Battleships

originally posted by: seagull
Ol' Adolph was convinced if big was good, super colossal was better.

I can't help but wonder if he was making up for a lack somewhere else??

But some of those studies were rather impressive. Useless, but impressive.

I'm sure there was a major inferiority issue considering the magnitude of some of the structures he wanted Speer to construct as well. The studies themselves were interesting and there are also tank studies for builds of equally mammoth proportion compared to contemporary units.

BBV-74, USS Imperia

originally posted by: eriktheawful
a reply to: crazyewok

While it might be fun to imagine some sort of battleship, WW2 pretty much showed that the BB went the way of the Dodo.

As I said in the OP i realise that.

This thread is just imagining

originally posted by: seagull
a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

Ol' Adolph was convinced if big was good, super colossal was better.

I can't help but wonder if he was making up for a lack somewhere else??

But some of those studies were rather impressive. Useless, but impressive.

Look up Landkreuzer P. 15000. He definitely had some insecuritys with the size of something hahaha

Poor albert speer had a right old job of going round trying to cancel Hitlers crazy projects without him knowing!

a reply to: seagull

I've seen the turret. It was at China Lake. They built the turret to test the 16 inch guns during WWII. The French gave us some Exocets during the Falklands War. The Navy did extensive testing on them. One of the results of that testing was the Phalanx CIWS. I'm inclined to believe the story. We did some other testing, but, I'm not allowed to go into that.

As the old WW2 saying goes, a battleship can shell targets 20 miles away, an aircraft carrier can bomb targets 200 miles away.

Actually the Ruskies have the modern battleship the Kirov class battlecruiser, it's main weapons aren't guns but anti ship missiles.

en.wikipedia.org...

A modern Battleship could be build with nuke power plant, two rail guns. two 16 inch guns with modern powder not black powder like the Iowa class firing saboted 12 inch Long Range Land Attack Projectile (LRLAP) out of the 16 inch guns.
en.wikipedia.org...
or a 12 inch Ballistic Trajectory Extended Range Munition
en.wikipedia.org...

Plus a modern battleship could be armored not with solid steel but with lighter weight M1 abrams tank type Chobham armour.
en.wikipedia.org...
Test of a iowa class turret hit with a anti ship missile was not knocked out and the crew would have survived.

It would also have a number of vertical launching system (VLS) boxes with a large number of missiles

navy one - behold our new mega battleship

all other navies - behold our new nuclear payload torpedoes

a reply to: ANNED
VLS yes, but not in large box cells. That idea is being moved away from due to a perceived weakness of clustering munitions together. The idea now is to have single rows of VLS around the perimeter of the hull and engineered so that should a munition fail or be struck and either the rocket booster or warhead cook off it will vent harmlessly through the side of the hull and not into the other launch tubes.

a reply to: thebozeian

Ideally I think a battleship should be able to replenish it's own armament underway. A feat most missile armed ships can't achieve.

a reply to: JIMC5499

I remember taking a tour of the uss iowa in long beach.

While on the tour i saw a few little red arrows painted on the superstructure near the battle bridge.

So i ask the guy giving the tour. What are those arrows. He respinds with those are all the enemy artillary rounds that score direct hits on the iowa.

So i squint and look closely and notice little softball sized dents no more than a inch or so deep. The one on the port battlebridge is just above the hatch to enter the bridge. The guy said some sailor popped the hatch sprayed a few meters of the deck with a hand held fire extinguisher then went back inside. That was the worst an enemy could do to her.

The armor is something like 26 inches of solid steel. Hard to fathom until you walk through the bulkead doors and see with your own eyes.

a reply to: BASSPLYR

The North Carolina is an amazing ship as well. The superstructure feels like it just keeps getting higher and higher like a disney castle. The sheer size of those turrets and their mass is impressive. There's no question that if modern gunboats were built like that it would still take an incredible investment most navies couldn't make to sink her. As other navies start bringing on kinetic energy weapons and other high range artillery there could be a renaissance in ships armor in the near future.

My Dad was at the Inchon landings in Korea and took pictures of the cruisers and Battleships blasting broadsides at the Norks.
One the 5 inch twin turret guns on his ship was credited with a hole-in-one through the open hatch of a NK tank.
As a kid I must have built over 100 ship models, I designed new ones as well as tanks and planes. It was endlessly fascinating until I discovered girls. Oh well.

Eta: The day of the battleships is over, too much investment sunk too easily. They were glorious in their day and I wonder who would have won in a slug fest between the Bismarck and one of the Iowa class?

a reply to: Caughtlurking

I had a 7" record of the story of the North Carolina which I think we picked up while touring the ship. Is it docked in Wilmington? Can't remember that detail.

a reply to: Asktheanimals

Iowa class. They had longer range guns and radar fire control.

a reply to: JIMC5499

Germans had the best optical sights (as proved on the Hood) and probably the finest crew to man a BB.
It was by sheer luck a torpedo damaged the rudder otherwise I think the Bismarck would have made it to Brest.
I think it would be one helluva fight.

a reply to: JIMC5499

Not only did the Iowa class have the range and fire control. They were also much more maneuverable and faster.

The long narrow bow of the Iowa's were designed that way to out run and manuever against the japanese behemoths.

a reply to: Asktheanimals

No argument about the optics, but, the best optics in the world are not going to do you any good when your opponent can hit you from 24 miles while you can only shoot 22.7 miles.

a reply to: JIMC5499

Very true plus the Iowa could shoot n scoot. The Bismarck would have a tough time keeping a bead on her and landing any good shots.

Think Muhammad Ali vs some big fat dude. Hes goung to dance arpund him and land a knock out shot.

originally posted by: BASSPLYR
The armor is something like 26 inches of solid steel. Hard to fathom until you walk through the bulkead doors and see with your own eyes.

The side armor is 17", the turrets and barbettes are thicker.

I have my old man's cruise log from the Missouri somewhere. He did five years in the Navy and was on all four of those battleships.