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Übermensch, Your answer to Biblical questioning. Overcome it.

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posted on Feb, 6 2005 @ 09:10 PM
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I found this article on wikipedia, and couldn't help myself. I feel as though I have Übermensch. I have questioned my religion and eventually have gone to step #2 re-evaluating or destroying old ideals, and am now in the phase of step 3. Unfortunately, I never discovered this great concept until step 3. So, this idea was totally omitted during my phases.

In Thus spake Zarathustra (in German, Also sprach Zarathustra), the German philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche explains the three steps through which man can become an Übermensch (literally, 'overman' or 'superman'):

1. By his will to destruction
2. By re-evaluating or destroying old ideals
3. By overcoming nihilism

Source:
en.wikipedia.org...


I would suggest all of you Religion-Conspiracy board members to read this, even if you disagree with the content.




posted on Feb, 6 2005 @ 09:21 PM
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Good stuff. Nietzsche was unfairly slandered post mortem with false allegations of syphillis. In truth he was the greatest humanist philospher of his time, perhaps any time. A poet's skill with words on his best day to boot, the man was a fine thinker and a good sturdy writer.

The idea that men can become gods is what it's really all about. All the OLD stuff points in this direction, but it takes enormous sacrifice to unearth mysteries of that magnitude. The interpretation is of course crucial, because no man can be convinced by another, each must blaze their own trail. Many will disagree, and claim pride. I defer them to Destiny and allow Evolution the killing blow. There is no book that makes men into gods, no tablet or verse or intonation. Every human being must rise or fall based on all the factors that make them a unique experiment.



posted on Feb, 6 2005 @ 09:30 PM
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Originally posted by WyrdeOne
Good stuff. Nietzsche was unfairly slandered post mortem with false allegations of syphillis. In truth he was the greatest humanist philospher of his time, perhaps any time. A poet's skill with words on his best day to boot, the man was a fine thinker and a good sturdy writer.

The idea that men can become gods is what it's really all about. All the OLD stuff points in this direction, but it takes enormous sacrifice to unearth mysteries of that magnitude. The interpretation is of course crucial, because no man can be convinced by another, each must blaze their own trail. Many will disagree, and claim pride. I defer them to Destiny and allow Evolution the killing blow. There is no book that makes men into gods, no tablet or verse or intonation. Every human being must rise or fall based on all the factors that make them a unique experiment.



Great post!
I enjoyed reading your perspective. Well put, pal. You get an Above Top Secret vote from me.



posted on Feb, 7 2005 @ 04:26 PM
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It's amazing the lack of responses to something that requires more than speculative thought.



posted on Feb, 8 2005 @ 11:40 AM
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Step One: Completed
My thinking is not "God-centered," nor do I subscribe to asceticism.

Step Two: Completed
My ethics, morals, and principles are based upon what is acceptable behavior to me, not to anyone else. Nor do I abide by them in expectation of some otherworldly reward. I abide by them because I must live with myself. "Harm none; do what ye will."

Step Three: Completed (sort of)
While I do believe in the transcendental, I do so according to the principle of conservation of energy, not according to any religious belief. In other words, transcending the mortal world is something that happens automatically and to everyone. Thoughts are electrical and chemical energy. Energy can neither be created nor destroyed, only transformed. I believe that transcending the mortal world is a function of human evolution.

I also believe in the power of thought. It is possible that what happens to one's "soul" after death depends upon one's beliefs.

Hmm...Chaos Theory? The Collective Unconscious? The Force? "For every action, there is an equal, but opposite, reaction."

Any thoughts on this? Would Nietzsche approve? *grins*



posted on Feb, 8 2005 @ 11:56 AM
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Keep in mind that nearly three quarters of the world lack the brain power to think in complex patterns. The average human mind can barely keep its body alive, nevermind explore the far reaches of the cosmos or debate the futility of morals based on existential perceptions of life. Most people are principally concerned with what's for dinner, who they're nailing, making sure nobody else is nailing him/her, and getting a good nights rest to do it all over again. This is exactly why all the old mysteries and each of their bastard offspring religions used parable and metaphor as a device to explain complex concepts.

LunaNik
Don't just believe it possible, just believe. Imagine the place you will go every day until your death, see it in perfect detail, memorize every aspect so that you could write a novel comprised of but one scene. When you die, your brain will piss itself with chemicals, and you will either give in to abject terror and darkness, or you will return to that place you loved so well and live there for the last seconds of your life.

A few seconds, that's not much, you say. Consider the fact that 'brain time' or 'dream time' encompasses many hours, even days, within a single second of actual time. Eternity awaits..



posted on Feb, 8 2005 @ 01:02 PM
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Originally posted by The Division Bell
I found this article on wikipedia, and couldn't help myself. I feel as though I have Übermensch.

Whoa, hold on for a minute. Before you start mucking around with that stuff you might want to do a little more than read a wikipedia article. Ubermensch means superman, the over man, as opposed to Untermensch, under men, sub humans. You don;t 'have' ubermensch, you can be or become one by moving beyond conventional humanity and morality. Keep in mind that this often will involve doing utterly immoral, conventionally, things.



I would suggest all of you Religion-Conspiracy board members to read this, even if you disagree with the content.

I think most people on ATS are more familiar with Nietzsche than a wikipedia article will allow.

[edit on 8-2-2005 by Nygdan]



posted on Feb, 8 2005 @ 01:12 PM
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Nygdan,
In my interpretation in is not saying to do immoral things, it is saying that there is no such thing as moral or immoral because of the philosophy of nillism. I've done more than read a wikipedia article on Frederick Wilhelm Nietzsche.



posted on Feb, 8 2005 @ 01:16 PM
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Ah, good, because your first post made it out like you'd never heard of him or going beyond good and evil until the wiki article.

N's stuff requires that you might very well end up doing highly immoral things, its just that you've changed your definitions of good/evil to better suite your own will.

Raskolnikov, for example, went beyond good and evil, in killing the old woman. Her life was meaningless, an offense to his will in a sense, and in killing her he did nothing wrong, for his new morality.



posted on Feb, 8 2005 @ 02:16 PM
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Originally posted by Nygdan
Ah, good, because your first post made it out like you'd never heard of him or going beyond good and evil until the wiki article.


Well, you are correct in that assumption. I didn't know much when I posted this thread, but did a lot of research via internet about him and have ordered a book through amazon dot com. You were correct.



posted on Feb, 8 2005 @ 02:40 PM
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excellent, which one if you don't mind my asking?



posted on Feb, 8 2005 @ 02:46 PM
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Originally posted by Nygdan
excellent, which one if you don't mind my asking?

Beyond Good & Evil : Prelude to a Philosophy of the Future by FRIEDRICH NIETZSCHE, WALTER KAUFMANN (Translator)
www.amazon.com...=1107895768/sr=8-2/ref=pd_csp_2/104-4904751-0483146?v=glance&s=books&n=507846



posted on Feb, 8 2005 @ 04:29 PM
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Mein Liebchen, you already satisfied Godwin's Rule with the first word in the title of your thread. Sigh.



posted on Feb, 8 2005 @ 04:35 PM
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Originally posted by Chakotay
Mein Liebchen, you already satisfied Godwin's Rule with the first word in the title of your thread. Sigh.


How so? Ich bin nicht ein liebchen.



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