What Is The Best Way To Lower Medical Care Costs In America - We Are Being Raped.

Stop lobbyists and cronyism ? Term limits. And get rid of the Old Boys Gang .

a reply to: carewemust

Jail time for lawbreakers be a good start, bet rest get in line real quick like we're a few examples made.

No joke folks,

Back in robber baron days laws were passed to protect US citizenry against monopolies and all that comes with them, Standard Oil is great example of this. Railroads, Steel and Telephone companies were also broken up and competitive practices were reintroduced into marketplace.

In this set of laws are specific individual laws dealing with price fixing, price collusion in marketplace. Laws stating that same prices for like services, no charging based upon made criteria - has to be demonstrated reason for cost difference one consumer to next. Laws against restraint of trade, such items as medical boards, mandatory use AMA trademarked coding - basically rules preventing competition within a given industry or service.

On top of federal criminal and civil laws there are similar state laws as well as a plethora of civil consumer protection laws that are applicable.

Estimates I've seen say medical industry would shrink from near 19% GDP back to decades long historical cost of 3% GDP - that's an 80% drop in cost.

Up until 30 years ago 3% GDP was medical cost.

It rose in lockstep with popularity of health insurance and corporatizing of all thing medical.

Why no application of the law ?

Medical Industry lobbing and political donations are second to top of list for politicians.

They buy protection - simple as that !

When public stops red herring of complaining for more insurance or flat out government coverage and start loudly and frequently call for laws be enforced is day we start seeing real action on affordable healthcare.

All else is folly.

Phoenix

a reply to: carewemust

Control the prices of Big Pharma - bar none.

No way they need the prices they're asking for the drugs they provide.

originally posted by: seasonal
a reply to: carewemust

But the reason it is so expensive is because it cost so much. The medical industry charges the US too much.

Medicare and Medicaid force the entire medical community to accept lower pay for treating those patients. What do you think the ramifications would be for Americans if the entire country was placed on Medicare or Medicaid? Better or worse than what we have now...and for whom?

a reply to: iWontGiveUP

Health Insurance companies do profit, but since 2012, their profits are artificially capped at 15% and 20% by the Medical Loss Ratio rule of ObamaCare.

www.cms.gov...

a reply to: Abysha

Nationalization is worth a try. President Trump is all for it.

But unfortunately, Americans are not ready for it yet. There's not enough anger, by enough people... not yet.

IMO its a universal health care system (like automobile) But not socialized. Everyone has to buy insurance to lower the pool cost, but nonprofit (unlike auto insurance) agencies compete against each other in the free market. Same for drug manufactures. Nonprofit. No wall street unless they are enhancement type industries.

I don't think it will change any time soon there. The whole system would need revamping, lawyers, changes it would be a big change for a lot of companies I would think.

a reply to: CriticalStinker

Those are good, productive ideas CriticalStinker. As you say, it will take time to see results, but SOMETHING meaningful needs to be done soon!

Given the source, I question the stated motivation, but Chicago metro is rolling out a tax on July 1st that penalizes people who buy soda pop, and other beverages containing sugar.

""That 2-liter of pop you're picking up for the Fourth of July picnic might pack a little sticker shock this year as Cook County rolls out a new penny-per-ounce tax on a wide variety of sugar- and artificially sweetened beverages.
As one example, a 2-liter bottle, which usually costs about $1, will incur a 67-cent soda tax.

The first year, this tax is expected to generate an additional $224 million in revenue for Cook county.""

Source: www.chicagotribune.com...

a reply to: dasman888

Karl, is that you?

For those that don't know or been told otherwise the medical industry has no, nada, zip immunity from antitrust laws NONE!

Two SCOTUS cases say so.

It's paid off politicians helping to financially gang rape you.

originally posted by: roadgravel
It's called greed and overpaid management. It's US business today and it won't be addressed because too many like it this way.

Your sentiment about the healthcare system is exactly how I feel about the upcoming Tax Reform battle. Too many like the way it is now, because 45% of Americans pay $0 Federal Income tax.

Source: www.marketwatch.com...

And many more already pay less than the 15% flat-rate that President Trump wants to implement.

originally posted by: carewemust
a reply to: Abysha

Nationalization is worth a try. President Trump is all for it.

But unfortunately, Americans are not ready for it yet. There's not enough anger, by enough people... not yet.

