And when the serpent was stolen, the skies fell in and inundated the earth. Then the four Bacab (the gods that held up the skies) leveled everything.

it could be argued that the four waters, or rivers, flooded the earth, in the memory of the maya

[QUOTE]Gen 7:13 In the selfsame day entered Noah, and Shem, and Ham, and Japheth[/QUOTE]-- after the flood the mayan say that the next men were created from corn. 4 men were created




After the flood
[QUOTE]Gen 8:20 And Noah built an altar unto the LORD; and took of every clean beast, and of every clean fowl, and offered burnt offerings on the altar.[/QUOTE]
Moreover, they were given intelligence, perfect vision and infinite wisdom. Because of this, they immediately recognized and worshipped the Creators

----------------------------------
Then we move on to babel, when man first lifted himself up as a god. The time when the sun went dark and men were scattered over the earth.

[QUOTE]Gen 11:4 And they said, Go to, let us build us a city and a tower, whose top may reach unto heaven; and let us make us a name, lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth.
Gen 11:6 And the LORD said, Behold, the people is one, and they have all one language; and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do. [/QUOTE]
But they realized that if man were perfect, he would not recognize nor worship the gods, they would consider themselves equals and they would not propagate.


Gen 11:7 Go to, let us go down, and there confound their language, that they may not understand one another's speech.
Gen 11:8 So the LORD scattered them abroad from thence upon the face of all the earth: and they left off to build the city.
Then the priest said: “Heart of the Sky put a vapor on his eyes that clouded up like when one breathes on a mirror. Their eyes were veiled and they could see only those things that were close up.”



[QUOTE]Isa 24:1 Behold, the LORD maketh the earth empty, and maketh it waste, and turneth it upside down, and scattereth abroad the inhabitants thereof.
Job 12:24 He taketh away the heart of the chief of the people of the earth, and causeth them to wander in a wilderness where there is no way. [/QUOTE]
The tribes multiplied and under the cover of darkness, went to Tulán where they received the images of their gods. One of them, Tohil, gave them fire and taught them to make sacrifices to the gods. Then dressed in animal skins, they went up to the top of a mountain to await the rising of the sun, the dawn of the current world.


From this point, the Mayan tradition becomes mixed with the religon present at the time of babel, and which was followed by Babylon, Egypt, Rome, Assyria, Persia, Greece. The sungod becomes the ruler, and the morning star is worshiped.
First Nobok Ek appeared, the great Morning Star. He announced the arrival of the Sun. The men burned incense and made their offerings. Then the Sun came out, followed by the Moon and the stars. “The animals were happy”, said Ah-Gucamatz, “ and they went to the sides of the rivers, the ravines and to the tops of the mountains and they all looked towards the place where the Sun was rising. The lions and tigers roared…and the vultures and eagles, small birds and large stretched their wings. The surface of the earth was suddenly dried by the Sun.” Thus ended the priest’s story.






Of course, this is all just a coincidence right?
There is evidence everywhere.

well.


I never have and neer will believe in a Sun God, evenbefore I knew of Jesus. Its obvious the Sun
i here to heat the planet and light the planet with sunshine. Any soul with half an ounce of sincerity should
know this automatically by using their own reason.

So yes, I believe in my God over the Sun who God created. He also created you too.



peace.

Originally posted by Truth

Im kind and polite and am nice and love doing good works, but you see I was never like that until jesus taught me that, and I still fall into selfish sin.

That's good for you. I was this way before I "found Jesus," and after I kicked him to the curb.

Ask yourself how you learned to act in a good manner, trace back to who taght you, and who taught the one that taught you and you will see it prbably came from christ or a christian virtue.

No, it's from a Buddhist virtue. "Find yourself in others; then whom can you harm?" from the Dhammapadda.
And before you try and pull the "Buddhist teachings are based of Christ's teachings, consider this: Gautama Buddha lived around 566 B.C.
No, it didn't come from a Christian virtue. Bite me.

Only his grace makes us good, without which we would most likely be filled with selfishness. This is the problem today and its pride. people consider that they are the reason for their own
goodness, not realizing that it is God who taught us this virtue.

