What Level Of Skill Was Required To Fly A Plane Into The Pentagon ?

originally posted by: Blue_Jay33


Source please

Signed off to fly Boeing 737.

Naw, just an application....no hours in type yet.....

Someone's just filled in a 216 rating app with his bits of ID and snapped a screenshot

originally posted by: GBP/JPY
Naw, just an application....no hours in type yet.....

Someone's just filled in a 216 rating app with his bits of ID and snapped a screenshot

You can type in his info yourself on the the FAA Airmen Inquiry Search Page.

amsrvs.registry.faa.gov...


This is what you get:




Commercial rating.

a reply to: GBP/JPY

Thank you for verifying what i watched on live tv. I dont know why they denied it at the time, they were covering something up.

originally posted by: Blue_Jay33
a reply to: neutronflux

One of the terrorists aboard flight 77 had a FAA commercial pilots license.

Source please

Seems your question was answered.
A fact that has been known and cited for years.

Now explain how the crew and passengers of flight 77 ended up dead at the pentagon, explain what remains were released.

Now discredited the in flight account of a pilot that radioed in real time seeing a large jet hit the pentagon.

Discredit the 100 plus witnesses than give an account of a large commercial jet hitting the pentagon.

Discredit air traffic controller's accounts, radar data, and FRD data.

Form rebuttals to the works cited that shows a large jet hitting the pentagon is the only rational and evidence based account of what happen at the pentagon

a reply to: GBP/JPY

All you have is low resolution camera footage from bad angles, and a confused news crew?

Ever explain how a missle or bomb would result in so little of the interior of the pentagon on the front lawn.

Its been explained the bulk of the wreckage was pushed into the pentagon.

Please cite or link the dimensions of the entrance hole, and what produced those demolitions.

originally posted by: neutronflux

originally posted by: Blue_Jay33
a reply to: neutronflux

One of the terrorists aboard flight 77 had a FAA commercial pilots license.

Source please

Seems your question was answered.
A fact that has been known and cited for years.

Now explain how the crew and passengers of flight 77 ended up dead at the pentagon, explain what remains were released.

Now discredited the in flight account of a pilot that radioed in real time seeing a large jet hit the pentagon.

Discredit the 100 plus witnesses than give an account of a large commercial jet hitting the pentagon.

Discredit air traffic controller's accounts, radar data, and FRD data.

Form rebuttals to the works cited that shows a large jet hitting the pentagon is the only rational and evidence based account of what happen at the pentagon

I still want to know where that Russ bloke got his g numbers from

a reply to: GBP/JPY

Can you at least see if the broadcast has been archived and posted on the internet.

Provide a link for a point of reference to create a common point for debate.

And would like to hear your rebuttals to works cited proving a large commercial jet hit the pentagon. And cited works that shows there is no proof for the bomb, missile, and fly over theories.

a reply to: mrthumpy

I will reframe from saying which body part it was pulled out of.

I do find it strange the g force numbers look similar to the referenced g force figures given to show it would be impossible for flight 77 to pull out of the dive for the fly over theory.

I wonder if individuals get confused between the two?

As in the actual flight 77 path vs the impossible maneuver to pull out of the dive for the fly over theory.

a reply to: neutronflux

You manage to bring up questions that only the architects of a conspiracy can answer, or you just believe the story as told with the facts they want you to know given. There in lies the problem.

We are all experts at something in our lives. Could be chess, poker, baseball, engineering, or even aviation.

If you were to tell me, for example, that a person who has had 3 years of training in swimming with the goal of reaching the Olympics and winning a gold medal, I might say "That's great!", but I would never in a million years believe that person could accomplish that at the highest level.

I would have to see it to believe it as I am an expert swimmer and in spite my years of efforts could never approach that highest level. You get my drift.

Now if you were to tell my good friend, an expert pilot with 30 years of experience that a sub-standard pilot who failed or dropped out of multiple flight schools and could not get a pilot job in his native country managed to fly into the pentagon, he'd have to see it to believe it, but until then it is seemingly impossible.

There are videos of the event. None have been released, unless you count the explosion, but that did not clarify anything. It actually raises more doubt to the events as described by officials.

Yes, in relative terms the is BIG. The plane, in relative terms is BIG. It does not change the fact that the skill of said pilot does not match the capabilities of what has been suggested occurred.

All of this could be cleared up by officials releasing actual video of the approach and incident, which again, do exist.

Once that is seen all of your questions will be answered. Until then your questions cannot be answered effectively.