Not just no but hell no, on any form single payer and yes been plenty angry for last 10 years.

Do you ever read projections on where these program costs are going in near future.

And you want to make it a government monopoly.

The cost are going overtake Federal budget in 4 to 6 years definitely no more than 8 and that's your solution?

What chu smokin?

You work insurance/medical by chance? If so disclosure is warranted.

originally posted by: lordcomac


You want to lower the cost of health Care, start by educating people on how badly they are screwed by insurance.
Then, ban insurance.

Any doctor only in it for the money will quit- which is for the best, since they are the ones buying stock in big pharma then pushing their crap.

Costs will self regulate, and become affordable as a mechanic.

Most surgeries and cancer treatments will never become as affordable as a mechanic, LordComac.

How about simply making sure that everyone gets a catastrophic umbrella policy, if they work, or have assets? The way the law stands, hospitals and doctors can recover what they're owed from your current/future income and assets.

a reply to: dasman888


DasMan888, your explanation and solution make a lot of sense, on the surface. I'll have to dig deeper into this "Price Discovery" term you used. Thanks.

originally posted by: Gothmog
Stop lobbyists and cronyism ? Term limits. And get rid of the Old Boys Gang .

Term Limits already exist. If, you don't like your guy/gal, vote him or her out of office.

originally posted by: dasman888
a reply to: Abysha

Abysha... actually... that's not correct. The common denominator of country's with National Healthcare is price discovery.

WITHOUT dealing with medical monopolies... all single payer does is make corporations wealthy off of taxpayer money. The nation still goes bankrupt in 3 to 5 years, crushed underneath the costs of medicine.

Insurance shenanigans is a symptom of monopoly medicine. Unless there is competition in pricing for medical care... all you are doing is moving the grotesque costs from the right pocket to the left pocket.

Dealing with the racketeering and price fixing, however, will IMMEDIATELY lower the cost of medicine across the board by 70 to 80%. THEN we might even be able to have single payer.

The ONLY reason the countries with national health insurance haven't bankrupted themselves is because they have PRICE DISCOVERY.

Please folks... whether you believe in "free markets" or "national healthcare", understand this, and spread the word.

If any of us ran a retail business that refused to tell people IN ADVANCE... what our "product" was going to cost the consumer... we would be shut down and prosecuted for racketeering... and we'd STILL be in prison!

It's TIME to enforce EXISTING monopoly laws... other wise... the Democrats or Republicans "health care fix" is just rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

Exactly. The market is set up so there is no price discovery. What is odd though is that we know it works because prices are fairly cheap in the elective healthcare markets. You look at stuff like plastic surgery, lasik, infertility, etc. The market is robust and prices get cheaper all the time while quality goes up because Doctors are actually competing like in a normal market. Insurance typically does not pay for these procedures so you have essentially cash buyers. When someone is paying out of pocket, they have an incentive to care about the cost. The doctors also have to tell the purchaser upfront what it costs. They also develop payment plans, etc.

originally posted by: carewemust

originally posted by: Gothmog
Stop lobbyists and cronyism ? Term limits. And get rid of the Old Boys Gang .

Term Limits already exist. If, you don't like your guy/gal, vote him or her out of office.

Its the gang of idiots that override my vote
Next...

a reply to: Phoenix


Phoenix, I've followed your posts on this subject for a long time. You definitely understand the industry, and what ails it.

When the medical system is on the verge of collapsing, do you think existing laws will ultimately be enforced, rather than the country moving to Nationalized Healthcare?

originally posted by: silo13
a reply to: carewemust

Control the prices of Big Pharma - bar none.

No way they need the prices they're asking for the drugs they provide.

That would seem to be an obvious top priority for the people we elect to office, wouldn't it? Unfortunately, polls indicate that not enough people are hurt by high drug prices to get their attention.

a reply to: carewemust

The Hospital that takes no insurance whatsoever manages to make a profit, pay it's surgeons and staff handsomely and has fewer patient complications AT HALF THE COST - a fixed flat fee cost to boot.

With more competition that direction costs would naturally be even lower.

Many of those surgeries are within means of normal Americans.

Surgery Center of Oklahoma to wit.

Folks pointing out the unholy alliance of government/corporate/doctor/hospital consortium are entirely correct.

And you want to institutionalize and make legal the crime by government sanction.

Sheesh