Human beings are selfish by nature. And if you're right, apparently God loves even those who do not worship him, and give people like me his grace. Heh.

I would never be good without his grace, and I wasnt before I knew his words, but even now that im a little good, I still have selfish sins im still battling.

That's you. I wish you luck on your battle with the intangible.

One thing I do agree on is that people who kill in the name of God on their own judgement, is not following the will of God. Jesus clearly says "blessed are the peace makers".

Jesus also said “Think not that I am come to send peace on earth. I came not to send peace, but a sword." Mt. 10:34

Originally posted by Truth
I never have and neer will believe in a Sun God, evenbefore I knew of Jesus. Its obvious the Sun
i here to heat the planet and light the planet with sunshine.

Nobody has asked you to believe anything. That's how Christianity differs from...everybody else.

Any soul with half an ounce of sincerity should
know this automatically by using their own reason.

Christian logic is superior to Pagan logic, I see?

So yes, I believe in my God over the Sun who God created. He also created you too.

"Sun who"? You're personifying something you believe has no personification. Either-or - not both.

You can think what you want, but its easy to tell what your all about by the way you speak.


" bite me "


do you find yourself in me.


Thats the difference. Jesus tells us to even love our enemies todeath and hate noone.


Also Jesus was with God 1,000 of years before Bhudda ever existed.


Matt 10:34 speaks about division amongst family's. Not to put the love of your father, mother, son ect above him, and that many in different familes will be divided
in the belief of jesus.


this is how it is in my own family, its exactly how it is. Even though we are divided I still love them to death and wish to God
they would beleieve in Jesus.


Look I don't need to get intothis hate fest with you, man, ive been in too many of those.



To theoriginal poster. Trust me God lovesus to death and is watching every moment.


peace.





[edit on 7-2-2005 by Truth]

Originally posted by Truth
Also Jesus was with God 1,000 of years before Bhudda ever existed.

But wasn't Jesus half human?

Even though we are divided I still love them to death and wish to God they would beleieve in Jesus.

Does their not believing cause division?

To theoriginal poster. Trust me God lovesus to death and is watching every moment.

This sentence alone imposes your beliefs.

[edit on 8-2-2005 by riley]

Riley, Jesus was 100% human and 100% divine. He was a divine human, God in the flesh. helft felt everything as a human, but knew ereything
of God. he also never sinned.

Yea it causes alot of division. everytime you try and explain a miracle they don' seem to believe it. Also I believe in
te celebration of communion, and they don't.

Its very hard to cnverse with them about religion.


thanks for your time riley.

Originally posted by Truth
Riley, Jesus was 100% human and 100% divine. He was a divine human, God in the flesh. helft felt everything as a human, but knew ereything
of God. he also never sinned.

1. He can't be a god and human at the same time.. and there is little point sacrificing an omnipotent god for our sins [human vulnerability thing].
2. He also can't be human and devine at the same time.. because ALL humans are meant to have original sin.. he was baptised so this is an admission that he did indeed carry that sin.. and he couldn't be human without it. His mother was also a decendnet of Adam and Eve obviously.

Yea it causes alot of division. everytime you try and explain a miracle they don' seem to believe it. Also I believe in
te celebration of communion, and they don't.

And if you just accepted who they are and concentrated and acted on Jesus' message [compassion] and not just Jesus and the bible [that is irritating] you may actually unite rather than divide. I respect christians who practice rather than preach. I respect both Jesus' and Buddha's message.. it's basically the same.

Its very hard to cnverse with them about religion.

If they are good hearted people that already possess morality.. why would you feel the need to discuss religion/convert them? Sounds like a bit of a power struggle there.. way of the world.
I do hope you are able to find a middle ground where everyones diverse beliefs are appreciated.

[edit on 8-2-2005 by riley]

Riley thats pretty rude of you to think you know how i conerse with my family. I absolutely do accept
them how they are, and treat them with tons of respect never juding them, but they seem to only want to talk about sports
or things that are fun but don't really matter, an wen you tel them that you have seen a miracle they kind of seem
like they don't believe it.