I had a feeling you were one of those conspiracists! Trying to act sort of impartial, but go irrational when evidence is cited contradicting your faith in conspiracy.

originally posted by: m1kelowry
a reply to: neutronflux

Now if you were to tell my good friend, an expert pilot with 30 years of experience that a sub-standard pilot who failed or dropped out of multiple flight schools and could not get a pilot job in his native country managed to fly into the pentagon, he'd have to see it to believe it, but until then it is seemingly impossible.

www.911myths.com...

In 1996, Hanjour returned to the United States to pursue flight training,after being rejected by a Saudi flight school. He checked out flight schools in Florida, California, and Arizona; and he briefly started at a couple of them before returning to Saudi Arabia. In 1997, he returned to Florida and then, along with two friends, went back to Arizona and began his flight training there in earnest. After about three months, Hanjour was able to obtain his private pilot's license. Several more months of training yielded him a commercial pilot certificate, issued by the Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) in April 1999... Settling in Mesa, Hanjour began refresher training at his old school,Arizona Aviation. He wanted to train on multi-engine planes, but had difficulties because his English was not good enough.The instructor advised him to discontinue but Hanjour said he could not go home without completing the training. In early 2001, he started training on a Boeing 737 simulator at Pan Am International Flight Academy in Mesa.An instructor there found his work well below standard and discouraged him from continuing.Again, Hanjour persevered; he completed the initial training by the end of March 2001.
Page 225/227, 9/11 Commission Report

It seems Hanjour problems with piloting were from his difficulties from learning English.

Hanjour rented planes often. The time he was declined from renting a plane was for a flight in a busy air corridor.

www.911myths.com...

Chevrette said that the school's student, Hani Hanjour, lacked adequate English skills to gain his pilot's license. An FAA official responded to her concerns by suggesting that Hanjour could use an interpreter even though mastery of English is a requirement for a pilot.
Chevrette said that when the Sept. 11 attacks occurred, she knew Hanjour must have been involved.
"I remember crying all the way to work knowing our company helped to do this," she said.
Chevrette said that Hanjour's English was so bad that it took him eight hours to complete an oral exam that should've taken two hours.
CBS News

www.911myths.com...

And as Marcel Bernard pointed out, the hijackers wouldn't have required all the skills of a regular pilot:
"Despite Hanjour's poor reviews, he did have some ability as a pilot, said Bernard of Freeway Airport. "There's no doubt in my mind that once that [hijacked jet] got going, he could have pointed that plane at a building and hit it," he said" www.pentagonresearch.com...

So, you cannot cite if your friend is referring to the false narrative in that all the flight 77 maneuvers were conducted at full throttle

A view by your fried that is not a consensus among pilots, aerospace engineers, nor Hanjour's instructors?

Can you state what your friend claims using the actual facts of the flight. Flight 77 overshot the pentagon, which is a common procedure for conducting a landing with no control tower. The 300 degree turn that was between 200 and 300 knots. A turn with a five mile radius over 2 minutes. Only once flight 77 was lined up, were the throttles brought up to full. The target 70 feet tall and bigger than 24 football fields.

Flight recorder data shows no indication the flight was precise, and shows the pilot having trouble at the controls.

Please state the schools Hanjour' failed. He did have a private pilot's license.

Did Hanjour "dropout" or just jump schools as he moved around.

Quote from you...

There are videos of the event. None have been released, unless you count the explosion, but that did not clarify anything. It actually raises more doubt to the events as described by officials.

A total false statement. You really have no credibility? It is obvious you have not taken the time to study this thread, works cited, and only listen to the false claims by conspiracists.

www.judicialwatch.org...

Judicial Watch v. Federal Bureau of Investigation (No.06-1135)

November 11, 2011
Judicial Watch lawsuit to obtain previously unseen footage of Flight 77 striking the Pentagon on September 11, 2001.Judicial Watch filed a Freedom of Information Act request on December 15, 2004, seeking all records pertaining to camera recordings from the Sheraton National Hotel, the Nexcomm/Citgo gas station, Pentagon security cameras and the Virginia Department of Transportation.On May 16, 2006, Judicial Watch forced the Department of Defense to release video footage of American Airlines flight 77 crashing into the Pentagon on 9/11. The videos had been kept secret by the DoD until Judicial Watch filed the FOIA request and, eventually, a lawsuit stating that the DoD had “no legal basis” to refuse release of the footage. On September 15, 2006, Judicial Watch released videos from the CITGO gas station near the Pentagon, which was released by the FBI in response to the FOIA request.Judicial Watch is committed to completing the public record of the 9/11 attacks.