About Jesus being baptised. He suffered to do this as a reminder of what we should do.


As it says in matt. " Suffer me to be baptised "


As clearly he never sinned according to Peter 2:22 and Hebrews 4:15.


He also came as a servant, being God coming as a servant as told in Phillipians 2.



peace.

Originally posted by Truth
Riley thats pretty rude of you to think you know how i conerse with my family.

It wasn't rude.. you already said it causes alot of division.

I absolutely do accept them how they are, and treat them with tons of respect never juding them, but they seem to only want to talk about sports or things that are fun but don't really matter,

Yet you have dismissed the things they talk about as not mattering which shows you do not respect what matters to them. Some people treasure relgion- others treasure sport or some of the other 'fun' things life has to offer. Whats matters changes from person to person.

an wen you tel them that you have seen a miracle they kind of seem like they don't believe it.

But if they are expected to believe it then they would be expected to wholeheartedly believe in religion as you do.. which would mean converting.

About Jesus being baptised. He suffered to do this as a reminder of what we should do.

He was still half human.. I do not see any way he could be exempt from the original sin.

[edit on 9-2-2005 by riley]

.
God isn't so much the problem as ignorant people thinking they know God or about God or are acting in God's cause.

It makes more sense to me simply to believe there is no God.
I think choosing Virtue, truth and beauty as your mission is more important. If you find a God who perfectly embodies those qualities, then for however long they do you have a worthwhile God.

If on the other hand you choose a God because he makes you feel good, like coc aine and other things do, or choose a God because he is the most powerful around, like the biggest badest gangster around, or both, what do you really have? How can you ever conceive your God is just, kind, merciful, intelligent if you didn't choose them on this basis.

Most people today follow the Gods they do Because he/it made them feel good when they were down. Some people also worship coc aine. Faith is the mechanism that allows a marginal or corrupt God to persist and be empowered by blind ignorant followers.

Exactly how do you separate your God from Satan? If God uses wanton violence destruction, brutality, inhumane treatment of people, He just sounds like a powerful monster to me. And a lot of lacky dogs will follow this brutal master. If people were smarter than dogs they could see this. Most can't.

I have wondered if God and Satan aren't the same person. The distinction is not clear to me.
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Oh no riley, what they do say means something to me, but it just doesnt mean that much in terms of importance.


And the way I converse to them does not divide anybody, but because I believe in the wworship of God and the catholic church is why. Im a religious fanatic.


I just dont think football or sports should be the focal point in your life. We are children of God called to be literal saints on earth. It makes me mad to see someone put football over God. I used to do it too.


thats just how I see life now. The only importance is God and preparing for eternal hapiness, and while I do get caught up in the world sometimes, even through sports, it still
does not change the fact that I believe we all have a very high calling which is so greater than any game or anything tha the world can provide for you.



peace.

Originally posted by Truth
Oh no riley, what they do say means something to me, but it just doesnt mean that much in terms of importance.

Fair enough.. so long as you don't tell them that.

The only importance is God and preparing for eternal hapiness,

I think morality is very important- but enjoying life is as well. I don't think a possible after life should be seen more important than life itself [as religion does]. I consider that disrespecting the gift of life.

I believe we all have a very high calling which is so greater than any game or anything tha the world can provide for you.

I personally find [most] sports boring.. but the world provides EVERYTHING for us.. I think people should appreciate all it has to offer.

[edit on 11-2-2005 by riley]

Originally posted by riley
But wasn't Jesus half human?

As the story goes, Jesus (who is actually god [father,son,holy spirit]) came down in the form of a man.

Does their not believing cause division?

if you don't believe in Jesus you cannot enter the kingdom of heaven, unless it's through him. Because he is the one that saved all of us.

'for he so loved the world, he gave up his only begotten son for us, jesus christ"

Originally posted by TrueLies
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Does their not believing cause division?

if you don't believe in Jesus you cannot enter the kingdom of heaven, unless it's through him. Because he is the one that saved all of us.

'for he so loved the world, he gave up his only begotten son for us, jesus christ"

I didn't ask what happens to not believers.. I asked if not believing causes divison. Clearly it does.