Bringing Closure to the 9/11 Pentagon Debate
www.911truth.org...

There is no evidence at this time that the government is withholding other images of the event captured by the surveillance cameras.

More time wasted by me correcting what an open minded research of flight 77 should reveal. Now my dinner is cold....

Well that is interesting, but he was never a good pilot in fact,
He traveled to Saudi Arabia to get a job working with Saudi Arabian Airlines as a commercial pilot but was rejected by a civil aviation school in Jeddah.

So yeah even if somebody signed off on his licence, his worth as a pilot is well known.

Stop trying to pump him up as an ace pilot that could pull this off, if there is one thing I am sure of is that he couldn't do it, he never had the talent.

a reply to: Blue_Jay33

What was the maneuvers that Hanjour couldn't preform?

I am not making the claim he didn't have the skills to crash into a building larger than 24 football fields.

It seems Marcel Bernard, chief flight instructor at Freeway Airport in Bowie thought Hanjour could crash into the pentagon.

Again, there is no proof of impossible maneuvers. There is no consensus among pilots, aerospace engineers, and Hanjour's instructors that the maneuvers were impossible, nor Hanjour didn't have the skills to crash.


Do you have a rational rebuttal? Or do just want to keep spewing false arguments?


Title: Md. was among last stops for hijackers
www.baltimoresun.com...

"It's almost a curse," said Marcel Bernard, chief flight instructor at Freeway Airport in Bowie, where the hijacker pilot of Flight 77 went up a few times with instructors. "It's haunting in a way, to always have to think about this."

-break-

Bernard has told the story maybe 100 times, he says, to the FBI and myriad federal agencies, to the news media, to curious flight students and the occasional 9/11 conspiracy theorist.

Hani Hanjour came to Freeway Airport and asked to rent a plane. He went up with two flight instructors on three occasions, but Bernard eventually refused to rent him a plane because he barely spoke English - a requirement for flight certifications - and because of his poor flying skills.

Funny how conspiracists ignore the English part. A truth movement that only tells half the truth. What a joke!

www.newsline.umd.edu...

Freeway Airport evaluated suspected hijacker Hani Hanjour when he attempted to rent a plane. He took three flights with the instructors in the second week of August, but flew so poorly he was rejected for the rental, said Marcel Bernard, chief flight instructor at Freeway.

The standard evaluation consists of one- to one-and-a-half-hour flights east over the Chesapeake Bay area. Hanjour paid $400 cash and provided a valid pilot's license from Arizona, Bernard said. He failed because he showed problems landing the airplane, and the flight instructor had to help him, Bernard said.

But Hanjour's problems were nothing unusual, Bernard said. "At the time, he didn't raise any red flags," he said. "He never did get angry or make any unusual statements."

web.archive.org...://www.newsday.com/ny-usflight232380680sep23.story

Despite Hanjour's poor reviews, he did have some ability as a pilot, said Bernard of Freeway Airport. "There's no doubt in my mind that once that [hijacked jet] got going, he could have pointed that plane at a building and hit it," he said.

a reply to: Blue_Jay33

I still don't see the 'ace' part of his flight.

He flew VFR on a clear calm day, did a (very rough) wide turn at 42deg max bank and managed to hit one of the world's largest single buildings. I don't think he was too concerned about passenger comfort or spilling drinks.

a reply to: Blue_Jay33

if there is one thing I am sure of is that he couldn't do it, he never had the talent.

That is the opinion of one layman.
That is not the opinion of the experts.

Please explain how the bodies of the passengers ended up inside the Pentagon.

Naw, that was high order detonation at the pentagon, with no airframe marks at all.

The smoke from an airliner would fill the sky with black for hours.

You guys......shall we give you up for having a reprobate mind?

a reply to: GBP/JPY

Random statements?

Ever going to show or link to the entrance hole of flight 77?

Why was there no interior of the pentagon on the front lawn of the pentagon.

Can you even reference the works cited and provide a rebuttal.

Going to reference confused news casts so ineffective they are ignored in whole by conspiracists except you. News casts you cannot provide a link too.

How long did the pentagon burn and how long did it smoke?

No interior of the pentagon on the front lawn equals no bomb nor missile.

Using your logic and false narrative of fire at the pentagon, I guess no fire bomb at the pentagon either.

a reply to: neutronflux

There's even video from a helicopter of the missile strike at the pentagon that has never been debunked.

a reply to: GBP/JPY

The entrance hole was small until the building collapsed, hiding that very important fact.